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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Yup truth.


    I watched several Asmongold videos, he was definitely playing up how difficult classic dungeons were and it was obvious. I wish I was wrong! I'd love difficult dungeons!
    They felt hard DURING classic when people were just learning the game. 15 years later with heroic and mythic+ dungeons having come and gone..vanilla dungeons won't be nearly as tough.

  2. #262
    Quote Originally Posted by Airblade View Post
    They felt hard DURING classic when people were just learning the game. 15 years later with heroic and mythic+ dungeons having come and gone..vanilla dungeons won't be nearly as tough.
    Yup agreed. Thought about making a thread asking people if Blizzard should up the difficulty level of classic, but didn't bother due to how limited this beta was. Might make that thread after the first couple of stress tests.

  3. #263
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    You couldn't sound any more bitter, jealous and resentful if you tried.
    That is what we call Envy, but you are on the right tack.
    Super Mario Maker 2: Maker ID 8B7-CTF-NMG

    - Smoke weed every day!

  4. #264
    Scarab Lord dacoolist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    Oh really, let's see a screenshot of your Classic character in game?

    And no it's not just one video, many people who were sceptical have admitted they were wrong to dismiss it and have been enjoying the game. For example Preach (high end raider on retail) has been making content for Classic when he said he had little interest in the past. He also admitted he was wrong on a podcast.

    Keep burying your heads in the sand, it just makes you look utterly foolish.
    For a long time - I was a majorrrrr classic hater, I wanted to see it fail super hard.. but now: I’m actually looking fwd, and I honestly can’t wait for the release. I’ll be pretty casual - but dangerous enough.

    Classic won’t technically be like how it was back in the day - but it should be decently fun for server community

  5. #265
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Yup truth.


    I watched several Asmongold videos, he was definitely playing up how difficult classic dungeons were and it was obvious. I wish I was wrong! I'd love difficult dungeons!
    Complete nonsense. I've been watching every Asmongold stream, usually when people point out all the things about Classic that are "trash" in their view he agrees. If you want to litigiously lay out all of the "problems" in Classic you can do that, and you can make yourself feel much better about not missing out, which is ultimately what all this boils down to, but what people love about Classic/old WoW doesn't boil down to a blog post. A few bitter losers on a forum aren't going to derail the hype train.

    Some people have suggested that retailers are worried that the inevitable success of Classic will somehow alter or change the way Blizz looks at live, but I don't believe that is the case because there is no way Blizz could realistically change course at this point. What the vitriol towards Classic represents is a kind of psychological salve against FOMO, if you can convince yourself that this game is trash and everyone who is looking forward to it is deluded then you don't have to confront the possibility that you are missing out on a good time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dacoolist View Post
    For a long time - I was a majorrrrr classic hater, I wanted to see it fail super hard.. but now: I’m actually looking fwd, and I honestly can’t wait for the release. I’ll be pretty casual - but dangerous enough.

    Classic won’t technically be like how it was back in the day - but it should be decently fun for server community
    Respect for having the ability and honesty to change your mind. A rare trait nowadays

  6. #266
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    You couldn't sound any more bitter, jealous and resentful if you tried.
    I have 0 feelings towards Vanilla, neither excitement, or "hate".

    I did everything Vanilla had to offer back when it was relevant, apart from a few bosses in Naxx, not because of anything because guild went "TBC announced, lets stop" mode at November.

    I am just realistic with what is going on as i am with everything in life.

    Most of the streamers are just that, putting on a facade to make money, nothing more, nothing less.

    Classic will be good for people that never did it and want to experience a bit of RPG mode from the 2000s the same way Baldur's gate and D2 is still played.

    But anyone claiming Vanilla is hard is completely delusional, the first 6 months the hard part was to finally log on after the queues and remained logged on with your 250+ms.

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by Daffan View Post
    Nah I actually hate how many classes and talents are broken as well as rotations in general in Classic, but the payoff in Classic psychologically is a 1000x better dopamine rush. That's all that matters to any 'gamer', how the game makes you feel, gameplay systems are only a means to an end and Live doesn't do it for me. Again -- because it plays itself unless you are the top 1%.

