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  1. #21
    How exactly do you know you are playing vs a premade? As far as I can tell, you can only know that if people you play against are from the same guild, otherwise its just a guesswork. And just because entire enemy team is russian, it doesnt mean they are premade, language specific realms are grouped together automatically.

  2. #22
    Bloodsail Admiral Denizly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    No it shouldn't exist. You have no argument for premade only vs premade within +/-1.5 of number of players or so other than "Wahhhhh I want to stomp randoms" and saying "make a group" doesn't solve the problem. If make a group is the solution then remove single player random queue. No? Oh that's right you want to stomp randoms.

    Yes it shouldn't exist. But guess what it does. And the OP here needs to accept the reality and try to find a way to win in these conditions, instead of being like you and hoping it gets removed. I hope it gets removed myself. BUt until it does, i sure as hell won't be the sheep and let smarter people farm my ass.
    Fire with fire. It's the only way right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    The excuse never made it so not sure why you say always. It's a bad excuse for bad people in every facet of the game yet people still spout it here like it's actually a valid argument. It's not.
    It is a valid argument, cuz it's the only solution right now. You either premade vs premades or you hope for godly randoms in your group, or to not get a premade as enemy.
    So long as it's possible for premades to hit randoms in matches, the "get a group yourself" will be a valid solution. If they remove the premade's ability to match with randoms, then then I won't use this argument anymore.

  3. #23
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by socialmaker View Post
    The group sizes should not exceed 2-3 people when playing with "friends". It's so easy to match 2 x 5 man teams and their place are not in random bgs it's in Rated BGS.
    so social.... your name is social... maker.... you like making things social
    and as an MMO i assume you agree that the biggest part of an mmo is being social?

    SO WHY THE FUCK do you want to tell people "LOL want to play with your friends? FUCK OFF go play solo or play with the elites if you want to shoot the shit with your buddies"


    do you not see how that is the stupidist thing ever?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denizly View Post
    Yes it shouldn't exist. But guess what it does. And the OP here needs to accept the reality and try to find a way to win in these conditions, instead of being like you and hoping it gets removed. I hope it gets removed myself. BUt until it does, i sure as hell won't be the sheep and let smarter people farm my ass.
    Fire with fire. It's the only way right now.



    It is a valid argument, cuz it's the only solution right now. You either premade vs premades or you hope for godly randoms in your group, or to not get a premade as enemy.
    So long as it's possible for premades to hit randoms in matches, the "get a group yourself" will be a valid solution. If they remove the premade's ability to match with randoms, then then I won't use this argument anymore.
    People give premades far too much credit.
    it is not often a premade is actuallty in discord, communicating, and making sure they have the perfect team
    most of the time its just a guild or a few friends who decided to queue up together, and literally arnt talking, and are playing it the same way any other random group of people would.

    the only time i have ever been worried of a premade is if its a full 10 man, or in RBG's if they are all from the same server/guild, then you know they are possibly a pvp guild and hyper co-ordinated.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  4. #24
    Bloodsail Admiral Denizly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    People give premades far too much credit.
    I think people assume way to much when it comes to random BGs. We're loosing? Must be premade!
    Heard that a few times myself. There is literally no way to know if it's a premade, unless they're all from same guild / realm.

    And even if it's a premade, doesn't mean they'll win.

  5. #25
    They could made a premade queue, regardless the size of premade, and a solo queue.

    Also they could allow horde to battle horde and alliance to battle alliance, in order to lower the queue time ( mercenary should be something passive, in order to join a bg in less da 1/2 min ).

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by melzas View Post
    How exactly do you know you are playing vs a premade? As far as I can tell, you can only know that if people you play against are from the same guild, otherwise its just a guesswork. And just because entire enemy team is russian, it doesnt mean they are premade, language specific realms are grouped together automatically.
    When you are in an Arathi Basin match being pushed 4-1 and try to avoid the noose at FARM and assault stables and a DK/Rogue/Healer from Silvermoon from the same guild insta-appear there it's a premade.

    When you are in an Alterac Valley and you cap both mines (to feed the enemy team more HK) and all the russians are at Stonehearth bunker doing nothing then they zerg as a group mid, get 100 hk then regroup back -> that's a premade.

    When in Ashran the same russians farmed a million prisons and insta lock you in a perfect symphony of a rotation -> premade (but heck Ashran was always a premade more or less).

    but either way when you look at the details tab and you see 5+ from the same realm - it's a statistical improbability, same guild -> even easier to figure out.

  7. #27
    Bloodsail Admiral Denizly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    Also they could allow horde to battle horde and alliance to battle alliance, in order to lower the queue time ( mercenary should be something passive, in order to join a bg in less da 1/2 min ).
    +1 for that. It's already passive for RBGs, you get a random faction in each BG.

