Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ...
2
3
4
  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by scrappybristol View Post
    Frost def needs more to it.

    Like when I think of a frost dk, it's dark and radiating cold and is surrounded by vengeful spirits that attack the dks target with him. Not a pet but something more passive that can be interacted with more with talents.
    basically shadowy apparitions with auspicious spirits. i'd like that a lot

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    Personally I have not really been happy with DK since after WotLK due to the change to how runes recharged. It flowed so much better when they started recharging the moment they were used no matter what. And yes I strongly preferred two hand over DW frost as well.
    having three different rune types made it a little trickier. i kinda miss the valkyr with the sudden doom procs tbh

  3. #63
    The games easy there's no need to be draconian on loot. The pots and buffs are way more than what's needed to clear the raids out so why not have fun and let people gear there meme builds for wpvp. Our whole guild was set up by mates to feed ourselves loot so we can make meme builds.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildcaard View Post
    having three different rune types made it a little trickier. i kinda miss the valkyr with the sudden doom procs tbh
    It wasn't tricky, your abilities used specific runes and all you needed to do was learn a rotation. No different than now.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by itzLCD View Post
    Hello friends.

    Just to give a little background about myself I've been playing World of Warcraft on and off for the last 12 years or so and primarily during that time the Death Knight class has been my main; I fell in love with them since the beginning and haven't looked back since. I'm more a filthy casual these days but previously I was in high caliber 25m heroic raiding guilds (before mythic days) and have done lots of PvP.

    Over the last two expansions, Legion and now BFA, I have noticed Death Knights have gone further and further away from fulfilling their class fantasy though I will admit its mostly up to conjecture what that exactly means. However I will say Blizzard once stated they wanted DKs to be this dark, menacing and destructive class that while slow offer immense power and strength but quite frankly I'm just not seeing it. Yes we are slow and have few movement abilities but we're also not offering much in the damage or utility department either.

    Watching the race to world first for 8.2 and not seeing a single Death Knight being represented made be sad. Granted world first guilds make up a fraction of player base and overall community, the fact remains we bring nothing to the table that is of value and we end up just being 'another class'.

    In theory Death Knights should be one of the hardest hitting classes in the game but we're simply not. We don't offer raid utility like we use to with AMZ or haste buffs like Icy Veins and Death Grip doesn't work on half the mobs; meanwhile Retribution Paladins offer so much more while also doing the job of Death Knights much better.

    FROST
    I think it's safe to say at this point that most dislike Dual Wielding for Death Knights because it simply just doesn't fulfill the fantasy and the overwhelming requests to bring 2H back that continue to be ignored is saddening.

    Frost has also continued to suffer from scaling issues and the always ends up needed constant band-aid touch ups as the expansion progresses as we've seen. It really needs to be re-designed from the ground up. Only one viable talent build for 2 expansion in a row is also pretty bland and testament to the specializations lack of depth.

    UNHOLY

    Unholy is a great spec and is also somewhat competitive. The one thing I will say about it is that DW if it's going to be somewhere on the class makes a lot more since on Unholy since it's all about spreading diseases as fast as possible.
    __


    Overall I would really appreciate if Blizzard could focus a little more on our class, a class that really hasn't been significantly looked at in a long time.

    In my opinion we are just constantly overlooked: Same runeforges for 5 expansions in a row now, can't use any of the allied races, starting zone is completely out of date, offer nothing special or unique to raids or compositions and worst of all STILL CANT GET FROSTMOURNE!
    100% agree with your assessment that Death Knights should be one of the hardest hitting classes in the game.

    A slow moving Juggernaut of death. The fact that "bursting" a sore on Unholy does pitiful damage is really weird to me. Diseases should do consistent DoT damage then if you get on top of them you should hit like a truck.

    We have the worst mobility in the game.


    Frost... Haven't touched Frost since it went dual wield. Fuck that.

  6. #66
    My fundamental problem with the death knight class is the rotation and cooldowns and rune regeneration.

    I wish ruins regenerate in like a quarter of a second and just make everything more fluid and faster The game would be a lot more fun if you're playing like with lust always on 24/7.

    Right now both my blood and an holy guys are i450 And I have haste of almost 30% And both rotation still feel a little clunky they're great when you first start a fight they're fast and smooth but once that fight lasts more than 10 seconds it seems to have cool down issues or waiting for stuff to regenerate

    I miss the Wrath days, with a solid strict rotation of spells 1 2 3 4 5 rinse and repeat 1 2 3 4 5. Or at least like frost with the procs always going off on a couple different spells That's fine you know the two or three spells you need to concentrate on and then flashlight should get a proc and you hit that and it seems to be fluid and never downtime .
    Last edited by Zorachus; 2020-02-20 at 03:02 PM.

  7. #67
    Legendary! Nnyco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Haomarush
    Posts
    6,526
    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    It wasn't tricky, your abilities used specific runes and all you needed to do was learn a rotation. No different than now.
    It wasnt tricky but clunky as fuck, having to icy touch during aoe for example.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    It wasnt tricky but clunky as fuck, having to icy touch during aoe for example.
    That's what Death Runes were for, not to mention the fact that you simply needed to use IT for a disease (unless you were disease less Blood).

