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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirain1 View Post
    It’s ignorant to think that classic won’t be successful. Can’t wait for the release


    XD
    I don’t think anyone is questioning that it’ll be successful. It’ll have a huge amount of players the first months.

    But people are treating it as a second coming of mmorpg Christ that will obliterate retail. Which it won’t. Come any major content patch in retail and people will start to focus on that.

    Most players will treat Classic as a game to play from time to time. Especially during content droughts.

    When it all boils down it’s money going to Blizzard.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by HollyCarp View Post
    Please pardon me for not reading through 21 pages of comments to see if this has already been touched on. But I wonder if the OP (or how many other people) remember that Classic is bound to have a lot of the inconveniences that many "modern" players take for granted.

    --BASE RUNNING SPEED max until level 40 (unless you're a hunter with Aspect of the Cheetah-- and remember that in Classic, you get dazed when hit while in that aspect)

    --Paladin and Warlock level 60 mounts gated behind very long and troublesome quest lines. And not exactly cheap either, especially when the strongest mobs dropped tiny amounts of coin

    --mounts, pets and quest items took up precious inventory space (remember, 16 slots was the MAX bag size and most people couldn't afford those; I was lucky to have 14 slots for one or two bags)

    --Vanilla WoW had no GF where a group was automatically teleported to a dungeon-- you had to hoof it. Hell I remember once for friggin' SETHEKK HALLS (which won't be available in classic) I was the only one running there (you had to be level 70 to fly, and I wasn't there-- and anyway, Classic will not have flying mounts), almost dying numerous times, while every other one of the players sat in TOWN, *SCREAMING* how they're all gonna quit unless they get a summon via the stone. When nobody else was around the stone for miles and I finally put a foot down saying SOMEONE had to get the HELL off their lazy butt, a measly five seconds later I was the only one left in the group. Now imagine this in "Classic WoW?"

    --Elite quests and areas requiring groups (Remember Stromgarde?). If you had a partner who IRL was a 13 year old kid and their mother suddenly demanded they get off the computer this instant to clean their room, either you hearthstoned really quick or you got mudhole stomped by repops.

    --For Blacksmiths, Dark Iron gear could only be forged in Blackrock Depths. (I think you STILL need to do that today, but back then, Dark Iron was the strongest mail and plate gear in the game).

    --Raids demanded Attunement-- long, tedious and expensive. AND it took up a precious inventory slot, because if you left the token in the vault back in Stormwind or Orgrimmar? OOPS! *ACCESS DENIED*

    --speaking of raids, very specific classes and specs and roles were demanded. Druids not in resto spec weren't allowed to raid. They weren't allowed to anything except cast innervate on the priests. Paladins were told to just cast greater blessing over and over and over-- and in those days you had to bless EACH individual member, not the whole group. Those blessings lasted five measly minutes so by the time you finished, it was time to start all over! Not to mention greater blessings demanded reagents that you had to buy from a vendor.

    --speaking of reagents, remember soul shards for warlocks? Took up precious inventory space?

    --No easy access between Eastern Kingdoms and Kalimdor. At least, not for the Alliance. Baby Night Elves wanting to quest outside Stormwind had to run through the level 20+ Wetlands, and crocolisks would come running from MILES away for a bite of tender baby night elf meat. Then the level 10-20 Loch Modan. I don't even remember where the Horde Zeppelins went, outside of between Ratchet in the Barrens (just one zone then) and Booty Bay (STV was a bad part of town in those days).

    --Much fewer class/race combos. There was no "ANY race could be a hunter" in those days. ONLY Alliance could be Paladins and ONLY Horde could be Shamans.

    --Speaking of Shamans, totems took up inventory space and were mandatory for any totem-based spells.


    ...shall I go on?

    Maybe these weren't game breakers but they were serious PITAS, and I wonder how many people will go running to WoW Classic, run into all of them, and promptly go "(CENSORED) this (CENSORED)!!!!!!!!"
    Oh, don't worry... you're almost two years late. All those points (and others) were discussed to death and they are precisely what we want back. The "World" part of World of Warcraft.

