Baldurs Gate 3

[Well]

not happy that they didn't include dragonborn in the Early access too, they were some of the main races, they should have done then instead said half-elves... I do, is the closes thing to orcs, in a viable way, we got for a while in dnd

Oh, you're proposing the issue of orcs just being too "primal/violent" per the lore to be playable. I see you there and understand why you want half-orcs. I agree with that viewpoint and reasoning.

What I don't get is the half-elf argument. They are the best of two worlds. Sure, many people don't like them for that, but I don't see why they wouldn't be included. Half-Elves are definitely much more popular than both Orcs and Half-Orcs.

Also, can someone confirm 100% from in-game that if you make a Tiefling or Drow, you get spells that are not mentioned in the creation screen at levels 3 and 5? The answer I got was not exactly clear on what these races get. Also, are they changed from the base rules? Would I be able to check what they get by checking out what they get in 5e normally each?

[Fahrenheit]

Any word on if Dragonborn, Gnomes, and Half Orcs will be in the full initial release? Would be a shame to cut base player’s handbook player character races.

[Andonais]

Any word on if Dragonborn, Gnomes, and Half Orcs will be in the full initial release? Would be a shame to cut base player’s handbook player character races.

I think they have said all will be in by the end

[Syegfryed]

Oh, you're proposing the issue of orcs just being too "primal/violent" per the lore to be playable. I see you there and understand why you want half-orcs. I agree with that viewpoint and reasoning.

what? no, look at the avatar, big fan of orcs, but in dnd most of times you don't have orcs, the closest thing you could get is the half-orc, orcs only became officially playable in 5e with volo's book, but they were crap and had a negative on intelligence, only now they have lost the negatives in the recent errata.

What I don't get is the half-elf argument. They are the best of two worlds. Sure, many people don't like them for that, but I don't see why they wouldn't be included. Half-Elves are definitely much more popular than both Orcs and Half-Orcs.

half elves are a redundant race, especially because of this shenanigan of "best of two worlds" like normal elves were not perfect and pedantic enough. If you already have a human and elf, why not just make something else for the EA?

Also, can someone confirm 100% from in-game that if you make a Tiefling or Drow, you get spells that are not mentioned in the creation screen at levels 3 and 5? The answer I got was not exactly clear on what these races get. Also, are they changed from the base rules? Would I be able to check what they get by checking out what they get in 5e normally each?

i mean they do get spells at those levels in 5e, if they are making things faithful the chances are high.

in 5e default tiefling i know gets Thaumaturgy cantrip. lv 3 they get Hellish Rebuke and darkness at 5, i think the EA have Mephistopheles and Zariel right?

Meph get mage hand, burning hands and flame blade, Zariel get 2 smite spells(searing and brandin)

[Jastall]

What I am saying is that you can't throw 17DC conversation checks at level 2 characters, it's really that simple.

Yes it's D&D, yes we roll dice for every last bloody thing we do, but DC needs to be appropriate for the task.

You should not face a bloody 17DC challenge as a level 2 baby that you have snowball's chance of beating by anything except for capped Charisma and proficiency for that level, at which point you still face >50% failures for the most mundane persuasion checks.

All the voice acting and careful scene conversation modeling is useless because you simply will never see a huge chunk of it, simply because anything but full balls to the wall lock/sorc with maxed out charisma, proficiency and Friends, can't realistically ever hope to beat the check without massive savescumming.

They need to reduce DC for many conversation checks by a good 4-5 points.

I'd say they will likely tune it down, and see no reason for such things to be so hard myself either. In OS2 Persuasion checks were pretty damn lenient apart from some endgame checks which required +skill items if memory serves. Having a small handful of difficult but rewarding checks in the early game could be fun to encourage a CHA build, but then again as you said you could just savescum the hell out of them instead.

I always found DC checks for conversations to be a meh mechanic at best. They work in combat or for environmental interactions because one failed roll doesn't usually mean you miss out on much. In conversations it can often mean that, and you don't just lose access to that one locked chest or whatever but to a potentially interesting conversation or even maybe branching story paths that are crucial to RPGs. I hated that in FO3 and found New Vegas's system much better; sure you could game it as well and it wasn't perfect but it was still better.

