Mega-Thread: Democratic 2020 Primaries

[DarkTZeratul]

Still interesting watching people blame "Bernie Bros" for the failings of Clinton and her people like Clinton was owed the votes or something while also ignoring that the margins were even worse when it came to the previous Clinton election with her own voters.

You want someone to blame, blame the candidate who basically flipped their own base the bird thinking they had no choice otherwise she would have had more votes from them.

Honestly, I think anyone saying "Clinton didn't lose because of X, she lost because of Y" is oversimplifying things to a useless degree. There are a whole host of reasons why she lost, some of which were out of her control and some of which definitely were not, and it's disingenuous to try and blame a single one to the exclusion of all others.

That being said, she lost by such a narrow margin that it IS entirely possible to point to several of the factors that were out of her control and say that if not for any one of them, she might have won.

[Fugus]

Honestly, I think anyone saying "Clinton didn't lose because of X, she lost because of Y" is oversimplifying things to a useless degree. There are a whole host of reasons why she lost, some of which were out of her control and some of which definitely were not, and it's disingenuous to try and blame a single one to the exclusion of all others.

That being said, she lost by such a narrow margin that it IS entirely possible to point to several of the factors that were out of her control and say that if not for any one of them, she might have won.

Oh yeah, Comey took her out, her refusal to campaign in those states took her out, when DWS was forced to step down after trying to rig stuff in Clinton's favor only to have Clinton pick her up that same day and put her in her campaign took her out (And was the final straw that had me decide not to vote for her). But out of all of them, Bernie Bros weren't really the big one.
@shimerra

Nice revisionist history there buddy.

Sanders uphill battle was a major one given the media blackout they had on him till near the end when it was too late. I remember Bush had dropped out for something like 2 months before Sanders even caught up with him in coverage.

And what are you talking about his "Poor choices"?

And who the hell said anything about Sanders running 3rd party? Don't project your victim complex with Clinton onto me there buddy.

[Hobb]

Clinton should have campaigned harder in those states. Article even ends off saying so. Bernie bros are not the reason Trump won.

Clinton had a lot of issues with her campaign, not denying that part. But as the chart shows Trump only won those states because of the Bernie Bro vote. So yes Trump won the election because of them.

[Greyvax]

In another 4-8 years another several million mostly religious and majority Caucasian Boomers and Silent generation people will have croaked and another several million less religious, mostly mixed race/minority Gen Zers will take their place in the voting populace, not exactly those in the GOP's wheelhouse.

I bet you a large percentage of those Gen Zers after spending 4-8 years in the real world will re-register as republican.

[Fahrenheit]

I bet you a large percentage of those Gen Zers after spending 4-8 years in the real world will re-register as republican.

I bet you have down syndrome.
[Infraction]

[Dug]

Clinton had a lot of issues with her campaign, not denying that part. But as the chart shows Trump only won those states because of the Bernie Bro vote. So yes Trump won the election because of them.

IF the chart is correct. Article also states that. Clinton lost on her own merits don't blame sanders supporters.

[Shadowferal]

Wash Post and The Hill seem to think Warren had a good night. (Sometimes a show of temper can be a good thing)
And the other side of the equation, they don't think Sanders did bad with his rebuttals.

[DarkTZeratul]

Wash Post and The Hill seem to think Warren had a good night. (Sometimes a show of temper can be a good thing)
And the other side of the equation, they don't think Sanders did bad with his rebuttals.

I've generally been hearing that Sanders and Warren did well, Biden and Buttigieg did okay, and if the others ever had a shot they don't now.

[JohnBrown1917]

I bet you a large percentage of those Gen Zers after spending 4-8 years in the real world will re-register as republican.

Not everybody is as far right as you think.

[Elegiac]

I bet you a large percentage of those Gen Zers after spending 4-8 years in the real world will re-register as republican.

Based on what? Cause this certainly hasn't happened with millennials.

[eschatological]

Does anyone actually believe Warrens story that Sanders said a woman couldn't become President?

Her campaign said Bernie said a woman can't win in 2020. And that she disagreed with that assessment.

And yes, I believe he said that. Lots of people said that.

It's Bernie's camp that are slinging shit and accusing her of lying and suggesting Bernie is a misogynist, which she in no way, shape, or form said.

[Elegiac]

Her campaign said Bernie said a woman can't win in 2020. And that she disagreed with that assessment.

And yes, I believe he said that. Lots of people said that.