    That was basically Legion for me. Grinding M+15, only to do it again because the gear artificially inflated and the previous stuff was given out for free.
    it doesnt play itself sounds like you just werent very good lol also what the hell do you think you do at the endgame of classic? you grind for gear mats etc....same as live. yeah we have seasons now but that shouldnt be a problem because you should always strive to get better gear. thats literally the only thing that ever matters. increase your output to take down harder content. i see nothing wrong with it. people say they want a defined BIS. i see that as boring, having what is basically infinite BIS combinations depending on gear combinations makes the game more diverse instead of everyone have t1-3 and whatever went along with those BIS items. Classic was good for its time but is boring in comparison. Ive been playing since vanilla. i literally only leveled one character which has been my main since because old world quests were boring as hell, the entire run from 1-60 was boring as hell. but i did it because i wanted end game. when cata remade everything i actually found WAYYYY more enjoyable to level. everything flowed better and story was fun.

    Also Legion is to me top tier of what WoW has ever had to Offer, tying with WoTLK in #1 spot. Vanilla ranks under MoP imho. BFA gets no rating until its done and im enjoying it regardless of the issues it has which most are fixed in 8.2

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    Quote Originally Posted by potis View Post
    I have 0 feelings towards Vanilla, neither excitement, or "hate".

    I did everything Vanilla had to offer back when it was relevant, apart from a few bosses in Naxx, not because of anything because guild went "TBC announced, lets stop" mode at November.

    I am just realistic with what is going on as i am with everything in life.

    Most of the streamers are just that, putting on a facade to make money, nothing more, nothing less.

    Classic will be good for people that never did it and want to experience a bit of RPG mode from the 2000s the same way Baldur's gate and D2 is still played.

    But anyone claiming Vanilla is hard is completely delusional, the first 6 months the hard part was to finally log on after the queues and remained logged on with your 250+ms.
    oh look a person that is rational and living in reality regarding classic, its rare to see this nowadays lol everything you said is 100% true

  8. #268
    Classic was fun and I enjoyed it at the time but I don't know if I will like playing it now without all the QoL changes we have now. Plus I'm a dps shaman, how am I supposed to raid in classic.

  9. #269
    Warchief Crillam's Avatar
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    Why does this need a thread? There is NOTHING to talk about.

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    Complete nonsense. I've been watching every Asmongold stream, usually when people point out all the things about Classic that are "trash" in their view he agrees. If you want to litigiously lay out all of the "problems" in Classic you can do that, and you can make yourself feel much better about not missing out, which is ultimately what all this boils down to, but what people love about Classic/old WoW doesn't boil down to a blog post. A few bitter losers on a forum aren't going to derail the hype train.
    I'm glad there's hype, but we don't need to pretend that vanilla dungeons are harder than they are. Health bars in dungeons barely moved in the dungeon vids I watched. Asmongold kept yelling "Don't wipe! Don't wipe!" when he was nowhere near in danger of wiping.

    My issue isn't with the hype, it's bullshitting about difficulty to make the content seem harder than it is. I'm sure it's partially tongue in cheek on his part, or I hope it is, but I'm sure some people are going to watch those videos, try classic, and then wonder why the content is easier than remembered/depicted. Or they are shitty players and it's not for them. Shrug.

  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by WowClassic View Post
    Complete nonsense. I've been watching every Asmongold stream, usually when people point out all the things about Classic that are "trash" in their view he agrees. If you want to litigiously lay out all of the "problems" in Classic you can do that, and you can make yourself feel much better about not missing out, which is ultimately what all this boils down to, but what people love about Classic/old WoW doesn't boil down to a blog post. A few bitter losers on a forum aren't going to derail the hype train.

    Some people have suggested that retailers are worried that the inevitable success of Classic will somehow alter or change the way Blizz looks at live, but I don't believe that is the case because there is no way Blizz could realistically change course at this point. What the vitriol towards Classic represents is a kind of psychological salve against FOMO, if you can convince yourself that this game is trash and everyone who is looking forward to it is deluded then you don't have to confront the possibility that you are missing out on a good time.

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    Respect for having the ability and honesty to change your mind. A rare trait nowadays
    sounds like you're the deluded one with a username like WoWClassic.

