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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    I mean in terms of ideology and how we think the world works. But even for the things you listed i'm sure there is a better way to go poo, eat, and drive. Cable TV is already obsolete due to the internet. There certainly is a better way to get educated then our current schooling, it is far too structured and stifles creativity. Kids should have more of a choice in terms of pursuing their academic interest instead of being forced to all take the same classes.
    The bold is higher education. Education for kids is to establish fundamentals, which they then can apply to what ever field they are interested in, as young adults. The issue with teaching with the same curriculum, is not about needing more specialized classes.

    That’s also the political conflict. You need fundamentals (right) to have a justified way to progress (left).
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    Zenkai: It also explained why [Comey] went easy on Clinton.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Butter Emails View Post
    If the bear would stop attacking civil liberties, and blaming it on liberals "attacking their rights" (to discriminate) this might be slightly more accurate. As it is LGBTQ, women, and minorities just want equal rights and to be left alone otherwise. The right views equal rights as an "attack" on them. I realize most right wingers on this forum like to deny that that's what conservatives are about, but in reality one only needs to look at the voting history of their representatives. It's a constant push to preserve discrimination and bigotry, and they justify it by claiming that there is a war against straight white people.

    I suppose it can appear that way when your life isnt exactly easy. Everyone feels like they have a hard life, or at least lament their own troubles. It must be terrifying having your own difficulties while staring into the possibility of having just as many as those other people who stumble and struggle through life.
    Oh it's not top terrifying yet, its just another hardship i expect to face. What's terrifyingly is that the left is most definitely shaping up to be the very some monster the religious right was once they consolidate their power. I say in the 2030s will be when the retibutinary tactics of the left start becoming law. that's when it will become terrifying, not knowing if the moral police mobs will show up at your home or place of work for a simple slip up. But hey bring in your left wing utopia,your world of what fairness means. Who knows maybe this time you just stick to reeducation centers instead of killing off those that don't conform fast enough.
    "It doesn't matter if you believe me or not but common sense doesn't really work here. You're mad, I'm mad. We're all MAD here."

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Saucexorzski View Post
    Oh it's not top terrifying yet, its just another hardship i expect to face. What's terrifyingly is that the left is most definitely shaping up to be the very some monster the religious right was once they consolidate their power. I say in the 2030s will be when the retibutinary tactics of the left start becoming law. that's when it will become terrifying, not knowing if the moral police mobs will show up at your home or place of work for a simple slip up. But hey bring in your left wing utopia,your world of what fairness means. Who knows maybe this time you just stick to reeducation centers instead of killing off those that don't conform fast enough.
    Being PC at work, is already written into your contract. Have you considered forming a union, to make attacks on individual members more difficult for liberals?
    Entropy won't yield to you.
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    Zenkai: It also explained why [Comey] went easy on Clinton.

  4. #64
    Keep justifying being just another fucking racist cunt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Avskildhet View Post
    No, it isn't. Social Democrats are a thing.

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    Liberalism suck fascists dicks.

    The liberals went on a political tour together with the nazi party for the EU elections. Don't tell me they're some saints.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    Being PC at work, is already written into your contract. Have you considered forming a union, to make attacks on individual members more difficult for liberals?
    Who knows what will be needed to survive, if in an ironic twist of fate, maybe right wing folks will have to do so.
    "It doesn't matter if you believe me or not but common sense doesn't really work here. You're mad, I'm mad. We're all MAD here."

  6. #66
    The Undying Themius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker76 View Post
    How does one explain to a Stalinist that;

    Liberalism is a political and moral philosophy based on liberty, consent of the governed, and equality before the law. Liberals espouse a wide array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but they generally support limited government, individual rights (including civil rights and human rights), capitalism (free markets), democracy, secularism, gender equality, racial equality, internationalism, freedom of speech, freedom of the press and freedom of religion.
    Instead try to spin it into Lockean and take into account the romantic period because for some people for whom thinking is... just tiresome work, liberal in any sense is a bad bad dirty word! They don't even care what the definition is.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by ipaq View Post
    Keep justifying being just another fucking racist cunt.
    Any proof of said racism or are you just another person who calls others racist because you don't like what they say?

  8. #68
    The Undying Themius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freefolk View Post
    Let's use Alabama and their abortion issue which is currently in the news.

    If Alabama voters want to ban abortions, should we force them to allow abortions?

    What good is democracy if the voters in a large state like Alabama can't use the power of the ballot box to shape the laws in the way they see fit?

    And they don't even want to ban abortion 100%, they just want to restrict it. Keep in mind that nearly every state in the union restricts abortion in some way.

    Let Alabama democracy do what the voters want to do.

    And don't bring up "what if they want to allow slavery?" On the scale of things the national government should get involved in, slavery is a 10, abortion isn't even a 1. 10 being something the fed should definitely get involved in.
    slim
    1. Alabama doesn't want to though a majority want to keep it.

    2. Alabama is not a self governing state, if they want to be I would say let them go, watch them crash and burn.

    3. A good democracy doesn't allow restriction of rights depending on where you are. If Alabama votes to bring back slavery should be brought up and abortion is not below a 1 what the fuck?

    4. What is Alabama wanted to bring back Jim Crow laws, what if they vote to take away suffrage from women?

    5. They don't want to ban it, they just want to restrict it to the point where it is impossible to get one.

    Figure out how our type of government works, and then come back to the conversation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Acidbaron View Post
    Unpopular opinion, we need to go back to a sort of elitist voting system. But instead of money being what makes you elite, it's your level of understanding of government, education and general knowledge all factor in.