Implementing @Endus's solution would be cool but sounds hella work intensive in what already looks like a massive and intricate game as it is.

[keldarepewpew]

Finally managed to finish the download yesterday in the evening so i tried it out. I't a DoS 2 mod but a bit more "flashy". Had lots of funbut i it still does not feels like a Baldur's Gate game. If you liked DoS games it will be worth your money. Gorgeous graphics, story is okay so far, characters are kinda interesting and there is lots of exploration. More of the same from the previous titles.

The only thing that really annoyed me is the return of the surface tactic shit, which was expected since this was one of the main features of the DoS games but somehow it feels wrong when i fire a cantrip fire bolt which misses yet the fire surface it creates still kills the enemy AND you can dip your weapons into them. Cantrips are waaaay overpowered this way.

Calling it a dos mod to me feels insane.

[Jastall]

Calling it a dos mod to me feels insane.

I dunno. The UI looks virtually identical (the map especially), the graphics seem to reuse some assets, there's music snippets from that game, the casting animations are often quite similar if not the same, the aforementioned focus on surface tactics, the resemblance is unmistakable to me.

Maybe a DOS2 mod is going too far, but they still recycled a lot. Now it's early access so things can change, quite obviously, but I doubt all of the above will.

[Fencers]

Maybe a DOS2 mod is going too far, but they still recycled a lot.

Currently? It's not. In many instances the UI, ambient sounds, art assets, models, font, controls and animation routines, aesthetic, and more are 1:1 to DOS2. I loaded both games side by side on day one due to how familiar they were and these are the exact same crates and barrels as in DOS2. Those enemies have the exact same animation sequence, etc.

Larian added new assets and there are gameplay differences, but those could be modded in DOS2. That is what a mod does.

I think this is lazy development.

[Gaidax]

thats what im hopping, but i see not much sense in not put then in the EA, but put half-elves, its a weird choice at very least, cause i think half-ocs are more "dnd" than tieflings and halflings

The sense is that Act that you're getting in EA is teeming with Thieflings, so they were already done there. Same goes for Half-Elves, 2 of your 5 companions are Half-Elves.

On the other hand - there are no orcs/half orcs so far.

That's the sense and it's a pretty sound one. They included races they had to make for Act 1, so these were ready.

[Jastall]

Currently? It's not. In many instances the UI, ambient sounds, art assets, models, font, controls and animation routines, aesthetic, and more are 1:1 to DOS2. I loaded both games side by side on day one due to how familiar they were and these are the exact same crates and barrels as in DOS2. Those enemies have the exact same animation sequence, etc.

Larian added new assets and there are gameplay differences, but those could be modded in DOS2. That is what a mod does.

I think this is lazy development.

Well I'm going off video footage so you might be closer to the truth. I will say the character models at least look different, a lot less exaggerated in features in proportions, at least thus far. But yeah the UI in particular is a dead ringer. Again that's the sort of thing that can be changed in early access, but I doubt they'll revamp the animations or make tons of new art assets. In darker lighting the game does seem to look different, but in broad daylight which is where most of OS2 happened? Yeah, in some places there isn't any appreciable visual distinction.

[Fahrenheit]

I did get a very strong resemblance to DOS2 while playing, not that it’s a bad thing in anyway. Enjoying it so far, a lot of checks need to be toned down I believe. You fail way too many off the bat, I think it engenders an atmosphere for save scumming everything.

Not taking the early access very seriously until Dragonborn are a PR.

[Fencers]

The to Hit rolls are pretty strange. Not only is combat somewhat slow, but is somewhat made worse by the frequency of missing. I kinda wish they wouldn't show the d20 at times because it irks me when I fail a check so closely.

My dude is charismatic. How am I rolling so poorly for some of these checks? It feels like I am not involved in the process.

[Tyris Flare]

The to Hit rolls are pretty strange. Not only is combat somewhat slow, but is somewhat made worse by the frequency of missing. I kinda wish they wouldn't show the d20 at times because it irks me when I fail a check so closely.

