How to fix leveling in WoW and turn it into a fun solo experience

[Ragnarohk]

Opinion:

Blizz should continue focusing on endgame content. However, they should revisit old areas and story arch to make them relevant again. This way the world feels more connected instead of fighting in an isolated area

The expansion is called Battle for Azeroth. Yet it basically is the Battle for Zandalar/Kultiras. Yes, we do visit older areas (arathi, darkshore) but it all feels disconnected.

We shouldn't just jump ship every expansion and abandon a whole continent for a shiny New one.

All the other continents should reflect current content. Although I can see how this would take too much production time and effort. But it would be nice nevertheless to see azeroth (and outlands/draenor) feel whole.

[Schattenlied]

That wouldn't fix anything about leveling, even if combat system was godlike.

It's a combination of things. Adding content to leveling won't fix shit if it has no replay value. If the gameplay is garbage no one will want to play through the content after they've seen it once already, and we end up with the same problem we have now where everyone loathes leveling. So, like I already said: No amount of story rich quests, achievements, and minibosses will matter if it has no replay value due to WoW's extraordinarily shallow combat.

[RemasteredClassic]

It's a combination of things. Adding content to leveling won't fix shit if it has no replay value. If the gameplay is garbage no one will want to play through the content after they've seen it once already, and we end up with the same problem we have now where everyone loathes leveling. So, like I already said: No amount of story rich quests, achievements, and minibosses will matter if it has no replay value due to WoW's extraordinarily shallow combat.

Totally agree bro. Hopefully someone from Blizz is watching this thread...

[Kudos]

They should just work on Wow 2. Let the purists have their Classic servers and experience the game they loved. I want a new game, new experiences and a new story starting from level 1 again.

[RemasteredClassic]

They should just work on Wow 2. Let the purists have their Classic servers and experience the game they loved. I want a new game, new experiences and a new story starting from level 1 again.

And what happens to current wow? Do you mean you want an alternate world that would allow you to start from level 1 all the way to max? I guess they could make a new expansion world and let you start from level 1 in it if you already have a max level toon?

They would have to send you on quests to do pretty much every dungeon in the game, they would also have to enable world quests from level 1, and maybe even let players enjoy older raids in 5 man mode? Otherwise where would one get enough sources of XP! So many ideas!

[kaminaris]

It's a combination of things. Adding content to leveling won't fix shit if it has no replay value. If the gameplay is garbage no one will want to play through the content after they've seen it once already, and we end up with the same problem we have now where everyone loathes leveling. So, like I already said: No amount of story rich quests, achievements, and minibosses will matter if it has no replay value due to WoW's extraordinarily shallow combat.

I found my perfect spec this expansion - demo lock. Played all 36 specs since MoP (before there was 34) and no. It doesn't affect my willingness to do any quests or content i consider shit.

On the other hand played MM hunter in legion which i considered the worst spec ever and it didn't prevent me from doing mythic raids/mage tower and some other content i considered fun.

And as someone said in previous thread, most specs were utter garbage in Vanilla yet it didn't prevent people from playing the game (well mostly because EVERYTHING was new)

[Kudos]

And what happens to current wow?

People either stick with it (with no new content updates) or they start over in Wow 2. This is what happened with Everquest. I'd prefer a new game over Blizzard going back to revamp the leveling experience, or doing a level squish or doing another Cataclysm expansion where they change many of the old zones.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

I don't like it. Harder isn't the answer, invalidating more content isn't the answer. The answer is making old content fun and fulfilling. Not a game that's just... Endgame.

[RemasteredClassic]

Opinion:

Blizz should continue focusing on endgame content. However, they should revisit old areas and story arch to make them relevant again. This way the world feels more connected instead of fighting in an isolated area

The expansion is called Battle for Azeroth. Yet it basically is the Battle for Zandalar/Kultiras. Yes, we do visit older areas (arathi, darkshore) but it all feels disconnected.

We shouldn't just jump ship every expansion and abandon a whole continent for a shiny New one.

All the other continents should reflect current content. Although I can see how this would take too much production time and effort. But it would be nice nevertheless to see azeroth (and outlands/draenor) feel whole.

This is a very important aspect of keeping the game fresh even when leveling alts. If they decide to go ahead with the squish, they could easily make it so that you would be able to level 3-4 alts without ever going through the same content. Can easily be done with scaling.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't like it. Harder isn't the answer, invalidating more content isn't the answer. The answer is making old content fun and fulfilling. Not a game that's just... Endgame.

Harder is not the only point being discussed here. We're trying to look at it from every possible point of view and come up with ideas to make the overall experience a repeatedly successful form of entertainment.

[Schattenlied]

I found my perfect spec this expansion - demo lock. Played all 36 specs since MoP (before there was 34) and no. It doesn't affect my willingness to do any quests or content i consider shit.

Good for you, what part of it's a combination of things didn't you understand? Are you reading impaired?

On the other hand played MM hunter in legion which i considered the worst spec ever and it didn't prevent me from doing mythic raids/mage tower and some other content i considered fun.

And no amount of "godlike" content will make me play it more than once if the gameplay it's built on is shit.


