1. #16221
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    lol no, Bernie is not entitled to votes on the merit of not being trump. Fuck off with this bullshit ultimatum.
    Sorry, there is just so much hostility from these Biden Boys, I just can't support a candidate that produces such a toxic culture.

    ^ This logic swings many ways, not just against Sanders.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    Tankie Paleo-Conservatism with TERF characteristics / Socialism with My Chemical Romance characteristics. Caramelldansen Nationalism. Aimee Terese was right about Warren. Anti-HR Aktion. Bashar Al-Assad's runescape gf.

  2. #16222
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Sorry, there is just so much hostility from these Biden Boys, I just can't support a candidate that produces such a toxic culture.

    ^ This logic swings many ways, not just against Sanders.
    Except one is a response to the behavior of the supporters of a candidate. The post you're comparing it to is literally that Sanders supporter saying, "Give us our way or we'll fucking shoot you." in response to...nothing.

  3. #16223
    Quote Originally Posted by Grapemask View Post
    Except these last several democrats were not moderates. Whether Obama actually was a progressive or not - he spent his second term being firmly moderate/corporatist - he ran on a progressive platform. Bill Clinton was a wave of New Democrat, a progressive compared to the old democratic order. The last democrat before him was Carter, a progressive.

    Using data referred by starlord is where I generally have had to bow out, because if we're going to insist on another four years without first world healthcare, I have to watch my blood pressure. "Let me prove A by proving C instead" is where things start to head south.
    Obama was pretty centrist--he was against gay marriage, and his policy platform wasn't further to the left than Hillary's or Biden's, unless I'm forgetting something, which I may be. Biden came out and voiced his support for gay marriage before Obama had moved on it (yes, may have all been staged, I know, but even at that Obama was tiptoeing into moving left). What Obama did have was a ton of charisma. I do wish people would look at the data from 538 and the nytimes article I keep linking because it shows what motivated those voters, and it's contrary to what we've been telling ourselves.

  4. #16224
    Quote Originally Posted by Grapemask View Post
    Except these last several democrats were not moderates. Whether Obama actually was a progressive or not - he spent his second term being firmly moderate/corporatist - he ran on a progressive platform. Bill Clinton was a wave of New Democrat, a progressive compared to the old democratic order. The last democrat before him was Carter, a progressive.

    Using data referred by starlord is where I generally have had to bow out, because if we're going to insist on another four years without first world healthcare, I have to watch my blood pressure. "Let me prove A by proving C instead" is where things start to head south.
    if you've got something to dispute it beyond "4chan lol" by all means show it.

  5. #16225
    I am Murloc! Arch-Angel of Riots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    lol no, Bernie is not entitled to votes on the merit of not being trump. Fuck off with this bullshit ultimatum.
    And neither is the Democratic Party entitled to votes from people who they don't provide policies for.

    Politics isn't a cult. Nobody has to vote for conservative Biden if they don't feel he is someone who will serve them.
    .:: Welcome to MMO-C Off-topic, where most people believe that leftism means being capitalism's HR department ::.

  6. #16226
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    The Democrats were warned they had had their choice: "Bernie or Trump". They seemingly want to choose Trump.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    Politics isn't a cult.
    ???????????????????

  7. #16227
    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    lol no, Bernie is not entitled to votes on the merit of not being trump. Fuck off with this bullshit ultimatum.
    I see you chose Trump. Enjoy 4 more years of the candidate you wanted.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Yes, I think a company should be legally allowed to refuse to serve black people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I don't know what you are watching, but it isn't fucking reality.
    Hes talking about me saying Joe Biden has dementia. LOL

  8. #16228
    Quote Originally Posted by Jehct View Post
    I see you chose Trump. Enjoy 4 more years of the candidate you wanted.
    If you don't vote democrat..it's on you.

  9. #16229
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    And neither is the Democratic Party entitled to votes from people who they don't provide policies for.

    Politics isn't a cult. Nobody has to vote for conservative Biden if they don't feel he is someone who will serve them.
    We aren’t the ones talking about “our pick” or trump.

  10. #16230
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    So you're just helping out Trump - great. Thanks for clarifying that. And yes, I will shout down anyone who does personal attacks - that only helps Trump, and muddies the waters of people we're trying to win over.
    Sigh. The man has major flaws and it is ok to talk about them. You are becoming his Sarah Huckabee Sanders. It is fucking mind boggling how you don't see this behavior your exhibiting as fear based silliness that plays exactly into what I've been saying is the flaw of Dems.


    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    We are not using the same strategy. You think we are because...why again. How anyone can rationally think "we're doing the same thing as 2016" is beyond me. We know what went wrong, in multiple areas, and we're fixing that this time around. Biden is a great choice for a number of categories - the fact that you don't agree doesn't make you right, it just makes you disagree.

    Do you understand that you thinking you're right, doesn't make you right. And the facts clearly demonstrate that we are doing things much different this time around. How you ask?

    1. we are not underestimating Trump.
    2. we are flooding the midwest states with campaigning - which was ignored in 2016
    3. we are not running Hillary (despite you claiming they are the same candidate, they are not - and the facts back this up)
    4. we are simplifying messaging
    5. we are making this a referendum on Trump's presidency
    6. we are wooing Obama2012----->Trump2016 voters
    7. we are picking a better Vice President candidate

    Much more. It's not at all the same.
    1. the hell we aren't.
    2. And?
    3. You keep saying they are different, and offering literally nothing to say how.
    4. In what way?
    5. Again, and?
    6. How? Hillary was part of his cabinet too you know.
    7. Who is that?