My dude is charismatic. How am I rolling so poorly for some of these checks? It feels like I am not involved in the process.

Because it's based on D&D, which I think is a huge mistake.

I mean, of course it has to be somewhat based on the system because of the name, but it's really going to highlight one of the big gulfs between games and tabletop, which is the insane randomness of the latter.

DOS2 had some hit randomness but not much (usually because you were blinded or something). If your actions in that game suddenly only had a 50% chance to work it would have been awful.

[Ara Myrr]

I really, really hope we get an option to mute the narrator.

Malady from DOS:2 is easily the worst NPC I have ever seen in any game, she was utterly insufferable.

...guess the narrator for BG3. Ugh.

[Tyris Flare]

Probably because she has an awesome voice and was an incredibly popular character.

[Fencers]

Because it's based on D&D, which I think is a huge mistake.

I've played nearly every video game based on D&D. This is not the problem. Early on the encounters are rather difficult for your relative skill set. I do not mean difficult in terms of "hard gameplay"; I mean in the CR/encounter types you might face and many of the skill challenges.

For example, one can get into a fight with a "weakened" mindflayer right at the start who will wipe the floor with your party in a single action. That would be fine, but this mindflayer has no real adjustment for the level you encounter this thing at and the scenarios that lead to either instant kill of the mindflayer vs. the mindflayer nearly instant killing you are somewhat oblique.

I don't want to drop spoilers, but I think everyone knows there are Mindflayers in this piece. Some of these touch attacks are fucking wild at level 1, brother.

I really, really hope we get an option to mute the narrator.

I like it. But her tone often leads to misread a situation. LOL

[Tyris Flare]

Well you were talking about dice rolls which kind of is a D&D problem.

[Fencers]

Well you were talking about dice rolls which kind of is a D&D problem.

I do not think dice rolling itself is the problem. It's the values you have to hit. In an actual TT scenario, there is a lot you can do to influence the result you want and the human DM can veer things in a direction that is enjoyable for all. When video games translate this, there needs to be some concession to the flow of the play experience.

Here, in BG3, it feels like Larian put together encounters and skill checks with values which can be tough to meet at times and the player is asked to roll 'straight'. So to speak. I do not think that works for video games very well.

[Endus]

I don't want to drop spoilers, but I think everyone knows there are Mindflayers in this piece. Some of these touch attacks are fucking wild at level 1, brother.

If they incorporated Intellect Devourers as they are in the Monster Manual in 5e, they'll be the worst. Lower CR than Mindflayers, so more likely to be around. They have a psychic attack that, if you fail the save and the special Intelligence check, drops your Intelligence to 0. That means permanent Stun; that character is out of the fight until something restores at least 1 Intelligence (greater restoration spell can, that's about it, and that's a 5th level spell, so the highest spell level in BG3 for players IIRC).

That's not the bad part. The bad part is that Intellect Devourers can also initiate an Int contest with anyone incapacitated (Stunned condition also includes Incapacitated). If you lose (and a 0 Intelligence is a -5 to your check, where the critter has a +1), your brain gets eaten, it teleports inside your skull, and it knows everything you knew, including all class abilities and spells and spell slots. So it can perfectly ape the person it just ate.

It gets worse. Even if you figure this out and can get the damned thing out of their head (a 1st-level Protection from Evil and Good can achieve that), they're still SUPER dead, brain eaten. The spells Revivify (3rd level) and Raise Dead (5th level) can't raise them; they're missing a brain, and those spells can't replace missing body parts. You're looking at 7th level spells to be able to bring this person back.

Intellect Devourers are only Challenge Rating 2, where Mind Flayers are CR 7.

[Ghostpanther]

The to Hit rolls are pretty strange. Not only is combat somewhat slow, but is somewhat made worse by the frequency of missing. I kinda wish they wouldn't show the d20 at times because it irks me when I fail a check so closely.

My dude is charismatic. How am I rolling so poorly for some of these checks? It feels like I am not involved in the process.

I agree with your point. The best thing to do is make sure you post your feedback what you like and dislike on their forums or the Steam Discussion forum for BG3. They do read those.