    BfA players can keep playing this modern hyper-fast, mythic-or-die Diablocraft game and everyone is happy.

  3. #423
    The Insane FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toffmcsoft View Post
    We all know how the subs work. It's how we interpret them. Trust me, my sub is not for retail.

    - - - Updated - - -



    We shall know in the coming months .
    Everyone is strongly underestimating the impact classic wow will have.

    Think about it from this perspective:
    1. Every popular streamer will be on the hype train for each phase of classic.
    2. Classic wow pserver players are signing up
    3. Retail players are switching over
    4. Players from 15 years ago are coming back

    I can tell you first hand as we have been actively guild recruiting for 4 months now.
    The last 2 weeks we are averaging 12-15 applicants a day! The hype is beyond real.

    I wouldn't be surprised if classic wow trumps retail numbers by the 2nd week of Sept.

    - - - Updated - - -




    The whole point is to get back to a game that doesn't have all the Ool changes... This is what's great about it being a true MMORPG. The more time people invest into their character the stronger they are they others.
    1. incorrect, there is many popular streamers that will not be touching classic at all
    2. and many are not, many are staying on pservers
    3. and many are not
    4. and many are not...
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    Azerite is absolutely RNG you are right. You have no idea what traits will be on that piece you got from a random source until you roll it. I've literally had a Warfront piece that had the "opposite faction" passive and no passive/proc for my spec but it did for the other 2.

  4. #424
    I doubt numbers will stabilize at any point. Classic will have phases that are similar to retail patches and will generate an influx of players when released. And they will probably not coincide with one another. When one of them is in a dry phase, the other will rise up and vice versa.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    Classic is being made specifically for people who have already played vanilla, mostly on pservers.

    Shoo, troll.
    Go back and read my post, I mean actually read it. At what point did I say that ridiculous drivel that Classic "sucks?" I played Vanilla, myself, maybe starting in 2005 instead of at launch, but sure, I liked it. What I didn't like was having to throw out something I could vendor every time I picked up a quest item, or having to throw out pets and not buy mounts because I didn't have space to carry them. I loved the different races and classes, I didn't like having to wait til near the end of the journey to see the other continent because I'd die umpteen times trying to get there, otherwise. What I don't like is people going "ZOMFG this is going to be the best thing in the history of MMOs and how *DARE* you say otherwize (insert 50 gazillion exclamation points)" No it's not. It's going to have a lot of good--but also a lot of PITAS that only hardcore players are going to like. Kind of like a pre-baby boomer going, "Kids! Why in my day we hadda climb uphill in no shoes, for two miles, in bitter cold and blizzards, to school each day HMPH!"

    Maybe you're the troll, you know why they say, Never ASSUME.

    Quote Originally Posted by marcosmcc View Post
    Oh, don't worry... you're almost two years late. All those points (and others) were discussed to death and they are precisely what we want back. The "World" part of World of Warcraft.
    Well, if you specifically WANT never having the inventory space for anything but reagents, a couple of essential mounts, no pets, and spare ammo (lots of people want that back, but maybe increase the size of a quiver so we don't need to fill an entire bag with it?), and not having enough gold for attunement or a warlock mount, and being expected to run to the dungeon and then find someone to help you use the stone to summon four lazy-assed people sitting in town (Yes, I actually had an entire group DISBAND on me for that alone-- so much for, "We want EXPLORATION," eh?), then knock yourself out. Of Course, Classic WoW will be fun, I wouldn't have stayed until just before the end of Legion if it wasn't, you know? But it's also going to have a lot of inconveniences that many people are going to get pretty ticked off at. It's not going to be one big party.