  12. #272
    Herald of the Titans Daffan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodykiller86 View Post
    it doesnt play itself sounds like you just werent very good lol also what the hell do you think you do at the endgame of classic? you grind for gear mats etc....same as live. yeah we have seasons now but that shouldnt be a problem because you should always strive to get better gear. thats literally the only thing that ever matters. increase your output to take down harder content. i see nothing wrong with it. people say they want a defined BIS. i see that as boring, having what is basically infinite BIS combinations depending on gear combinations makes the game more diverse instead of everyone have t1-3 and whatever went along with those BIS items. Classic was good for its time but is boring in comparison. Ive been playing since vanilla. i literally only leveled one character which has been my main since because old world quests were boring as hell, the entire run from 1-60 was boring as hell. but i did it because i wanted end game. when cata remade everything i actually found WAYYYY more enjoyable to level. everything flowed better and story was fun.
    Classic: You play the game until you get to the end of the content. Simple.

    If your a casual in Legion, the game advances at a pace that gives you free gear and invalidates content. If you don't do content in the patch it released in, you are screwed. It becomes obsolete next patch.

    That's lame to me. Chasing gear for the sake of item level is a pointless and stupid endeavor, seeing the content is much more important.

    The only real-real problem with Classic is that it ends eventually.
    Content drought is a combination of catchup mechanics and no new content.
    Classic+ Retune/New Boss Abilities >>> #nochanges crowd

  13. #273
    Scarab Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    I'm glad there's hype, but we don't need to pretend that vanilla dungeons are harder than they are. Health bars in dungeons barely moved in the dungeon vids I watched. Asmongold kept yelling "Don't wipe! Don't wipe!" when he was nowhere near in danger of wiping.

    My issue isn't with the hype, it's bullshitting about difficulty to make the content seem harder than it is. I'm sure it's partially tongue in cheek on his part, or I hope it is, but I'm sure some people are going to watch those videos, try classic, and then wonder why the content is easier than remembered/depicted. Or they are shitty players and it's not for them. Shrug.
    I mean, we do not need to look any further than this very forum, where we have a thread about dungeons being "too easy". People have built up an image of this incredibly challenging game in their mind, except the reality itself disagrees with them. There are threads on reddit where people are trying to prove that stuff is too easy - which can only be possible if Blizzard messed up. There are ocassional bugs, sure, but overall, people are desperate to convince others just how hard Vanilla was - and thus how much better players they are by playing Classic. Streamers simply go along with this. They are entertainers and hyping otherwise mundane stuff is what they do.

    That's not to say they are faking their enjoyment, but really, video game streams/let's plays are always more hyper and filled with overreaction. It's why we cannot accurately judge how successful Classic is until it actually releases and couple months pass - so the honeymoon period is over.
    Last edited by KaPe; 2019-05-21 at 10:11 PM.

  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    I'm glad there's hype, but we don't need to pretend that vanilla dungeons are harder than they are. Health bars in dungeons barely moved in the dungeon vids I watched. Asmongold kept yelling "Don't wipe! Don't wipe!" when he was nowhere near in danger of wiping.

    My issue isn't with the hype, it's bullshitting about difficulty to make the content seem harder than it is. I'm sure it's partially tongue in cheek on his part, or I hope it is, but I'm sure some people are going to watch those videos, try classic, and then wonder why the content is easier than remembered/depicted. Or they are shitty players and it's not for them. Shrug.
    By no means saying these are original thoughts, but even if boss/dungeon mechanics aren't as difficult as retail, there are still a number of factors that will make Classic interesting:

    1) A lot of Classic dungeons/raids were about the journey to get there --> i.e getting all the keys to 5 man dungeons, Onyxia attunement questline, MC attunement questline, LBRS to make the key to UBRS to BWL attunement, the AQ collection effort, the Argent Dawn grind for Naxx access.

    2) The gating inside the dungeons - Aqual/Eternal Quintessence, Onyxia Cloaks

    3) A completely different approach to classes that are not homogenized and maximizing their potential in raiding and pvp

    4) Gearing (defense caps, resistance gear), mana management and utilizing a spell rank system, dps having to strictly monitor their threat levels

    Again not saying it puts Classic on par with Retail with regards to difficulty, but it will be a change of pace for many players and definitely makes gameplay interesting and more worthwhile (imho).

