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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyed View Post
    And that's why you don't work in video games.

    The investment in character is the main strength of WoW. A WoW2 would fail and take WoW down with it.
    I'm pretty sure people have gotten their investment worths in 15 years of WoW1. I could see if the game was only a few years old but 15...I don't think many people would be mad about a WoW2 and having to make a character. All your progress is basically being devalued now anyways with all these stat squishes.

  2. #182
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyed View Post
    How do we know this is real? The screenshots certainly look low quality. Basically I'd expect a real survey to not have a weirdly distorted logo, among other things. Marketing people are obsessed with brand and all that.

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    People constantly whine and throw tantrums about the fact that they don't get a new talent or spell every level anymore with spell ranks not being as much of a thing. So that'd probably be the point if nothing else.
    I think they should add new stuff in, not squish it down. Blizz could easily add in new spells and talent rows

  3. #183
    I don't mind a leveling squish. My main concern is character progression and class mechanics.

    I just want them to figure out how I can progress my character while leveling and at endgame, without feeling like I lose all that progress once an expansion ends.
    "Warlocks are the class that gives

    we give all our spells and abilities to other classes"

    - Bamboozer, from the Official WoW Warlock Forum

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyed View Post
    The investment in character is the main strength of WoW. A WoW2 would fail and take WoW down with it.
    blizz has been removing that investment more and more with every expansion... all the more reason to make a new mmo

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    I mean what is the actual point? it isn't like it's going to take any less time to hit max level. if they squish it to 60 they will still maintain the amount of xp needed to hit 120. so it's not going to save time or anything. complete waste of time doing it
    I have one of every class on both factions at 120. I don't feel like this is a disservice at all. Please don't try to speak for everyone when you speak for yourself.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by itzLCD View Post
    I legit just don't understand why they can't just invest in a WoW2 or another MMO at this point instead of continuing to lower stats and levels every expansion essentially destroying the entire point of an MMO which is to increase your characters power.

    Think about it this way, they continually put more and more time into fixing and adjusting the current game engine instead of putting that effort into building a new one...
    This would give a lot of people that are just playing WoW out of pure addiction a chance to quit. They've put so much time and effort into their characters and collections, so losing that would make them lose all the attachments to the game. So... probably not something Blizzard wants to do.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Explicit Teemo Nudes View Post
    This would give a lot of people that are just playing WoW out of pure addiction a chance to quit. They've put so much time and effort into their characters and collections, so losing that would make them lose all the attachments to the game. So... probably not something Blizzard wants to do.
    with blizz removing content and progression people are already losing attachment because blizz is basically nullifying the time and effort people have put into their characters.

  8. #188
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Druidzorz View Post
    I have one of every class on both factions at 120. I don't feel like this is a disservice at all. Please don't try to speak for everyone when you speak for yourself.
    where was I trying to "speak for everyone"? I was simply stating my opinion, going off your logic I could turn your words back around onto you for giving your opinion

  9. #189
    no problem with a level squish, but the leveling speed should remain roughly the same, its already insanely fast to level.

  10. #190
    I hope they take the opportunity to squish the number of levels and tie it into better parallel leveling/scaling ie more freedom to progress through old zones.

  11. #191
    I just dont see the point. A few expansions from now and they will have to squish again because of the precedent set. Level doesnt matter unless your at max anyway. I agree that a WoW2, or god forbid a different blizzard IP MMO offering; should be the way to go. WoW has been fun, but no king rules forever, and at the end of the day we are talking about a game that is 15 years old.

  12. #192
    Level squish will be the end of my 15+ year Warcraft career. Blizzard has no idea how damaging this will be.

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkaden View Post

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    Putting it that way, everything in the game is meaningless. All the numbers. All the gear. Everything.
    It is indeed distressing that thanks to scaling gear is becoming increasingly meaningless.

    I just don't see the problem with level numbers in general. Will someone really enjoy playing more if instead of 120>130 they get to do 60>65? It should be about facing increasingly stronger enemies whilst growing ever more powerful, but now it's all messed up anyway. Are there really new players that are put off by the max level being a very high number instead of a low number? I would have thought that it's almost a positive thing from a new player's point of view, "such wow, so many levels".

    I personally would probably enjoy playing quite a bit more if there were no more level cap increases at all, but rather in an expac I had to clear the storyline in a zone to get a new ability & need to clear all of them to become dungeon ready.

  14. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    I always hate hearing them talk about “new players this.. and new players that..”. What about your current players? At one point you had 10 millions... maybe if you had focused on keeping those players instead of always attracting new ones, WoW would be in a better state..

    That said, I think the lvl squish is a good idea.
    You are aware that to get to 10 million they had to attract more new players than they were losing, right? New players are what keep a game alive because you CANNOT have a 100% retention rate over 1, 2, 10, 15 years. The issue isn't new players vs current players because the point is to still have a game that people keep coming back to play. The ever increasing level cap is a legitimate roadblock to attracting new players and it should be addressed.

    I think a level squish is a step in the right direction, in conjunction with massive decrease in the time it takes to get to max level.

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by majesta View Post
    Level squish will be the end of my 15+ year Warcraft career. Blizzard has no idea how damaging this will be.
    Amen to that. Squishing the level for Zero reason will be the last straw for many people after 15 years.
    (A Level squish achieves NOTHING and solves NOTHING and like the 2 stats squish that already happens just lead to these squish sooner or later happening again ruining the game even more....)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adamas102 View Post
    I think a level squish is a step in the right direction, in conjunction with massive decrease in the time it takes to get to max level.
    massive time? when have you leveled a toon last? 15 years ago?