    And anyway, if it's all about the journey, sooner or later you're going to hit level 60 and reach the finish line. Then what? Start all over on a new toon? You need SOMETHING to do at max level, don't you? There was a new somewhat futuristic RPG, I don't even remember the name of it, one of the classes or professions was "Builder," that focused on building homes and even towns... it barely lasted a year, if even. Why? Because sooner or later players reached max level and there was hardly anything left to do. It was like, "You reached the end of the internet. Now log off and go read a book!" So guess what-- they did. You might be completely correct in that they made the journey to reach max level too much of a speed race and hardly consequential. You might be angry PRECISELY because it takes less than a year to reach max level-- it took me pretty close, I started WoW in mid 2005 and hit 60 for the first time just a month or two before BC launched. But if you have nothing to do when you eventually get there? What are you going to play?
    Last edited by HollyCarp; 2019-08-05 at 10:46 PM.

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by Enabrann View Post
    Since Classic is going to have Millions more players than Retail, shouldn't it be "You pay the Classic subscription, you get Retail for free"?

    Instead of the other way around?[/B]
    So it matters to you in what order it's phrased? Seriously?

    Classic will have a lot of players on Day 1, no doubt. Classic will probably not have a lot of players on Day 120. Only the truly dedicated will remain.

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by HollyCarp View Post
    Go back and read my post, I mean actually read it. At what point did I say that ridiculous drivel that Classic "sucks?" I played Vanilla, myself, maybe starting in 2005 instead of at launch, but sure, I liked it. What I didn't like was having to throw out something I could vendor every time I picked up a quest item, or having to throw out pets and not buy mounts because I didn't have space to carry them. I loved the different races and classes, I didn't like having to wait til near the end of the journey to see the other continent because I'd die umpteen times trying to get there, otherwise. What I don't like is people going "ZOMFG this is going to be the best thing in the history of MMOs and how *DARE* you say otherwize (insert 50 gazillion exclamation points)" No it's not. It's going to have a lot of good--but also a lot of PITAS that only hardcore players are going to like. Kind of like a pre-baby boomer going, "Kids! Why in my day we hadda climb uphill in no shoes, for two miles, in bitter cold and blizzards, to school each day HMPH!"

    Maybe you're the troll, you know why they say, Never ASSUME.



    Well, if you specifically WANT never having the inventory space for anything but reagents, a couple of essential mounts, no pets, and spare ammo (lots of people want that back, but maybe increase the size of a quiver so we don't need to fill an entire bag with it?), and not having enough gold for attunement or a warlock mount, and being expected to run to the dungeon and then find someone to help you use the stone to summon four lazy-assed people sitting in town (Yes, I actually had an entire group DISBAND on me for that alone-- so much for, "We want EXPLORATION," eh?), then knock yourself out. Of Course, Classic WoW will be fun, I wouldn't have stayed until just before the end of Legion if it wasn't, you know? But it's also going to have a lot of inconveniences that many people are going to get pretty ticked off at. It's not going to be one big party.

    And anyway, if it's all about the journey, sooner or later you're going to hit level 60 and reach the finish line. Then what? Start all over on a new toon? You need SOMETHING to do at max level, don't you? There was a new somewhat futuristic RPG, I don't even remember the name of it, one of the classes or professions was "Builder," that focused on building homes and even towns... it barely lasted a year, if even. Why? Because sooner or later players reached max level and there was hardly anything left to do. It was like, "You reached the end of the internet. Now log off and go read a book!" So guess what-- they did. You might be completely correct in that they made the journey to reach max level too much of a speed race and hardly consequential. You might be angry PRECISELY because it takes less than a year to reach max level-- it took me pretty close, I started WoW in mid 2005 and hit 60 for the first time just a month or two before BC launched. But if you have nothing to do when you eventually get there? What are you going to play?
    Again: what you call inconvenience is actually a game design decision. Decisions made with the purpose of making WoW a World and very social game from level 1.

    Do you think the developers couldn't just teleport everyone around like GMs or let them fly since the beginning? Having more bag space than you can wish for?

