Man trying to get his daughter back from ISIS.

[s_bushido]

This man has done absolutely nothing wrong, yet still likely lost his child, German authorities really should try a bit harder to track her down, at least give the man some piece of mind if she died somehow.

...what does his having "done nothing wrong" have to do with anything? It sucks for him, but what do you expect German authorities to do? That article says "Germany has no embassy or consulate in Syria and has no firsthand knowledge of German nationals in the camps."

[Cosmic Janitor]

Pretty sure that goes out the window if the mother is somehow unfit, which clearly is the case if she brings the child to a country at war and a terrorist organisation.

My mother lost the custody battle (she wanted sole custody) on the simple fact that she didn't always cook us dinner. And that happened in Sweden. This whole "motherly privilege"-argument falls apart very quickly.

Even here in Germany courts have been told to rule more fairly in recent years and they absolutely do that. In case of a coworker of mine she moved towards the south (from the north) and they lived here for years. After the divorce she wanted to have the kids and move back north but the family court gave both equal rights to the kids, which now, due to the mothers selfish attempt (she thought she would get full custody) to just go back north has lead to some rather awkward position admittedly, with them having to constantly move the kid back and forth. Either way, it was definitely true in the past, especially in the west, but certainly not anymore (some cases of shitty courts exist everywhere).

Also let's not pretend that there aren't enough other cases in places where the man owns the wive and kids where this happens as well. There are also countless cases of foreign men abducting their children and moving back to wherever they came from. Also the mother could have just moved back during one of the custody periods.

[Puupi]

And also completely pointless comment to make in this context, it is merely to moan about custody laws however people who generally do like to moan about this simply believe that this is blind favouritism and there is no argument behind it. It is also a left over of how artificially our families were shaped for ages, where the father went to work and the mother remained at home to raise the kids.

In any case this is a completely different discussion and again a pointless comment, since going to Syria to join ISIS has become a crime in its own and thus taking your kid there is going to be seen as abduction on some level.

If all you want to do is pointless gesturing and virtue signaling, sure, it is a pointless comment.

However, from a legal standpoint...

You know, the actual standpoint that matters.

[Mihalik]

I don't know what people expect of Germany at this point.
Send special forces into random isis camps to snatch the child back? They would not even be able to recognize it, let alone locate it, let alone alone send rescue teams.

No one has any clue where the kid or the mother is. What is his request exactly? Send drones to take pictures of kids at camps in the hopes of locating it?

From what is known the kid is in a refugee camp. Germany has some presence there already helping with the camp, as established in the article.

It's more about Germany using its influence to leverage the local Kurds or Syrians to make an effort and track down and return the kid.

Threaten, cajole, hand out some extra supplies etc.

If Germany wanted to, they could do that. A bit more than... We don't really want to make an effort.

[Themius]

Well that is true even in most western (including EU) countries. Like in Finland. The legislation just is like that.

It isn't like that in America though is there a study on this? Because people say the same thing about America but by and large every study shows that when men are involved and active they actually win the majority of cases. The issue is men are more prone to just... not giving a fuck.

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Has nothing connection with this case in particular but as a parent, following parental groups, joining court as support, I've seen cases of the father losing out even though both are in the same standing, because, 'better to be with mother'.

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Problem is, I've seen cases were the mother holds no income, or much space of a home, still win in the court because some votes mother to be a better development choice. It is all down to courts and people in them.

Stats don't show this though, stats show that when men are active in cases that they win the majority so this is more a "feeling" and it likely is because men are more likely to be absent. But when they're actually active.. .they win... more than women.

[Halicia]

Also the mother could have just moved back during one of the custody periods.

That's usually prevented by the custody agreement.

[Cosmic Janitor]

That's usually prevented by the custody agreement.

Yea.. let's pretend that someone who goes to join ISIS gives a flying fuck about a custody agreement.

