1. #64861
    They had to touch the experience again...

  2. #64862
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    I wouldnt necessarily assume that what we see on the Beta is what the game will be like on live, could be that Flayed Shot was overtuned and everyone was just using the others to test out potentially broken strats. Might also be that it was nerfed because at least with MM it is the only ability that interracts with a talent, which Blizzard might be banking on players choosing.
    I think its because, and i hope this isnt the case, because it was actualy super good with survival, survival mastery increased the damage of both flayed shot and kill shot, for example surv mastery u can get like 60% increased dmg with a mastery set
    but nobody even plays survival so 1 thing making it decent being nerfed is kinda lame
    Last edited by arandomuser; 2020-10-21 at 09:05 PM.

  3. #64863
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Personally I am putting my money on a Necrolord themed raid featuring Kel'thuzad as a first bet, and generic Torghast themed raid as a second bet.

    I am of the belief that there will be a raid themed after each covenant, and a Naxxramas 3.0 Necrolord themed raid with Kel'thuzad just fits all too well, especially considering that the Necrolords are the covenant the closest to being "done" after the Venthyr are through with Nathria.
    Torghast or otherwise generic Maw raid is a distinct possibility to be sure, but I feel it is too early for that unless Blizzard intends to go for a WoD style twist where the main antagonist of the expansion simply changes in the middle.
    Well, if we go by the amount of raids from the last expansion, you could be right. We have three Covenants plus Maw left and Legion and BfA each had 5 raids (four big ones and the small one). So this could indeed happen.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  4. #64864
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Well, if we go by the amount of raids from the last expansion, you could be right. We have three Covenants plus Maw left and Legion and BfA each had 5 raids (four big ones and the small one). So this could indeed happen.
    Mostly I think it would work because Covenants are such a major part of the experience that each one deserves its time in the spotlight where all the quests are about building up to a raid that will fix whatever problem is plagueing that area.

    For Venthyr there is obviously the class divide and general problem created by Denathrius, we solve it by defeating him in a raid.
    For Necrolords there is the infighting, at least partially caused by Kel'thuzad, and I am pretty sure he isnt fully defeated at the end of the Necrolord campaign.
    The Night Fae has the Drust, which fits perfectly as a 9.2 "breather" patch in a similar vein to how 8.2 was all about Naga, or 5.2 was all about the Thunder King.
    The Kyrians are the most vague, but with Uther damning Arthas in the Afterlives short I imagine a raid would be a perfect capstone to that story.

    In short it isnt necessarily about just giving each covenant a raid just because, but rather that they are each important enough that even a player that only picked a single covenant deserves to have a truly epic moment in the expansion dedicated to their choice, and nothing is quite as epic as a raid.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  5. #64865
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Why in the ass elemental shaman still have this garbage mechanic of maelstron, i though they had removed this shit?

  6. #64866
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    Why in the ass elemental shaman still have this garbage mechanic of maelstron, i though they had removed this shit?
    And then they brought it back because they couldn't make Fulmination (the WoD mechanic) work with AoE / Earthquake. It isn't too bad, but Elemental Shaman has the same problem as many other specs, a) lackluster Covenant abilities, b) bad talents, c) some skills that scale really badly (Earth Shock should be the finisher but hits like a wet noodle) and d) horrible Potency Conduits (for Elemental pretty much all of them suck).

    The bigger problem is though, as we progress towards 60, we all get weaker. This was a huge problem of BfA and it will be a huge problem in Shadowlands, were you'll be the weakest at max level because bad (leveling) gear, no Azerite traits / Essence anymore and lack of Legendaries / stats.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  7. #64867
    Serpentstalker legendary just got -deleted- today. Good riddance.

  8. #64868
    Quote Originally Posted by sensei- View Post
    Serpentstalker legendary just got -deleted- today. Good riddance.
    At least the new version means the Serpent sting talent will see some use.
    Not as a choice anyone will actually pick of course, but at least the ability will be seen as anything but the current "pick anything but this" talent.