  8. #28
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by socialmaker View Post
    When you are in an Arathi Basin match being pushed 4-1 and try to avoid the noose at FARM and assault stables and a DK/Rogue/Healer from Silvermoon from the same guild insta-appear there it's a premade.

    When you are in an Alterac Valley and you cap both mines (to feed the enemy team more HK) and all the russians are at Stonehearth bunker doing nothing then they zerg as a group mid, get 100 hk then regroup back -> that's a premade.

    When in Ashran the same russians farmed a million prisons and insta lock you in a perfect symphony of a rotation -> premade (but heck Ashran was always a premade more or less).

    but either way when you look at the details tab and you see 5+ from the same realm - it's a statistical improbability, same guild -> even easier to figure out.
    so 3 people is a premade to you... wow, again you literally want to remove all social aspect from the game if you want to refuse people to even bring their 2 closest pals into BG's with them

    seriously dude, if you want to kill the wow community, make a post why high elves suck, proposing to kill the entire social aspect of the game is just too far of a stretch mate

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    They could made a premade queue, regardless the size of premade, and a solo queue.

    Also they could allow horde to battle horde and alliance to battle alliance, in order to lower the queue time ( mercenary should be something passive, in order to join a bg in less da 1/2 min ).
    and question, how would this premade queue work? would it ONLY group up people in groups of 10? or some groups of 3? or groups of 5? or 4? how would it work?
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    so social.... your name is social... maker.... you like making things social
    and as an MMO i assume you agree that the biggest part of an mmo is being social?

    SO WHY THE FUCK do you want to tell people "LOL want to play with your friends? FUCK OFF go play solo or play with the elites if you want to shoot the shit with your buddies"


    do you not see how that is the stupidist thing ever?
    Ok you made your point heard but now you're just throwing personal insults so can you kindly GTFO of this thread? You clearly don't want to see the bigger picture here. Promoting premades does nothing more than hurt new players, players that want to play solo a few matches whenever already in a weirdly balanced game with undisclosed scaling and what not. At this rate less and less people will join PVP and it will become a bigger meme. I don't know how you can defend such a system.

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    @FelPlague: I just told you I play BGs a lot and recently the number of premades has skyrocketed and you pull that weak strawman "couple of friends can't have fun" argument? Are we debating just for the sake of debating here or what?

  10. #30
    Bloodsail Admiral Denizly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by socialmaker View Post
    I just told you I play BGs a lot and recently the number of premades has skyrocketed
    Again, it was BG week. Try again these couple of weeks and tell us do you see the same problem.
    I only premade randoms for BG week cuz of the insane honor farm. They prolly did too.

  11. #31
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by socialmaker View Post
    Ok you made your point heard but now you're just throwing personal insults so can you kindly GTFO of this thread? You clearly don't want to see the bigger picture here. Promoting premades does nothing more than hurt new players, players that want to play solo a few matches whenever already in a weirdly balanced game with undisclosed scaling and what not. At this rate less and less people will join PVP and it will become a bigger meme. I don't know how you can defend such a system.

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    @FelPlague: I just told you I play BGs a lot and recently the number of premades has skyrocketed and you pull that weak strawman "couple of friends can't have fun" argument? Are we debating just for the sake of debating here or what?
    By your logic a premade is a group of 3 friends
    "DK/Rogue/Healer from Silvermoon from the same guild insta-appear there it's a premade."
    so no, it is not a strawman
    if i was with my 3 friends and told "yeah no you are not allowed in random pvp, you have to go to rated" i would quit that game, i would not play it, not at all, and that is why so few, if so NO games do that.

    If you cant handle having 3 people once in awhile who may be talking to eachother on the enemy team, or ON YOUR TEAM then maybe you should stop pvping, idk if you know, but random is NEVER balanced.

    and nah, telling people "nah your not allowed to play with your friends" is the fastest way to not make people want to play pvp, and make it a meme.
    promoting premades gets GASP people to be SOCIAL and MAKE FRIENDS and play A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER GAME

    how fucking dare blizzard encourge people to group up! what is this, some kind of fucking mmo!? i signed up for wow cause i wanted to play alone, on my own, not have to.... GROUP UP with filthy trash people!
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    and question, how would this premade queue work? would it ONLY group up people in groups of 10? or some groups of 3? or groups of 5? or 4? how would it work?
    Every premade will queue altogether.

    RBG could also start 9v9 ( wsg ie ) or 30 v 30 ( av ). You won't EVER need to reach the 40/40 or 10/10 and so on. Once you find enough players, the bg starts.
    Then if you are with 3 groups of 3 players premade vs a single 9 premade, there won't be any problem.

    Except you won't be able to stomp on soloq players ofc.

  13. #33
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    Every premade will queue altogether.

