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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    thats literally a non-issue, what thematic and culturual ties the void elves had with night elves? none apart from being "elves"




    the pushback become meaningless with their sucees



    why thy would not want more females? those were the most "desirable" treasures of lei-shen, but somehow they didn't want create more?
    1. That's why i said nelfs were cheated. If you don't think the remaining allied races have to be tied to an existing race, why even post in a thread about finding ones that fit Worgen/Forsaken?

    2. Subjective Disagreement.

    3. Any number of reason 'Because back then it was an emperor only thing, mogu used to be sexist but now they're changing, because this clan we've never heard of still does female bodies but it was just out of style with others' literally any excuse works, Blizz just didn't have a female model at launch.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post

    Dreven was killing Forsaken sailors for an easy meal.
    And you think Sylvanas cares why?
    Twas brillig

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    And you think Sylvanas cares why?
    Doesn't matter what you or i think. Apparently Dreven himself thinks Slyvanus would care. That's why he planned to blame the Alliance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Given how they can't post as much because they keep getting banned, I'd say if anyone's spazzing out, it'd be them.
    Quote Originally Posted by sillag View Post
    im not saying all blood elf fans are weird edgelord neo-nazis

    but all weird edgelord neo-nazis in wow are blood elf rpers

  3. #183
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post
    I was talking about a hypotheical scenario in which more San'layn join the Horde but kill horde members to feed on in secret. You think the Horde wouldn't find out eventually? Nothing to do with the Alliance talking about Dreven. As for the Horde finding out about Dreven. All they have to do is find the ship and see the Forsaken sailors drained of all blood.
    In which case the San'layn that betrayed the Horde would be killed, that doesn't impact the playable character.

    Dreven's boat was sinking, I think its going to be hard to find a sunken horde ship and the drained bodies at the bottom of the ocean.

    Fighting on the frontlines of conflicts is "security"? Why join a large faction at war with another large faction if your goal is "security"? With how San'layn are characterized i don't see them giving a damn about anything but drinking blood.
    The same reason the Nightborne joined the Horde, there is risk in joining a war but with one faction on your side both sides won't be pulling at you, in the San'layn case, both sides wont have them as KoS.

    Thing is playable vampiric elves already exist. Chronicles describes the Void as such: "This was the Void, a dark and vampiric force driven to devour all energy,". Shadow priests have an ability called Vampiric embrace and a talent literally called "San'layn". The vampiric dark elf motif is already taken by Void elves.
    That's a preeeeety hard stretch. Blood death knights are closer to vampires than void elves, and of course literal vampires are the vampire motif, not the emo void elves. The same exact argument could have been made for void elves in general, no need for them to exsist when there are shadow priests, no need for demon hunters to exist with demonology warlocks. Void elves are about as vampiric as "my immortal" that is to say not at all, outside of the entropic energy that could be described as vampiric, same thing with void energy.
    Last edited by Friendlyimmolation; 2019-05-24 at 06:00 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post
    Doesn't matter what you or i think. Apparently Dreven himself thinks Slyvanus would care. That's why he planned to blame the Alliance.
    So did Sylv ever even find out?
    Twas brillig

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    So did Sylv ever even find out?
    Nope, since you kill him right after. But Sylv clearly didn't trust them or hire them as reliable enforcers, they were just put under the regular chain of command with Rokhan in charge to test them.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    The same reason the Nightborne joined the Horde, there is risk in joining a war but with one faction on your side both sides won't be pulling at you, in the San'layn case, both sides wont have them as KoS.
    You really believe that the Alliance or the Horde would have attacked the Nightborne if they had stayed neutral?

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    You really believe that the Alliance or the Horde would have attacked the Nightborne if they had stayed neutral?
    Not attacked per se, but coerced. Suramar is weakened, but has great potential, and is new in modern Azeroth.
    Joining the Horde was a willing pre-emptive decision, before others would make that decision for them.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Not attacked per se, but coerced. Suramar is weakened, but has great potential, and is new in modern Azeroth.
    Joining the Horde was a willing pre-emptive decision, before others would make that decision for them.
    I just don't see either faction going out of their way to force that decision. And if anything, a proactive Alliance could have devastated the Nightborne if it so chose (as could of course the Horde).

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    In which case the San'layn that betrayed the Horde would be killed, that doesn't impact the playable character.

    Dreven's boat was sinking, I think its going to be hard to find a sunken horde ship and the drained bodies at the bottom of the ocean.