[Halicia]

Yea.. let's pretend that someone who goes to join ISIS gives a flying fuck about a custody agreement.

Except SHE didn't use that excuse, YOU did.

[Amerissis]

Yes, lets get the little brainwashed terrorist back to Germany. What could go wrong? Sucks for dad, but that is not his kid anymore.

[josykay]

Yes, lets get the little brainwashed terrorist back to Germany. What could go wrong? Sucks for dad, but that is not his kid anymore.

You do know, that she was kidnapped by her mother with four and brought to Syria, and now is still nine?
It wasn't some young woman, thinking, that for some reason going to the IS was awesome. She was forced to go there, and still is a child.

[Mihalik]

You do know, that she was kidnapped by her mother with four and brought to Syria, and now is still nine?
It wasn't some young woman, thinking, that for some reason going to the IS was awesome. She was forced to go there, and still is a child.

He knows. He doesn't care. Just being edgy.

[hzjf]

And where do you get that from?

Reality. you should try it once

[Najnaj]

Sadly, the child was with its mother. In many countries, the mother overules the father just by being the mother.

What an incredibly irrelevant statement!

Exactly in what country will a father get over ruled as the guardian against a mother that takes the kid to a war zone and joins a jihadist cult?

[Cosmic Janitor]

Except SHE didn't use that excuse, YOU did.

I said she could just kidnap the kid like most perpetrators in these cases do?

[Flurryfang]

Germany is not allowed to make a person stateless, regardess of crimes. And the child even less so. Also, there are very specific circumstances that allow revoking citizenship. And those are "Joining the armed forces of another nation", which the mother did not. Isis are not "another nation". Or fraud, cheating or other ill actions, in order to aquire it in the first place. Which did not happen as well. Also, the child did neither of it.
Also, the kurds, who are holding the Isis fighters, women and children prisoner, have Germany already offered, to hand those women and children back. Which was however so far refused.

Isis is not a nation, but it is a known terroist group and i think any court we look at that just as if it was an enemy state, if not something worse. They are not allowed to make them stateless, but that does not mean that they have to help them get back to Germany.

The entire situation about the child, is a legal issue of what sins of a parent is taken to the child, especially when that child is being held in another country.

I understand why some countries will not take the children of terroist back to their country. In this situation, it is proberly because it will be hard to say no to the mother aswell, but in general, it is just a problem.....Even when somebody wants the kids, its just an added cost.

......And its proberly not helping, that these people are muslims from a country, that does not like muslims atm.

[Themius]

Reality. you should try it once

Stats don't agree. When men actually go to court and what not they are more likely to win than women. Men just are more likely to be absent entirely. So men often win because men aren't there.

You should try reality.

[apples]

shes 9 now ? Already been married off to some pedo mohammed and raped 500 times. poor kid

she probably already has 10,15 kids herself. thats generally how poor people work since they need laborers for their farms or whatever it is poor people need laborers for. napping? idk

[qwerty123456]

Stats don't agree. When men actually go to court and what not they are more likely to win than women. Men just are more likely to be absent entirely. So men often win because men aren't there.

You should try reality.

You asked him for studies then didn't supply any of your own....

[Amerissis]

You do know, that she was kidnapped by her mother with four and brought to Syria, and now is still nine?
It wasn't some young woman, thinking, that for some reason going to the IS was awesome. She was forced to go there, and still is a child.

Yes, exactly, that is why she’s now a little terrorist. She’s been subjected to terrorist training, seen people being killed, beheaded, propbably killed people herself, completely brainwashed. Ticking timebomb.

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He knows. He doesn't care. Just being edgy.

*She

/10char

[josykay]

Yes, exactly, that is why she’s now a little terrorist. She’s been subjected to terrorist training, seen people being killed, beheaded, propbably killed people herself, completely brainwashed. Ticking timebomb.

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*She

/10char

So no mercy for childsoldiers, trafficking victims, and so on either. For Sure. Not a bit cruel.