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  1. #81
    The Lightbringer Lollis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zyrinx View Post
    So regarding the Bee events... I did my first one today and was basically told The Strategy is, if you are under 430 ilvl, don't attack anything as you slow down the event. Tag the boss guy at 10%

    I can't know if this is actually true, it didn't work in this case, 3rd boss ran away at 25%

    Not to put too fine a point on it, but this is shit design that people even THINK this is the way to do this encounter. Absolute garbage.
    Others probably tagged stuff when they shouldn't. Basically each person attacking a mob makes the hp scale, below a certain ilevel (and dps output) a player tagging causes a detrimental effect on the event. The timer for the event means that if you are either bad ilevel, or are tagging as a tank or healer, you are just slowing it down for everyone. If your DPS isn't great, aim to tag at like 5% or so because there is a delay in the hp scaling coming into effect. You don't even need to be tagging everything in the whole event, i've joined late as a tank and hit the mob with like 50k hp remaining and still got 14 jellies.

    I can one hit most of the none "boss" mobs with a glacial spike on my main, but when multiple people start hitting it and quadrupling the hp when they don't have the dps to keep up with the scaling it just means it takes longer to kill.
    Speciation Is Gradual

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyrinx View Post
    So regarding the Bee events... I did my first one today and was basically told The Strategy is, if you are under 430 ilvl, don't attack anything as you slow down the event. Tag the boss guy at 10%
    Yes, please believe elitist players that tell you not to play the game.

    Rares have scaled with the number of attacking players since the Timeless Isle, I think. Another player attacking (or healing attackers) doesn't even add 100% of the base health.
    Maybe if you know you don't do much DPS (fresh maxlevel, healer spec, RL distractions) you can make your own decision to only tag at lower health percentages. Otherwise, the effect will be minimal even if you do shitty DPS, and that's relativized even more by the number of other players attacking the mob.

  3. #83
    I play in an RP realm where we have no one focused on such elitist bullshit and in most events I've been in we consistently get past wave 15 (best was wave 19)
    Just play the game.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Lollis View Post
    Others probably tagged stuff when they shouldn't. Basically each person attacking a mob makes the hp scale, below a certain ilevel (and dps output) a player tagging causes a detrimental effect on the event. The timer for the event means that if you are either bad ilevel, or are tagging as a tank or healer, you are just slowing it down for everyone. If your DPS isn't great, aim to tag at like 5% or so because there is a delay in the hp scaling coming into effect. You don't even need to be tagging everything in the whole event, i've joined late as a tank and hit the mob with like 50k hp remaining and still got 14 jellies.

    I can one hit most of the none "boss" mobs with a glacial spike on my main, but when multiple people start hitting it and quadrupling the hp when they don't have the dps to keep up with the scaling it just means it takes longer to kill.
    I know everything in this post. I understand how scaling works.

    It's horribad design of an encounter and nothing could possibly convince me otherwise.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I play in an RP realm where we have no one focused on such elitist bullshit and in most events I've been in we consistently get past wave 15 (best was wave 19)
    Just play the game.
    That's great to hear, actually.

  5. #85
    The stings and arrows of outrageous fortune.
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  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Yes, please believe elitist players that tell you not to play the game.

    Rares have scaled with the number of attacking players since the Timeless Isle, I think. Another player attacking (or healing attackers) doesn't even add 100% of the base health.
    Maybe if you know you don't do much DPS (fresh maxlevel, healer spec, RL distractions) you can make your own decision to only tag at lower health percentages. Otherwise, the effect will be minimal even if you do shitty DPS, and that's relativized even more by the number of other players attacking the mob.
    This is the only rare that I know of that has such a tight timer that world scaling generally makes it impossible for anyone below 430 to not be an active hindrance on the encounter. In fact, it's the only world encounter with any sort of timer, at all.

    Bad. Design.

  7. #87
    The horde attacking mobs to end the event early is hilarious.

    PVPFOREVA!

  8. #88
    Yep, the people saying that are basically correct, and yes it is bad design. World content should not get harder with more players contributing.

  9. #89
    i prefer this bumblebee as a mount

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    Yep, the people saying that are basically correct, and yes it is bad design. World content should not get harder with more players contributing.
    I even understand the intent: 40 people v. 1 Mob that doesnt scale _at all_ would be bad design as well (it'd basically be trying to tag Nalak before he explodes in 1 GCD).

    It's just WAY overtuned, so people have to resort to having people do nothing... to speed the encounter. If it was tuned for like ilvl350 DPS, it'd be just fine. I expect they'll adjust it to be honest.

  11. #91
    The target itemlvl isn't really the issue; it should be tuned for ilvl 385 because that's the catch-up for 8.2.5. And it probably is. The problem is the timer is actually really tight and health scales really high, over 30 million, maybe all the way up to 40 players.

    So they could relax the timer by quite a lot, or reduce health scaling per player, or reduce the number of players it scales up to. My preference would be the latter, capping it at 20 players. So if you have 20 itemlvl 385 players and they all actually play properly, you get 15 stacks. If your raid's itemlvl is higher and/or you have over 20 players, you'll probably max out at 20 stacks and finish way early.

    That would obviously be much easier, but also more fun, and more appropriate for world content that most people will immediately stop doing once they get their mount.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyrinx View Post
    I even understand the intent: 40 people v. 1 Mob that doesnt scale _at all_ would be bad design as well (it'd basically be trying to tag Nalak before he explodes in 1 GCD).

    It's just WAY overtuned, so people have to resort to having people do nothing... to speed the encounter. If it was tuned for like ilvl350 DPS, it'd be just fine. I expect they'll adjust it to be honest.
    I don't think it is overtuned. It is just like m+. It scales to infinity - in this case infinite waves (disregarding time needed to spawn here). And if the reward scales linearly or better with waves you just want more waves to get more bang for your time spent. Relaxing the timer isn't doing that. It just makes doing the events more tedious because you have to spend maybe 7 minutes each or something like that instead of the current 5 minute timer.
    Utilizing scaling here to make everybody be able to tag isn't wrong. It's fine. But maybe it wouldn't be too much ask for people that farm it to understand how it works a little bit and in their own interest - the increased reward - to only tag the minibosses since they are lootable separately and to tag those late if they are undergeared.
    Tbh what would be interesting is to find out what the reward structure is at each wave you reached and how much tryharding really achieves.

    And on a different note: given my initial track record of farming with the goggles I think the events are not worth doing anymore at that reputations stage if you don't need or already have gotten the reputation items for the week if you get less than 30 thin jelly (this is a fairly low estimate tbh - a wowhead user stated results that would put this to ~64 if you have a jelly magnet and farm at an opportune time) for any given event. And with worth doing I mean actively spending those 5 min participating and not just tagging as you fly by farming. Not sure what wave 30 thin jelly would correspond to but I guess that probably is more than wave 25.
    Last edited by Deiae; 2019-10-04 at 12:29 AM.

  13. #93
    They definitely are not worth doing after revered after you get all the 750 rep drops from rares.

    Faction rep isn't the problem, anyway. After you hit exalted there's a ton of grinding to get your bee grown.

  14. #94
    Banned Ealyssa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    ...which is merely a kneejerk player reaction to slight advantages in racials a few expansions ago.
    No it's actually more of a "why the fuck split the PVE players population in two" situation...

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Ealyssa View Post
    No it's actually more of a "why the fuck split the PVE players population in two" situation...
    Well, with some luck, that won't be much of an issue in the next expansion.

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