    The same reason the Nightborne joined the Horde, there is risk in joining a war but with one faction on your side both sides won't be pulling at you, in the San'layn case, both sides wont have them as KoS.



    That's a preeeeety hard stretch. Blood death knights are closer to vampires than void elves, and of course literal vampires are the vampire motif, not the emo void elves. The same exact argument could have been made for void elves in general, no need for them to exsist when there are shadow priests, no need for demon hunters to exist with demonology warlocks. Void elves are about as vampiric as "my immortal" that is to say not at all, outside of the entropic energy that could be described as vampiric, same thing with void energy.
    The Horde seemed to find Derek easy enough. Finding that boat on the bottom of the ocean would be easy.

    Pretty sure the San'layn would be safer from Horde or Alliance attacks in Northrend.

    Many would argue Void elves weren't needed as a playable race. Your Demon hunter/Shadow priest analogy makes no sense though. One comparison is a spec vs a class, the other is a spec vs a race. What happened with Demonology/Demon hunters is exactly what should have happened to Shadow/Void class.

    Void elves are vampiric by being former magic vampires who fused with a cosmic energy stated in lore to be vampiric in nature. Like you said, the drinking blood thing is already covered by blood dks. No need for another elf race. I'd be cool with playable Vrykul Vampyrs though.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    So did Sylv ever even find out?
    Nah, but she never found out about Varimathras even though he is a dreadlord and was literally her second in command. So she probably would have never learned of Dreven's betrayal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Given how they can't post as much because they keep getting banned, I'd say if anyone's spazzing out, it'd be them.
    Quote Originally Posted by sillag View Post
    im not saying all blood elf fans are weird edgelord neo-nazis

    but all weird edgelord neo-nazis in wow are blood elf rpers

  10. #190
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post
    The Horde seemed to find Derek easy enough. Finding that boat on the bottom of the ocean would be easy.


    Assuming the Horde wrote down the latitude and Longitude at the position where they kept their ships, and that the sinking ship did not roll, glide, or break apart as it sank beneath the ocean.

    If they had another risen tidesage they'd still need something that belonged to one of the crewmen to locate them. This also banks off of the Horde bothering to do this in the first place, basing this off of one would assume the Alliance telling them, its an unlikely scenario to even want them to look for that ship in the first place, finding it would be even harder.


    Pretty sure the San'layn would be safer from Horde or Alliance attacks in Northrend.

    Not if the Lich king is hunting them and trying to force them back into his forces. And we know in Chronicle he's all about keeping all the scourge under his control, he freaked outt when he realized the Val'kyr left him.


    Many would argue Void elves weren't needed as a playable race. Your Demon hunter/Shadow priest analogy makes no sense though. One comparison is a spec vs a class, the other is a spec vs a race. What happened with Demonology/Demon hunters is exactly what should have happened to Shadow/Void class.
    The point is that Blizzard isn't afraid to overlap class themes, or in this case, build a race out of a playable spec.

    Void elves are vampiric by being former magic vampires who fused with a cosmic energy stated in lore to be vampiric in nature. Like you said, the drinking blood thing is already covered by blood dks. No need for another elf race. I'd be cool with playable Vrykul Vampyrs though.
    There's being modified by an entropic energy that can be described as vampiric, and then there is being an actual vampire sucking the blood out of people. That's a niche Blizzard could carve out quite easily if they wanted.

    Nah, but she never found out about Varimathras even though he is a dreadlord and was literally her second in command. So she probably would have never learned of Dreven's betrayal.

    Unless you take Afraisbi's coke ramblings as canon and Sylvanas was just playing 4d chess with a dreadlord.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    You really believe that the Alliance or the Horde would have attacked the Nightborne if they had stayed neutral?
    No but they would have had to deal with both sides pressuring them, both sides wanting to trade, to recruit, to try blockade or otherwise force their allegiance. By choosing one side they insure they have allies and won't be picked apart between two factions.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    No but they would have had to deal with both sides pressuring them, both sides wanting to trade, to recruit, to try blockade or otherwise force their allegiance. By choosing one side they insure they have allies and won't be picked apart between two factions.
    And if the Alliance was not pacifists, they could have made an example of Suramar with relative ease.

  12. #192
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    And if the Alliance was not pacifists, they could have made an example of Suramar with relative ease.
    Could they actually though? They'd be attacking the Nightborne on their own turf, backed up with the Horde who now have the sole access to their teleportation network, their nightwell, etc.