    Honestly though, I really don't get why the first MM row is not being changed, nothing short of a complete spec overhaul will make those talents thematically fitting or even good
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  9. #64869
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Well, if we go by the amount of raids from the last expansion, you could be right. We have three Covenants plus Maw left and Legion and BfA each had 5 raids (four big ones and the small one). So this could indeed happen.
    There's a lot to say it won't happen. The raids are not equal, especially the mini-raid that's placed either 2nd (Legion) or 3rd (BfA). So which Covenant gets to be screwed and have their raid only have 3 bosses? Also, the final raid in an xpac is much more prominent than the others. Uldir only lasted four and a half months before BoD was released, while Nyalotha will last close to a year before Nathria opens. So which Covenant gets special treatment, thus ruining the Blizzard value of balance?

    This also places a creative limitation on Blizzard, where they otherwise can tell a story that spans the entire expansion not restricted to a certain zone or covenant per story beat.

    Either the Maw or a place not yet released would be a logical destination for a final raid, the culmination of the xpac's story.

    The inspiration behind Shadowlands and Covenants is the Lovecraft-infused Dark Souls. What that should tell us is that Blizzard wants to move in a more creative direction, and the not terrible, but somewhat cheesy idea of "one raid per zone per covenant" would not impress Hidetaka Miyazaki.

  10. #64870
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yunzi View Post
    There's a lot to say it won't happen. The raids are not equal, especially the mini-raid that's placed either 2nd (Legion) or 3rd (BfA). So which Covenant gets to be screwed and have their raid only have 3 bosses? Also, the final raid in an xpac is much more prominent than the others. Uldir only lasted four and a half months before BoD was released, while Nyalotha will last close to a year before Nathria opens. So which Covenant gets special treatment, thus ruining the Blizzard value of balance?

    This also places a creative limitation on Blizzard, where they otherwise can tell a story that spans the entire expansion not restricted to a certain zone or covenant per story beat.

    Either the Maw or a place not yet released would be a logical destination for a final raid, the culmination of the xpac's story.

    The inspiration behind Shadowlands and Covenants is the Lovecraft-infused Dark Souls. What that should tell us is that Blizzard wants to move in a more creative direction, and the not terrible, but somewhat cheesy idea of "one raid per zone per covenant" would not impress Hidetaka Miyazaki.
    Dark Souls when it comes to story is basically make it super vague as fuck, Warcraft is anything but that.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance #TeamNoBlueHorde

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  11. #64871
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    At least the new version means the Serpent sting talent will see some use.
    Not as a choice anyone will actually pick of course, but at least the ability will be seen as anything but the current "pick anything but this" talent.

    Honestly though, I really don't get why the first MM row is not being changed, nothing short of a complete spec overhaul will make those talents thematically fitting or even good
    Frost mages need to get deleted next. Then beta m+ starts to make some sense again.

  12. #64872
    Quote Originally Posted by Yunzi View Post
    The inspiration behind Shadowlands and Covenants is the Lovecraft-infused Dark Souls. What that should tell us is that Blizzard wants to move in a more creative direction, and the not terrible, but somewhat cheesy idea of "one raid per zone per covenant" would not impress Hidetaka Miyazaki.
    I honestly don't see any resemblance of Dark Souls in Shadowlands (funny enough, just finishing Dark Souls 2 SotfS right now).

    A plausible thing would be the Maw raid as the final raid of the expansion, akin to the Argus stuff in Legion. The other Covenants / raids... I don't really think it matters much. Nightfae could have the small raid (2-3 bosses) with Gorak Thul as the end boss. Bastion could have some kind of angelic raid where something with Uther and Arthas happens (to be honest, I have zero interest in that story) and Necrolords... no idea.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  13. #64873
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    They don't we do but....shitposting is more popular.