    So to put it differently, people who bother to inform themselves properly get 10 votes, people who get all their news from propaganda channels like Fox news get 1.
    Or we could instead of a parliamentary system and hope they pick the best among them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saucexorzski View Post
    Oh it's not top terrifying yet, its just another hardship i expect to face. What's terrifyingly is that the left is most definitely shaping up to be the very some monster the religious right was once they consolidate their power. I say in the 2030s will be when the retibutinary tactics of the left start becoming law. that's when it will become terrifying, not knowing if the moral police mobs will show up at your home or place of work for a simple slip up. But hey bring in your left wing utopia,your world of what fairness means. Who knows maybe this time you just stick to reeducation centers instead of killing off those that don't conform fast enough.
    It seems to be the right is infatuated with being assholes and then not have any consequences for said assholery.

    "I gotta be PC at work oh god" um... what work place doesn't already have this policy? Why are the right attacking the very concept of respect?

    The right was busy trying to take away rights, what would the left do when in power? There is no one saying to pass laws to control speech so this is a fear you've pulled out of your ass.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Avskildhet View Post
    Wanting liberalism gone isn't racist. Anyone that's not rich should want it gone.
    Have you still not realized that the word "liberalism" that you're using means something completely different than the word that Americans are using? There is literally almost nothing in common between American liberalism and European liberalism. They aren't subtle differences; they're practically completely different concepts. So if you're going to argue about the word, make sure you know which context it is being used in.

    I realize it's sometimes difficult to understand which context people are using, so I don't fault you for not immediately understanding. But considering you've seen several posters explain this and you're still replying in this way is a bit surprising.

  10. #70
    The Insane PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dendrek View Post
    Have you still not realized that the word "liberalism" that you're using means something completely different than the word that Americans are using? There is literally almost nothing in common between American liberalism and European liberalism. They aren't subtle differences; they're practically completely different concepts. So if you're going to argue about the word, make sure you know which context it is being used in.

    I realize it's sometimes difficult to understand which context people are using, so I don't fault you for not immediately understanding. But considering you've seen several posters explain this and you're still replying in this way is a bit surprising.
    If "liberalism" originated and was defined in Europe then it seems like their description is the proper one...
    -----------------
    Malthus was wrong - Let's avoid ad hominem - Occam's razor - Hanlon's razor: Never assume malice over lack of knowledge. Life = problem solving. Explanation > Prediction. (Critical)Rationalism, not empiricism. Deduction, not induction/Bayesianism.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    If "liberalism" originated and was defined in Europe then it seems like their description is the proper one...
    I don't see you speaking Old English.

    (In case you've missed my point: languages change, so your traditionalism in semantics is entirely moot.)

  12. #72
    Pit Lord Katie N's Avatar
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    Why support democracy? All I see is people complain when their favored candidate doesn't win the election.

  13. #73
    The Insane Acidbaron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post

    Or we could instead of a parliamentary system and hope they pick the best among them.
    From your perspective that would solve some things, from mine it won't as there's still plenty of misinformation on your end it just means the uninformed vote becomes less powerful due to all votes being more equal compared to the gerrymandering system with the electoral college that favours one over the other.

    But it won't be a magic solution to everything and it can still create issues in todays world of misinformation from digital sources.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by DisposableHero View Post
    If maximum (or even majority) participation in the labor force is not required for the survival of society, and yet participation in the labor force is enforced by threat of withholding basic necessities of survival like food, shelter, and health care, I would argue that the current "liberal" society and its supporters are actually the ones who hate individual liberty. If you're unwilling to allow people to live in a world unless they are beholden to the interests of the wealthy to survive, you're certainly not on the side of individual liberty.
    Literally 37% of the population isn't working. What are you going about? Or is this just a socialist complaining that work sucks? If so get a job loser.
    Your problem is that you’re more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.

  15. #75
    Scarab Lord Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    Instead try to spin it into Lockean and take into account the romantic period because for some people for whom thinking is... just tiresome work, liberal in any sense is a bad bad dirty word! They don't even care what the definition is.
    But your forgot about muh Tocqueville! /s

    Or maybe miss sweden could realize they jumped into a thread about the US liberal/illiberal dynamic. And decided to call everyone else wrong.


    I geuss the one universal takeaway might be, reactionaries love their hot takes more than they love context.

    Hot takes with some syrup sound kinda good about now. /zing!

  16. #76
    The Insane Masark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbow Capitalist View Post
    Literally 37% of the population isn't working.
    Roughly half of those are over 65 and thus retired.

    Warning : Above post may contain snark and/or sarcasm. Try reparsing with the /s argument before replying.
    What the world has learned is that America is never more than one election away from losing its goddamned mind
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  17. #77
    And the other half is probably pretty much children or disabled people.
    Master List of Why Trump is a Misogynist, Racist, Fascist, Homophobic Criminal:
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  18. #78
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Reading this thread brings me to the following conclusion:

    We, as a human species, need to figure out what is meant when one says "liberalism" because half the people here define it one way, and half define it the other way . . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by De thuong View Post
    Why support democracy? All I see is people complain when their favored candidate doesn't win the election.
    Which is better than when your favorite dictator doesn't win the coup.
    "Another turtle made it to the water!" - Turtle-hating psychopath
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  19. #79
    Oh no, our society is providing for those it considers incapable of working with somewhat decent standards of living?!

    The horror!!! I bet the socialists would rather kill them right?
    Your problem is that you’re more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Avskildhet View Post
    Wanting liberalism gone isn't racist. Anyone that's not rich should want it gone.

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