  15. #275
    Quote Originally Posted by Smashbrown View Post
    By no means saying these are original thoughts, but even if boss/dungeon mechanics aren't as difficult as retail, there are still a number of factors that will make Classic interesting:

    1) A lot of Classic dungeons/raids were about the journey to get there --> i.e getting all the keys to 5 man dungeons, Onyxia attunement questline, MC attunement questline, LBRS to make the key to UBRS to BWL attunement, the AQ collection effort, the Argent Dawn grind for Naxx access.

    2) The gating inside the dungeons - Aqual/Eternal Quintessence, Onyxia Cloaks

    3) A completely different approach to classes that are not homogenized and maximizing their potential in raiding and pvp

    4) Gearing (defense caps, resistance gear), mana management and utilizing a spell rank system, dps having to strictly monitor their threat levels

    Again not saying it puts Classic on par with Retail with regards to difficulty, but it will be a change of pace for many players and definitely makes gameplay interesting and more worthwhile (imho).
    Yeah I do not think difficulty level necessarily equates with how enjoyable the overall experience will be (at least, not for everyone), just addressing difficulty level specifically since that aspect of classic has been notable in the beta streams.

  16. #276
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Yeah I do not think difficulty level necessarily equates with how enjoyable the overall experience will be (at least, not for everyone), just addressing difficulty level specifically since that aspect of classic has been notable in the beta streams.
    You mean the lvl 30 dungeons that people are running in gear that a normal person leveling in vanilla wouldnt even have close to are easy, imagine that lol.

    Im not saying these were ever hard but keep some perspective on what is being discussed. There are still going to be a ton of wipes in classic in strat/scholo/dire maul etc same as 2006. That is also another thing to keep in mind, these dungeons are going to be easier than 2004 with all the gear available from later patches.

  17. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by Fascinate View Post
    If you would could you humor me for a second? There are a fair number of people out there like you that seemingly want classic to fail, could you go over the reasons as to why? Im not judging or anything like that, im genuinely curious. The best i can come up with in my head is a couple reasons:

    1. You are a retail player and are worried that classic will either lower the current population of WoW meaning you have less people to play with, or maybe you think its possible that classic development is taking resources away from retail?
    2. You dont have time to play a game like classic anymore, but deep down know you would have fun if you did.

    If its something else feel free to enlighten us, i just would like to understand a bit more of peoples viewpoints on this.
    TBH it doesn't matter. The guy you replied to was right, this thread is about one guy.

    As for his other parts about naysayers... I don't know why you said 'people like you'. I'm curious why you think he's a naysayer, considering he said nothing to indicate so. So asking him for his 'naysaying opinion' is folly, you've associated him as a naysayer for simply for exposing the OP generalizing all Naysayers through one guy's opinion video.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2019-05-22 at 12:11 AM.

  18. #278
    For dungeon difficulty, I’ve steamrolled dungeons and I’ve had dungeons take hours, it all depends on group comp, gear, skill, and how much you outlevel the content. Sfk takes 45 minutes tops when you have all 25s with a mage and 2 rogues with blue weps and a warr tank with blues, but that same dungeon can take well over an hour with multiple wipes when you’re all 22-23 with a pally tank and hybrid dps classes who don’t know how to off heal or grab aggro in a pinch. Group comp and levels play a bigger part honestly than anything in vanilla leveling dungeons, if you have a mage for CC and you are at the max of the level range then you’re likely gonna completely roflstomp it.

  19. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by Daffan View Post
    The only real-real problem with Classic is that it ends eventually.
    I don't think that's a problem at all, it allows players to gear their characters in BiS and they remain that way. Adds purpose to the gear grind that is removed when new expansions replace your purples with questing greens.

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by Askyl View Post
    I'm quite sure the majority can find time to play. Everyone I know that is an adult, both with or without family, have a lot of time they spend on hobbies. Gaming, cars, gardening or whatever they want. I dunno, we might just be superior in Sweden ^^
    Or your close relations can do that. What I mentioned is the average. If you have enough samples eventually you'll reach the Law of Averages and in that some is one the high end and others are on the low end.

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