    RBG could also start 9v9 ( wsg ie ) or 30 v 30 ( av ). You won't EVER need to reach the 40/40 or 10/10 and so on. Once you find enough players, the bg starts.
    Then if you are with 3 groups of 3 players premade vs a single 9 premade, there won't be any problem.

    Except you won't be able to stomp on soloq players ofc.
    ok stop you right there
    you do not notice what you said right there did you?

    Then if you are with 3 groups of 3 players premade vs a single 9 premade, there won't be any problem.


    so what is the difference between a 3/3/3 versus a 9, and a 1/1/1 and a 3....
    literally fuckign nothing mate

    you just said its fine if the teams are not balanced in premades


    well then mate
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  14. #34
    Bloodsail Admiral Denizly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    Then if you are with 3 groups of 3 players premade vs a single 9 premade, there won't be any problem.
    I fully expect a ton of crying on forums cuz "they were 9, and we were 3x3"

    It either needs to be equal premades or no "premade queue"

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    ok stop you right there
    you do not notice what you said right there did you?

    Then if you are with 3 groups of 3 players premade vs a single 9 premade, there won't be any problem.


    so what is the difference between a 3/3/3 versus a 9, and a 1/1/1 and a 3....
    literally fuckign nothing mate

    you just said its fine if the teams are not balanced in premades


    well then mate
    I am happy to see that you are not able to notice the difference between a RBG ( and remember we re not talking about Rated but Random )3 men group premade vs a 9 men group premade and a full solo q vs premade.

  16. #36
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    As somebody who profited from pre-mades all the way back in Vanilla, I say no

    But maybe make it so that pre-mades always meet pre-mades?

    Then again I hate the constant crying about how Blizzard should be holding your hand, because something is juuust outside your comfort zone ...

  17. #37
    "I have no friends to queue with so no one should be allowed to queue with friends." - says a guy called socialmaker -

  18. #38
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    I am happy to see that you are not able to notice the difference between a RBG ( and remember we re not talking about Rated but Random )3 men group premade vs a 9 men group premade.
    I find it funny you cant find the absolute hypocritisim in what you are saying.

    "10 groups of 1 versus 1 group of 10 is not fair. but 3 groups of 3 versus 1 group of 9 is!"


    so let me play devil's advocate.



    Ultra group qeueus in premade BG's has got to GO
    I entered a bg with my 2 friends and was paired with 2 other teams of three. Now i was able to communicate with my 2 friends, but i could not talk or co-ordinate with the other 6 players! then i noticed we were against a full 9 man team! how is this fair Gatto wtf, they are a full premade, and we are just a group of 3 players, how is this fair!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post

    But maybe make it so that pre-mades always meet pre-mades?
    but by his logic premades are 3 friends playing together, so it would need to find 5 other groups of 3's playing together to que them all FAIRLY and EQUALLY together, aswell as 2 solos for them to fill 10.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    I find it funny you cant find the absolute hypocritisim in what you are saying.

    "10 groups of 1 versus 1 group of 10 is not fair. but 3 groups of 3 versus 1 group of 9 is!"


    so let me play devil's advocate.



    Ultra group qeueus in premade BG's has got to GO
    I entered a bg with my 2 friends and was paired with 2 other teams of three. Now i was able to communicate with my 2 friends, but i could not talk or co-ordinate with the other 6 players! then i noticed we were against a full 9 man team! how is this fair Gatto wtf, they are a full premade, and we are just a group of 3 players, how is this fair!?

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    but by his logic premades are 3 friends playing together, so it would need to find 5 other groups of 3's playing together to que them all FAIRLY and EQUALLY together, aswell as 2 solos for them to fill 10.
    It's not that 3x3 vs 9 would be fine, but "better" than the actual situation.

    Let's assume that blizzard got drunk and allow players to face groups of the same faction, and we are in a hypothetical scenario with 2/3 min queue per bg.

    - Soloq players will have their rbg with no premades and they will be totally fine ( in before "remove voice chat from the game cause they try to organize themselves!" :d )

    - Premades will be able to face premades. Maybe a full premade could be "forced" to queue only Rated BG, leaving the premades for Random BG for 2/3/4/5 players. altogether. This could be even better, since the random are mostly meant for the casual.

  20. #40
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatto View Post
    It's not that 3x3 vs 9 would be fine, but "better" than the actual situation.

    Let's assume that blizzard got drunk and allow players to face groups of the same faction, and we are in a hypothetical scenario with 2/3 min queue per bg.

    - Soloq players will have their rbg with no premades and they will be totally fine ( in before "remove voice chat from the game cause they try to organize themselves!" :d )

    - Premades will be able to face premades. Maybe a full premade could be "forced" to queue only Rated BG, leaving the premades for Random BG for 2/3/4/5 players. altogether. This could be even better, since the random are mostly meant for the casual.
    how is 3x3 vs 9 somehow better then 1x9 vs 3x3


    seriously you are just... ust horrible at this point mate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

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