  16. #196
    At this point levels are nothing more than benchmarks for sections of the game and they keep things in context making a level squish completely unnecessary and potentially damaging. There is little to gain from this but confusion as to which level 80 you're referring to and relearning which zone/instance represents which level. The current level is still low enough for anyone to comprehend so it does not compare to the motivations behind stat squishing and the squish would be an entirely arbitrary fudging of numbers. Reducing the time required to level is already managed by experience tweaking so there is no benefit in terms of that. Its a lot of effort and risk just to move around numbers in hopes that it will bring in a handful of players that for some reason might not play due to the presentation of progression. On top of that I have a feeling that the number used to represent max level is low on the list of reasons as to why WoW is not regaining popularity so I'm not convinced that that is the motivation either; the game is old, washed up and MMOs are not as appealing to gamers as they once were, especially younger ones. My favorite part about this idea is that Blizzard originally went from 5 levels per expansion back to 10 because with only 5 levels players felt a slower sense of progression and ultimately less powerful at max level. Blizzard flip flops a lot so that doesn't surprise me but overall I'm scratching my head on this one.
    Last edited by Parad0x86; 2019-06-15 at 09:43 AM.

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by Adamas102 View Post
    New players are what keep a game alive.
    I don't agree. Blizzard are making too many changes to accommodate new players that the current player base doesn't like. They are "dumbing" down the game in way too many areas because they think new players will be turned off if they don't.

    I like the level squish though. But not because of new players.
    Last edited by Kaver; 2019-06-15 at 10:58 AM.

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    where was I trying to "speak for everyone"? I was simply stating my opinion, going off your logic I could turn your words back around onto you for giving your opinion
    No, I specifically stated I. Not a broad generalization of "people" Just because you feel like you were shafted doesn't mean everyone does.

    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    eitherway its a huge disservice towards people who have many alts
    Right here, this is where you were trying to speak for everyone who has multiple alts. Stick to I's and Mes. Then it's an opinion on how YOU feel and not an opinion on how you want EVERYONE ELSE to feel.

  19. #199
    Quote Originally Posted by Adréal View Post
    I wonder if halving the levels would be too much. As in:

    Classic Zones 1-30
    Outland/Northrend 29-40
    Cataclysm Zones/Pandaria 40-45
    Draenor 45-50
    Broken Isles 50-55
    BfA Zones 55-60

    So essentially, let's say a zone would currently give you 2 levels, requiring 100K experience for the first one, and 120K for the second one.
    After the squish that zone would give you a single level, over the course of getting 220K experience.

    Talents would be gained at 8, 15, 23, 30, 38, 45, and 50. (Or alternatively they could be rounded up or down, if the aesthetic of having "round" numbers is of a bigger concern than keeping them as close as possible to the current system. 5, 15, 25, 30, 35, 45, and 50, for example). Death knight and demon hunter talents would end up being a bit weird due to being so compacted to begin with, which might even require gaining 2 talents per level early on.

    In the end though, as with all other squishes, it won't really chance anything meaningful. The power curve will be slightly less smooth, but other than that, it's basically just the displayed number that is changing, which is why I don't really mind it.
    The current expansion will still be a +10 level range, I'd think. So something like

    Classic Zones 1-25
    Outland/Northrend 25-35
    Cataclysm Zones/Pandaria 35-40
    Draenor 40-50
    Broken Isles 40-50
    BfA Zones 50-60

    Doing this would allow people to skip Draenor, which I think Blizzard wants at this point as poorly as those zones have been maintained, and would make it so that they don't have to tweak the leveling speed of the current-most expansion.

    And anyone who thinks that these new levels will take as long as old levels x2 are out of their minds. This will be set up with the intent of players being able to rocket out of old content and get to the newer content as fast as possible.

  20. #200
    Quote Originally Posted by Awsyme View Post
    Longer. The engine is based on the one they created for Warcraft 3. They announced that 20 years ago and I assume a prototype engine existed even earlier. The thing is ANCIENT.

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    And something I never understood. Why 60? Always seemed a really weird number instead of, say 50.
    The engine has obviously been updated over time, they have replaced and rewritten a lot of the code. It's not the same as it was 20 years ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Willias View Post
    The current expansion will still be a +10 level range, I'd think. So something like

    Classic Zones 1-25
    Outland/Northrend 25-35
    Cataclysm Zones/Pandaria 35-40
    Draenor 40-50
    Broken Isles 40-50
    BfA Zones 50-60

    Doing this would allow people to skip Draenor, which I think Blizzard wants at this point as poorly as those zones have been maintained, and would make it so that they don't have to tweak the leveling speed of the current-most expansion.

    And anyone who thinks that these new levels will take as long as old levels x2 are out of their minds. This will be set up with the intent of players being able to rocket out of old content and get to the newer content as fast as possible.
    Why can't they just use EK and Kalimdor as 1-40 and then 40-50 is any later expansion, you can choose to do Outland 40-50, WoD 40-50, Northrend 40-50, Legion 40-50, BFA 40-50 and then 50-60 (if thats the top lvl) is the new expansion. I don't see why they have to cling onto older expansions being gradually more difficult or scale in level. It's just a story at this point, no reason to differentiate between the different expansions.

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