It's Bernie's camp that are slinging shit and accusing her of lying and suggesting Bernie is a misogynist, which she in no way, shape, or form said.

And now they're up in arms on Twitter spamming snake emojis and #neverwarren hashtags, lol.

The intersection of personality type between Trump and Bernie supporters is quite large, it seems.

[eschatological]

I refer you to Endus' post who explained quite well how this sort of thinking is one of the main reasons why US politics keep leaning right... while the rest of the modern world has moved on.

Ah, you mean the post I responded to and refuted, yet no one has answered it?

[JohnBrown1917]

Her campaign said Bernie said a woman can't win in 2020. And that she disagreed with that assessment.

And yes, I believe he said that. Lots of people said that.

It's Bernie's camp that are slinging shit and accusing her of lying and suggesting Bernie is a misogynist, which she in no way, shape, or form said.

Have fun believing that lie, I suppose, you're probably to deep in to have anything change your mind anyway.

[Dug]

Warren certainly isn't trying her hardest to clear any misconceptions.

[JohnBrown1917]

And now they're up in arms on Twitter spamming snake emojis and #neverwarren hashtags, lol.

The intersection of personality type between Trump and Bernie supporters is quite large, it seems.

Ah yes, i'm sure you, the enlightened centrist, could enlighten us.

[eschatological]

And now they're up in arms on Twitter spamming snake emojis and #neverwarren hashtags, lol.

The intersection of personality type between Trump and Bernie supporters is quite large, it seems.

This is my biggest problem with the Bernie camp. His politics most closely mirror mine. Like him, I've been a dyed-in-the-wool liberal my whole life, even when it was vastly unpopular. But his followers are A) looking for a demagogic icon, B) will be discouraged at any "failure" on Bernie's part as POTUS to push through his ideas even though the politics of Presidenting will likely result in him not getting much accomplished, and C) won't show up outside of Presidential elections. The very same thing happened to Obama, when he was the progressive darling alternative to Clinton's corporate "evilness."

They like to spout how they changed 2018.....but 2018's change came from the middle. AOC didn't flip a seat, she primaried an establishment Dem. Good for her, the party needs to be younger and more progressive. But we won the House by winning purple districts that voted for Trump in 2016.

- - - Updated - - -

Have fun believing that lie, I suppose, you're probably to deep in to have anything change your mind anyway.

I'm sorry, what? This is literally what the articles say. Bernie said, in a private meeting, that the political calculus wasn't there and he didn't think a woman could beat Trump in 2020. Warren disagreed. That has been the story from day 1. It's literally what she said on stage last night.

It's Bernie's people who are crying about how she's saying Bernie is a misogynist, when she did not say that at all.

[Theodarzna]

Ah yes, i'm sure you, the enlightened centrist, could enlighten us.

Even if he straight up said "PAH! Woman? Its the oval office not the kitchen!", the fact that she waited until she was sinking in the polls to say it reveals she is a snake either way. If she was upset by it, why wait two years only to use it now to Kamikaze at Bernie and likely destroy her own campaign.

Hey, yo know what else is weird? Biden basically claimed credit for Warren's Consumer protection thing, her biggest accomplishment and she just let that slide. Heck she has let the Bankruptcy issue slide for multiple debates now. I'm calling it now, this Kamikaze of hers is to show fealty to Biden and earn a VP slot.

She is a Judas.

[Greyvax]

I bet you have down syndrome.

The fact the only response you could come up with is a personal attack, speaks volumes.

Reported BTW.

[eschatological]

Even if he straight up said "PAH! Woman? Its the oval office not the kitchen!", the fact that she waited until she was sinking in the polls to say it reveals she is a snake either way. If she was upset by it, why wait two years only to use it now to Kamikaze at Bernie and likely destroy her own campaign.

Hey, yo know what else is weird? Biden basically claimed credit for Warren's Consumer protection thing, her biggest accomplishment and she just let that slide. Heck she has let the Bankruptcy issue slide for multiple debates now. I'm calling it now, this Kamikaze of hers is to show fealty to Biden and earn a VP slot.

She is a Judas.

She wasn't upset by it. Her every action has said she disagreed with the private assessment offered by Bernie. Last night, she personally confirmed it briefly, and then quickly tried to pivot away from it by talking about the greatness of the female candidates on stage.

The story was leaked by 4 sources, none of which were her. Maybe her political surrogates are trying a hit piece on Bernie, but believe it or not, Bernie's people are doing the exact same thing.