    And yeah, if I get a character to 60 in Classic and manage to clear Molten Core, it means I already invested more time in this game than every other game I played besides DotA and WoW itself. If I quit because I have nothing to do (which is untrue of course), I already invested a huge chunk of time on it, so that's not a problem at all.

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    top 1000 is not competitive lols you said competitive
    Top 1000 guilds routinely clear instances on Mythic. I don't really see how that's any different than clearing every boss in Vanilla.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by marcosmcc View Post
    Again: what you call inconvenience is actually a game design decision.
    That's a rather meaningless thing to say. Both statements ("inconvenience" and "game design decision") are not mutually exclusive. Inconveniences can be game design decisions, and often are. He's not talking about a bug that inconveniences players, but actual "game design decisions" that are inconvenient.
    I did a Necromancer thing. Check it out! All feedback welcome!
    Update 08/17: I changed how the Bone spec's golem mechanic works, as well as some other minor changes.
    I also did a Bard thing! Questions, comments and ideas, all welcome!
    Update 09/02: Apparently the mods decided to merge my class concept thread with an existing one.

  10. #430
    I hope to have big polulation because will be hard to fill 40 man raids

  11. #431
    High Overlord CapybaraSlayer's Avatar
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    That's a bit outrageous to say. I 99% think it will surpass retail, but BFA is a major disappointment so that's not saying much. As long as Blizzard keeps supporting the servers I don't care if 100,000 people are playing or 10,000,000, just give me my damn PvE server so I don't have to play on pservers with 100 people on at peak hours.

  12. #432
    Launch week, maybe a million or so.

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    Top 1000 guilds routinely clear instances on Mythic. I don't really see how that's any different than clearing every boss in Vanilla.
    Very big difference because gear is much easier to attain and completely overgearing mythic bosses even end bosses is common by the end of tiers.

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    top 1000 is not competitive lols you said competitive
    Clearing all mythic raid content before the next patch, preferably with a few months++ or so to farm it, to me is competitive. Regardless of w.e rank is.

  15. #435
    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlz View Post
    Clearing all mythic raid content before the next patch, preferably with a few months++ or so to farm it, to me is competitive. Regardless of w.e rank is.
    I mean it's not but okay

  16. #436
    Bloodsail Admiral Ermelloth's Avatar
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    WoTLK had best class / spec design, game depth and balance.
    Pity they went with Vanilla instead

    I'd rather stay in BFA, cause I don't want to play a 1-button Vanilla Ret. No thanks.

  17. #437
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    I mean it's not but okay
    It is. How's your mythic guild ranked?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    Very big difference because gear is much easier to attain and completely overgearing mythic bosses even end bosses is common by the end of tiers.
    How is 0.001% of raiders doing this in any way common? Quit talking out your ass.
    If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.

  18. #438
    There is so much ridiculous optimism and excitement here that it could levitate an aircraft carrier across the US. Oh and by the way, that's got a better shot at happening than Classic gaining and maintaining even 5 million subs.

  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by HollyCarp View Post
    Please pardon me for not reading through 21 pages of comments to see if this has already been touched on. But I wonder if the OP (or how many other people) remember that Classic is bound to have a lot of the inconveniences that many "modern" players take for granted.

    --BASE RUNNING SPEED max until level 40 (unless you're a hunter with Aspect of the Cheetah-- and remember that in Classic, you get dazed when hit while in that aspect)

    --Paladin and Warlock level 60 mounts gated behind very long and troublesome quest lines. And not exactly cheap either, especially when the strongest mobs dropped tiny amounts of coin

    --mounts, pets and quest items took up precious inventory space (remember, 16 slots was the MAX bag size and most people couldn't afford those; I was lucky to have 14 slots for one or two bags)

    --Vanilla WoW had no GF where a group was automatically teleported to a dungeon-- you had to hoof it. Hell I remember once for friggin' SETHEKK HALLS (which won't be available in classic) I was the only one running there (you had to be level 70 to fly, and I wasn't there-- and anyway, Classic will not have flying mounts), almost dying numerous times, while every other one of the players sat in TOWN, *SCREAMING* how they're all gonna quit unless they get a summon via the stone. When nobody else was around the stone for miles and I finally put a foot down saying SOMEONE had to get the HELL off their lazy butt, a measly five seconds later I was the only one left in the group. Now imagine this in "Classic WoW?"