    See this post:
    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    lol no, Bernie is not entitled to votes on the merit of not being trump. Fuck off with this bullshit ultimatum.
    This ^ is because you guys refuse to hear these people. You categorically dismiss them and their frustrations. So they make these statements. Woo them, instead of acting exactly like them and shitting on them for being upset.
    Last edited by Bodakane; 2020-03-13 at 08:43 PM.
    When I despair, I remember that all through history, there have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they seem invincible.
    But in the end, they always fall. Always.- Mahatma Gandhi


  11. #16231
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    If you don't vote democrat..it's on you.
    You surely didn't vote democrat. If you voted Biden you basically gave Trump the presidency for free.

    You were warned. Sanders or Trump. You chose Trump. that's on you bud.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Yes, I think a company should be legally allowed to refuse to serve black people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I don't know what you are watching, but it isn't fucking reality.
    Hes talking about me saying Joe Biden has dementia. LOL

  12. #16232
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodakane View Post
    Once again, i challenge you to explain why those people voted for Trump over Hillary and why those reasons are different now that Biden is the nom.
    I keep linking it. Conservative Democrats supported Sanders over Clinton, and they supported Biden over Sanders. These are Democratic voters who not only have very conservative views on race and gender, they call themselves moderate or conservative. Democratic voters who are too--let's use this phrase again-- "gender traditionalist" to vote for Clinton have a fair amount in common with actual Republicans, and less with progressives. That accounts for people who voted for Sanders and Trump over Clinton and why they would vote for Biden over both Sanders and Trump.

  13. #16233
    I am Murloc! Arch-Angel of Riots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    We aren’t the ones talking about “our pick” or trump.
    It isn't about "our pick", it's about the fact that centrist Democrat politicians have failed the country already for the past few decades.

    Fact: They can't even get rid of Trump, the most incompetent and dumbest president in the history of the USA, who openly commits crimes... They can't get rid of him. They have no clue how to get anything done when it isn't filling their own pockets with money or screwing over the common people.

    There are countless people who support Bernie because they are literally fighting for their lives. There are countless people fed up with the status quo. If americans don't stop being ideological cowards and don't start supporting more left-wing candidates you're going to get the Joker - Gotham style activism happening in a few years from now instead. I'm sure that'll be taken as a threat, but that is simply the reality of things. I can't change that, I can't change or stop people fighting for their livelihoods or stop people from finally snapping and saying "enough is enough".

    Trump was caused and continues to be by the incompetence of centrist Democrats.
    .:: Welcome to MMO-C Off-topic, where most people believe that leftism means being capitalism's HR department ::.

  14. #16234
    Quote Originally Posted by Jehct View Post
    You surely didn't vote democrat. If you voted Biden you basically gave Trump the presidency for free.
    You were warned. Sanders or Trump. You chose Trump. that's on you bud.
    NJ here...
    And I suspect you're responsible for the president today.
    Just own up to it already!

  15. #16235
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    NJ here...
    And I suspect you're responsible for the president today.
    Just own up to it already!
    Nah that was the DNC in 2016. Do you not keep up on what happens in politics?
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Yes, I think a company should be legally allowed to refuse to serve black people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I don't know what you are watching, but it isn't fucking reality.
    Hes talking about me saying Joe Biden has dementia. LOL

  16. #16236
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    Fact: They can't even get rid of Trump, the most incompetent and dumbest president in the history of the USA, who openly commits crimes... They can't get rid of him. They have no clue how to get anything done when it isn't filling their own pockets with money or screwing over the common people.
    Fact: Neither can progressives, because they haven't succeeded either.

    Your move, Kasparov.

  17. #16237
    Quote Originally Posted by Jehct View Post
    Nah that was the DNC in 2016. Do you not keep up on what happens in politics?
    Can we dial the concern trolling back to at least a 5?

  18. #16238
    I am Murloc! Arch-Angel of Riots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Fact: Neither can progressives, because they haven't succeeded either.

    Your move, Kasparov.
    Well, if establishment Democrats spent more time actually opposing Trump instead of making bank from super-PACs pretending to be against him and spent less time trying to boycott progressivism within the USA they might actually get done what the people want: getting rid of Trump.
    .:: Welcome to MMO-C Off-topic, where most people believe that leftism means being capitalism's HR department ::.

  19. #16239
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    Politics isn't a cult. Nobody has to vote for conservative Biden if they don't feel he is someone who will serve them.
    I love that you think someone isn't going to win the General election. When you put that together, please take a look at your statement above. We'll wait.

  20. #16240
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    Well, if establishment Democrats spent more time actually opposing Trump
    Other than some regular order business like budgets and passing the updated NAFTA 1.01 USMCA...what haven't they opposed him on?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    instead of making bank from super-PACs pretending to be against him
    Ah, to live in your fictional world.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    and spent less time trying to boycott progressivism within the USA
    Honey, Justice Democrats are getting their butts kicked up and down the field. They're not boycotting anything, they're just largely ignoring an irrelevant group that's trying to crush Democratics political hopes by putting up no-chance progressives in purple districts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    they might actually get done what the people want: getting rid of Trump.
    How you gonna do that with 53 Republicans in the Senate, again? How are you going to get 19 of them to flip? You need 66 to remove him.

    This is political reality, the actual world. Not your fictional nonsense where you think you'll get something accomplished by posting 4chan memer videos.

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