    So the alliance could "try" to make an example, and the Horde would meet them in force, or once again attack where the Alliance wasn't.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    a proactive Alliance
    More rare than hens teeth, a unicorn and an honest politician combined.
    Khadgar: Prepare to heroically CTRL-E through the portal with me!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooky View Post
    yeah wow cool..how about raising the valor cap consider WoD isn't that far away? 1000 valor points gets u a lollipop and kick in the nutsack these days! Back in my day we could get a bucket of candy and a pet ferret with that sort of points!
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    QUICKLY FRIENDS, TO THE HYPERBOLEMOBILE!

  14. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    Assuming the Horde wrote down the latitude and Longitude at the position where they kept their ships, and that the sinking ship did not roll, glide, or break apart as it sank beneath the ocean.

    If they had another risen tidesage they'd still need something that belonged to one of the crewmen to locate them. This also banks off of the Horde bothering to do this in the first place, basing this off of one would assume the Alliance telling them, its an unlikely scenario to even want them to look for that ship in the first place, finding it would be even harder.





    Not if the Lich king is hunting them and trying to force them back into his forces. And we know in Chronicle he's all about keeping all the scourge under his control, he freaked outt when he realized the Val'kyr left him.




    The point is that Blizzard isn't afraid to overlap class themes, or in this case, build a race out of a playable spec.



    There's being modified by an entropic energy that can be described as vampiric, and then there is being an actual vampire sucking the blood out of people. That's a niche Blizzard could carve out quite easily if they wanted.




    Unless you take Afraisbi's coke ramblings as canon and Sylvanas was just playing 4d chess with a dreadlord.
    How do Forsaken find sunken ships for their fleet? Obviously they go looking for them. They don't need to breathe underwater so all they need is good motivation to do so.

    I would assume they have raised more tide sages but a tide sage isn't required to find sunken ships. It may take more time but they just need a group of Forsaken divers looking for it in the general area where it was. There is zero reason to assume the Alliance would tell the Horde about anything concerning Dreven. The Horde would logically want to find out what had happened to the San'layn they had recruited. Simple.

    That's an assumption. It's just as likely they would work under LK and rule Northrend together.

    Point being you can have blood drinking without adding another playable elf. Vrykul Vampyrs exist.

    In her head, Slyvanus is playing 99d chess. However a fictional character can only be as smart as the person who writes them. And it's obvious how smart Blizzard writers are.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Given how they can't post as much because they keep getting banned, I'd say if anyone's spazzing out, it'd be them.
    Quote Originally Posted by sillag View Post
    im not saying all blood elf fans are weird edgelord neo-nazis

    but all weird edgelord neo-nazis in wow are blood elf rpers

  15. #195
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post
    How do Forsaken find sunken ships for their fleet? Obviously they go looking for them. They don't need to breathe underwater so all they need is good motivation to do so.
    I dont think dredging up ships that sank in the bay of Lordaeron because no one was left alive to maintain them is the same as going out into the middle of the ocean to find a ship.

    I would assume they have raised more tide sages but a tide sage isn't required to find sunken ships. It may take more time but they just need a group of Forsaken divers looking for it in the general area where it was. There is zero reason to assume the Alliance would tell the Horde about anything concerning Dreven. The Horde would logically want to find out what had happened to the San'layn they had recruited. Simple.
    The Horde knows the ship containing Dreven was attacked and it sank, if there's no reason for them to expect treachery then there's no reason for them to go looking to figure out what happened, as Nathanos, the Horde pc + others saw the ship attacked and saw it sinking/sunk.


    That's an assumption. It's just as likely they would work under LK and rule Northrend together.
    That isn't how Bolvar works, every undead is his in his mind, they aren't allowed to do what they want if he has them, he wants all the scourge tight to his chest and in his mental grasp.

    Point being you can have blood drinking without adding another playable elf. Vrykul Vampyrs exist.

    And so do San'layn, one doesn't invalidate the other, and vampire elves have been fleshed out a ton more than the vampire Vrykul that get mentioned twice over two expansions.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  16. #196
    The worgen allied race should be dragonmen imo. Maybe Wrathion can refine some of Nefarian's work, creating an improved line of dragonmen that possess full human intelligence and the ability to transform back into their human forms (which could be swarthier and more ME/NA/EA-based).

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    I dont think dredging up ships that sank in the bay of Lordaeron because no one was left alive to maintain them is the same as going out into the middle of the ocean to find a ship.