    --Elite quests and areas requiring groups (Remember Stromgarde?). If you had a partner who IRL was a 13 year old kid and their mother suddenly demanded they get off the computer this instant to clean their room, either you hearthstoned really quick or you got mudhole stomped by repops.

    --For Blacksmiths, Dark Iron gear could only be forged in Blackrock Depths. (I think you STILL need to do that today, but back then, Dark Iron was the strongest mail and plate gear in the game).

    --Raids demanded Attunement-- long, tedious and expensive. AND it took up a precious inventory slot, because if you left the token in the vault back in Stormwind or Orgrimmar? OOPS! *ACCESS DENIED*

    --speaking of raids, very specific classes and specs and roles were demanded. Druids not in resto spec weren't allowed to raid. They weren't allowed to anything except cast innervate on the priests. Paladins were told to just cast greater blessing over and over and over-- and in those days you had to bless EACH individual member, not the whole group. Those blessings lasted five measly minutes so by the time you finished, it was time to start all over! Not to mention greater blessings demanded reagents that you had to buy from a vendor.

    --speaking of reagents, remember soul shards for warlocks? Took up precious inventory space?

    --No easy access between Eastern Kingdoms and Kalimdor. At least, not for the Alliance. Baby Night Elves wanting to quest outside Stormwind had to run through the level 20+ Wetlands, and crocolisks would come running from MILES away for a bite of tender baby night elf meat. Then the level 10-20 Loch Modan. I don't even remember where the Horde Zeppelins went, outside of between Ratchet in the Barrens (just one zone then) and Booty Bay (STV was a bad part of town in those days).

    --Much fewer class/race combos. There was no "ANY race could be a hunter" in those days. ONLY Alliance could be Paladins and ONLY Horde could be Shamans.

    --Speaking of Shamans, totems took up inventory space and were mandatory for any totem-based spells.


    ...shall I go on?

    Maybe these weren't game breakers but they were serious PITAS, and I wonder how many people will go running to WoW Classic, run into all of them, and promptly go "(CENSORED) this (CENSORED)!!!!!!!!"
    this post just got me even more legit hyped for classic.

  20. #440
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiwack View Post
    It is. How's your mythic guild ranked?

    - - - Updated - - -



    How is 0.001% of raiders doing this in any way common? Quit talking out your ass.
    I didn't claim to be competitive currently. Hall of Fame level is competitive. It's not .001% of raiders doing it at all the vast vast majority of mythic guilds killed jaina in 5+ ilvl higher gear than limit and method. We can see what happens when people can't outgear content with uunat where a total of 166 guilds have killed him, and a total of 310 killed the first boss. This was content guilds went into basically capped unlike bod and palace. Most guilds if they kill queen will be around 440 and only that low due to benthic gear. Right now a competitive guild should have at least killed org.

    Let's look at ilvl for the most recent jaina kill prior to patch Квантум a russian guild at 417.59 ilvl lowest ilvl in raid 415.13
    https://www.wowprogress.com/guild/eu.../rating.tier23

    Now let's look at limit it's around 406 refuted trolled by logging out in no gear which screws it up a bit the highest ilvl is Lipp at 411.38 lowest is Xariz at 403.25

    Now Method 406 no armory trolls highest Joshpriest 412.75 lowest Pottersham 400 even.

    But hey you said top 1000 so let's look at 1000 which is Fusion an eu guild

    Fusion had an average ilvl of 416 highest 418.31 lowest 412.56

    But yup top 1000 is definitely competitive and fighting anywhere near the same fight top 200 are for sure.

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