    ...No they didn't say that and stop with this self unnecessary bitterness.
    They actually did say that for the m+ cache in BfA beta

    They changed how azerite gear was awarded in it about 3 weeks before the beta went offline then when the first reset hit live the players noticed and were told by devs on Twitter “the change was in for weeks on beta and nobody complained so it’s not a problem”

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    If it it's not a bug it may be encouraging people to congregate in their covenant halls instead.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The prize is Anduin. There's also a mention that Anduin is being turned into a weapon somehow.
    I mean the point of the dummies being there was to test the covenant abilities before choosing and since some require targets the dummies were used.

    Now we can’t use them.... because they decided to make the change and the reason doesn’t matter

  14. #64874
    Well I know Blizz wanted more diversity in SW and stuff but I didn't expect them to go this far.



  15. #64875
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    There comes a time when Blizzard needs to make the changes for what the game will actually look like though. The Flaskertaur needs to be removed eventually, even if that screws up someones testing process.
    So does that mean we won’t be able to test covenant abilities before pledging ourselves to one?? The change actually goes against what the entire room was supposed to be for

  16. #64876
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    They actually did say that for the m+ cache in BfA beta

    They changed how azerite gear was awarded in it about 3 weeks before the beta went offline then when the first reset hit live the players noticed and were told by devs on Twitter “the change was in for weeks on beta and nobody complained so it’s not a problem”

    Which clearly wasn't an issue or not important enough so again not something to moan about.


    So does that mean we won’t be able to test covenant abilities before pledging ourselves to one?? The change actually goes against what the entire room was supposed to be for
    I mean there are other places to test covanent abilities other then test dummies.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance #TeamNoBlueHorde

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  17. #64877
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Which clearly wasn't an issue or not important enough so again not something to moan about.


    I mean there are other places to test covanent abilities other then test dummies.
    1. It was actually a big deal and it’s why we got residuum in 9.1 because blizzard realized they screwed up by making that change and had bad PR....you realize that the change they had in on that week was actually a big deal for most ppl who enjoyed m+ and even raiding so to those groups it was a big deal. Criticizing dumb decisions from blizz and calling out their BS isn’t whining it’s actually how shit gets fixed.


    Name one place that you can test the covenant abilities in the same fashion as that room with the dummies
    Meaning
    Instant cd reset for the long ones
    Swappable in about 5 seconds for quick tests

    The answer is there is none and you just don’t wanna say “yeah the change is dumb”

  18. #64878
    Quote Originally Posted by Cherry123 View Post


    we never know anything about sylvanas plan lol
    need more expansion for Sylvanas' genius plan
    nobody told taelia the pronoun game sucks balls

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Which clearly wasn't an issue or not important enough so again not something to moan about.


    I mean there are other places to test covanent abilities other then test dummies.
    it was enough of an issue to cause the residuum system to exist

    i get it dude you like blizz but the devs make dumb moves and need told when they do something dumb otherwise we would have
    no flight
    the original azerite gear
    no residuum
    no essence vendor
    no azerite vendor
    the old m+ affixes
    the requirement to grind champions rep on your character for the heart ilvl boost instead of the account wide unlock
    the same requirement for islands
    no islands vendor
    TF on gear still which leads to more dead loot

    id rather be called a whiner by people who want to agree with the devs if it means getting things fixed

  19. #64879
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Well I know Blizz wanted more diversity in SW and stuff but I didn't expect them to go this far.

    [IMG]
    I mean, i know they say "never skip leg day", but i think these two are overdoing it.

  20. #64880
    ok so launch day speculation
    book pushed back again undoubtedly to tie into the launch (book before the launch because it somehow ties into the shadowlands according to T&E)
    this means possible launch on the 8th of december
    mythic raid launches the 4th of january
    this allows the RWF to be over by the blizzcon replacement(the bosses even on mythic are not that tough especially with the fact players will now have the more powerful soulbind traits earlier)
    9.1 announcement on the 19th or 20th of february
    9.1 hits ptr maybe 2 weeks after
    9.1 launch around july

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