Have you also considered what you consider "perfect" just isn't? Maybe you don't know what truly good gameplay feels like, maybe you think it's "perfect" because you don't know what better looks like. I'd argue that if it actually was perfect, you'd enjoy playing it for the sake of playing it, and you wouldn't constantly need fresh content to stay interested.

[Super Kami Dende]

Leveling has never and will most likely never be fun in WoW.

Debatable. Leveling used to be the thing I did most for Fun in WoW. It wasn't until they killed it with 7.3.5 that it became an utter trash heap.

[Monster Hunter]

Just remove levels. It's a tierd old hangover from table top rpg's

Gate content behind story unlocks for your first char and the charictures gear quality.

Give out new abilitys and new talents through things like completing chapters and killing bosses during the expansions story.

To put it into a senario.

You pick the game up, make your char after that you get to pick an expansion story to play through. You can start right at the beginning of bfa if you wish as you compete chapters through a more story driven experience like the old Republic or destiny you get abilitys and talents at certain points. These come from an item that boa, you can use it to get a talent or spell unlock or you can send it to an alt to let them skip, it can also be sold to a vendor for gold or maybe some gear or some other useful stuff.

Leveling is already pointless why keep trying to fix something that isn't needed, the real goal of leveling is to provide a way to simulate progressing a chars power. There's better ways to do that than arbitrary bar you fill over and over.

[arkanon]

In a world where titles like Witcher 3, the good Dragon Age games or Fallout New Vegas exist, a satisfying RPG solo experience for me would require a helluva lot more than some minibosses and additional cutscenes.

WoW's questing has always been mediocre at its best (parts of vanilla like Darrowshire, Storm Peaks, Suramar...) and really terrible at its worst. That was true back then and it's true now. I see why Blizzard focuses on the endgame, it's what makes players tick and is WoW's unique selling point.

They certainly could make questing better. But In my eyes they could never make it actually good without making this, well, not an MMO.

100%. Thats like taking GTA and trying to make it a serious racing simulator. The competition is far, far too strong - with the quality of SP games at the moment, and older SP games that still outshine wow, this is a recipe for disaster. IMO they would be better off focusing on what they are GOOD at, instead of trying to improve the weakest part of wow - which, as with most mmos, is the questing (SWTOR main story being the exception imo)

[Fred Skinner]

Other MMORPGs have account wide paragon levels, which could be an idea for WoW as well.

[RemasteredClassic]

Other MMORPGs have account wide paragon levels, which could be an idea for WoW as well.

Not a bad idea. Levels create more problems than solutions.

[Jastall]

I completely disagree, between the lore, art-style, the history of warcraft 3, the characters, etc. I don't find any game world nearly as compelling as the Warcraft world. That's why I play WoW, i'm sure lots of games have gameplay I would enjoy more. But I haven't seen a single game world that grabs me like Warcraft.

And I like WoW's story telling. Where each zone is a mostly linear story, but most zones are also self-contained, leaving open a large number of linear stories to choose from. I'm not a fan of how a lot of modern, open-world games just have your character wandering around doing one-off missions, very few of which connect to each-other.

That's fine, but I really don't think it means Blizzard should focus on the leveling regardless. The only MMO have had a questing and leveling experience that I would consider close to half decent by single-player RPG standards was SWTOR, who poured most of their development money on cutscenes, voice acting, dialog choices and (some) branching paths, and it was still an inferior version of Mass Effect with uneven combat, immersion-breaking hubs choke full of players titled Darth this or Master that, and tons of padding because MMO.

WoW would need to do even better than that to really grab me, and that would mean far too many resources sacrificed on this altar, plus a fundamental re-imagining of the game and how it approaches story and content.

Now, would I like a single-player Warcraft game? Of course. It could be anything, an RPG, ARPG, another RTS campaign, fuck make a dragon racing game or some shit and I'm OK with it, even if the actual odds of us getting that anytime soon are supremely low. But WoW is not a game created around questing and solo play and it never should be.

[Big Thanks]

So, like I already said: No amount of story rich quests, achievements, and minibosses will matter if it has no replay value due to WoW's extraordinarily shallow combat.

Thank you!
I agree with this completely. Thats the truth.

[Morbownz]

The emphasis seems to be on getting to max level, that's when endgame kicks in and you hop on the RNG based loot train. What Blizzard should do is create a bunch of treasure chests in the world/dungeons that give big XP buffs upon opening (not a lootable item that can be sold), maybe it could be group wide and guarded by a powerful mob. It makes no sense in terms of lore but from what I read on these forums, lore went out of the window a long time ago.

[kaminaris]

Good for you, what part of it's a combination of things didn't you understand? Are you reading impaired?

And no amount of "godlike" content will make me play it more than once if the gameplay it's built on is shit.


Have you also considered what you consider "perfect" just isn't? Maybe you don't know what truly good gameplay feels like, maybe you think it's "perfect" because you don't know what better looks like. I'd argue that if it actually was perfect, you'd enjoy playing it for the sake of playing it, and you wouldn't constantly need fresh content to stay interested.

Oh yes it will, if they provide a godlike content people will play it regardless if their class feels shit. Like it has been in vanilla where literally every spec was uber-retarded.

[Schattenlied]

Oh yes it will

No, it won't. I don't care how good a story is, if I've played through it once and the gameplay was bad, I'm not touching it again unless I have to.