    The Horde knows the ship containing Dreven was attacked and it sank, if there's no reason for them to expect treachery then there's no reason for them to go looking to figure out what happened, as Nathanos, the Horde pc + others saw the ship attacked and saw it sinking/sunk.




    That isn't how Bolvar works, every undead is his in his mind, they aren't allowed to do what they want if he has them, he wants all the scourge tight to his chest and in his mental grasp.




    And so do San'layn, one doesn't invalidate the other, and vampire elves have been fleshed out a ton more than the vampire Vrykul that get mentioned twice over two expansions.
    Are you sure it sank? I know it was on fire, but that doesn't mean it sank for sure. Assuming it did sink, it was still one of the newer Forsaken ships and it wasn't the only one out there. They could easily go to try and recover all of them.

    If Nathanos and the PC saw the ship then that settles it, it would be easy to find it's general location. Unless the PC and Nathanos have the memory of goldfish.

    And that's different from becoming a tool for the Warchief how? At least Bolvar would have the power to resurrect them if they died.

    Vampire elf is still an elf. You would need to add another elf to the Alliance to balance it out. There is already 4 types of elves. The game doesn't need any more.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Given how they can't post as much because they keep getting banned, I'd say if anyone's spazzing out, it'd be them.
    Quote Originally Posted by sillag View Post
    im not saying all blood elf fans are weird edgelord neo-nazis

    but all weird edgelord neo-nazis in wow are blood elf rpers

  18. #198
    Elemental Lord Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    1. That's why i said nelfs were cheated. If you don't think the remaining allied races have to be tied to an existing race, why even post in a thread about finding ones that fit Worgen/Forsaken?
    there is no cheating, no one ever said the allied races need to be some sort of sub-race from another, no one ever said every actual race would get an pariental allied race, no one ever said the allied races are somehow to combine or share themes

    with the forsaken/worgen they can literally do the swap again without any problems.
    2. Subjective Disagreement.
    if it was indeed a pushback they would not be so much playable, tey literally became the third most playable race in the alliance in a little spanw of time.

    3. Any number of reason 'Because back then it was an emperor only thing, mogu used to be sexist but now they're changing, because this clan we've never heard of still does female bodies but it was just out of style with others' literally any excuse works, Blizz just didn't have a female model at launch.
    nah, your "reasons" have no sense

  19. #199
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripzzz View Post
    Are you sure it sank? I know it was on fire, but that doesn't mean it sank for sure. Assuming it did sink, it was still one of the newer Forsaken ships and it wasn't the only one out there. They could easily go to try and recover all of them.
    It was half way underwater during the Horde Quest.


    Seeing the place a ship sinks doesn't mean you know where it ends up on the ocean floor, rarely does anything sinking go straight down, it will roll, possibly break apart, smash into the seabed and sink into the silt, etc.


    There still hasn't been given a good reason why the Horde, why the Forsaken would spend so much effort to drag a ship that most likely wont even be in one piece from the ocean floor, and judging by the new boats, I think like most things the Forsaken no longer drag up sunken boats, like their new buildings they make them from scratch.

    If Nathanos and the PC saw the ship then that settles it, it would be easy to find it's general location. Unless the PC and Nathanos have the memory of goldfish.
    as I said above, seeing a boat sink =/= knowing where it settled on the ocean floor.




    Hell this doesn't even go into how most of the bodies on the ship probably got sucked out as the ship sank, and could be hundreds of yards from the wreck.

    And that's different from becoming a tool for the Warchief how? At least Bolvar would have the power to resurrect them if they died.

    Because being a slave to the lich king equals literally no free will? I don't think I have to explain why free willed undead would rather side with other free willed undead over giving up their own minds once more.

    Vampire elf is still an elf. You would need to add another elf to the Alliance to balance it out. There is already 4 types of elves. The game doesn't need any more.

    And that's the beauty of opinions, I don't rather care if San'layn get added or not, but you're trying very hard to make them sound less likely then they are.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  20. #200
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    there is no cheating, no one ever said the allied races need to be some sort of sub-race from another, no one ever said every actual race would get an pariental allied race, no one ever said the allied races are somehow to combine or share themes

    with the forsaken/worgen they can literally do the swap again without any problems.


    if it was indeed a pushback they would not be so much playable, tey literally became the third most playable race in the alliance in a little spanw of time.



    nah, your "reasons" have no sense
    1. You're being too literal there :P and if they 'do the swap again' what exactly are you proposing? That it can be any race?

    2. No, there can still have been pushback and they can still be common due to other factors like racials.

    3. Subjective disagreement.
    Twas brillig

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