    I'd like to add, that if you were Frost, HB originally used a Frost Rune. If you were unholy, you would only really need one IT every 15 seconds or so, because DnD used one of each rune. Seriously, it wasn't clunky at all.
    Last edited by Absintheminded; 2020-02-20 at 03:35 PM.

  9. #69
    Legendary! Nnyco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Haomarush
    Posts
    6,526
    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    That's what Death Runes were for, not to mention the fact that you simply needed to use IT for a disease (unless you were disease less Blood).

    I'd like to add, that if you were Frost, HB originally used a Frost Rune. If you were unholy, you would only really need one IT every 15 seconds or so, because DnD used one of each rune. Seriously, it wasn't clunky at all.
    As unholy you had festering striked twice to make your runes uudddd shortly before aoe started, then you bloodboiled 4x to aoe and they became normal again.
    After you had uuffbb, you used blood runes for bloodboil and had frost runes left only useable for icy touch, or the alternative where you used festering strike again to convert em to death, but that is basically the same amount of bloodboils as if you icy touch'd.
    Last edited by Nnyco; 2020-02-20 at 03:49 PM.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  10. #70
    The Patient sykretts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Hell, apparently
    Posts
    231
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    It wasnt tricky but clunky as fuck, having to icy touch during aoe for example.
    At least there was an aspect of decision making to the class in that regard. Having both diseases up and maintaining the dots actually contributed to your dps as an unholy and a frost death knight, not to mention their contribution to creation of death runes which added to player agency. The "clunky" design had unintentionally given frost/unholy some amount of depth and decision making that is completely absent these days.
    Now it's just - get 1 disease up (either spec) -> dump all remaining runes to prep for a cooldown (BoS or Apoc) -> use fillers and resource free dmg procs like rime and sudden death -> wait for cd's to come back up while you repeat a dull and weak hitting filler. You no longer have to worry about rune management as a DK, which is unfortunate, the class was supposed to revolve around that resource.

    Where's my death rune management? Where's my skill-based reward in the gameplay? Why is my setup process so long in both dps specs? Why does everything hit to weak outside the 1.5-2minute long CDs? Why have you removed the choice I had to tank as any of the 3 specs? Why have you removed the choice to DPS as any of the 3 specs? Forget 3, not even a choice between 2.... DK was a hybrid class for tanking and DPS, far cry from it now. We're a generic builder spender now.
    They band-aid the lack of depth in game play and the lack of bursty damage that the class is missing baseline, with stuff like talents and azerite traits.
    I keep bringing up the necrotic plague UH build from WOD on any dk related topic I post in, and for good reason. They hit peak design for unholy in WoD, with NP and with Arbiter, and the fact that it was an actual choice and oh, we also had a pseudo-execute ability in SR. Frost for me had hit it's peak in Cata and has only been downhill since. Like someone else had brought up in this thread, the fact that BoS has been the reigning ST talent for 2 expansions in a row is a damn shame and a clear fault in class design.

    Just giving DK's flat % aura buffs to their damage (happened twice this expansion already) won't make up for what they're lacking. DK's have become the meme of "easiest melee class to play" because blizzard's been moving them in that direction with bad design decisions. And they for some reason have accepted this meme and continue to change/balance it while keeping that perception alive.
    Last edited by sykretts; 2020-02-20 at 03:56 PM.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    As unholy you had festering striked twice to make your runes uudddd shortly before aoe started, then you bloodboiled 4x to aoe and they became normal again.
    After you had uuffbb, you used blood runes for bloodboil and had frost runes left only useable for icy touch, or the alternative where you used festering strike again to convert em to death, but that is basically the same amount of bloodboils as if you icy touch'd.
    I'm only talking from the POV of Wrath. Festering Strike was added for Cata. I don't really care for DK post-Wrath. Just for the record I'm perfectly fine with HB/BB/DnD for Frost AOE and BB/diseases/DnD for UH.

  12. #72
    Legendary! Nnyco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Haomarush
    Posts
    6,526
    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    I'm only talking from the POV of Wrath. Festering Strike was added for Cata. I don't really care for DK post-Wrath. Just for the record I'm perfectly fine with HB/BB/DnD for Frost AOE and BB/diseases/DnD for UH.
    Wotlk dk was even more clunky.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  13. #73
    The 2handed frost situation is easily fixed via transmog by adding the number of both auto/ability attacks as one number and allowing to transmog your main handed weapon into a 2handed weapon, and since the other 2 specs cannot use 1handed weapons there is no way to glitch it out or abuse it.

    This is the easiest solution and under the hood not much would have to change to accomplish this.
    Super Mario Maker 2: Maker ID 8B7-CTF-NMG

    - let's get real everyone, classic needs #somechanges get over it.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by DemonDays View Post
    100% agree with your assessment that Death Knights should be one of the hardest hitting classes in the game.

    A slow moving Juggernaut of death. The fact that "bursting" a sore on Unholy does pitiful damage is really weird to me. Diseases should do consistent DoT damage then if you get on top of them you should hit like a truck.

    We have the worst mobility in the game.


    Frost... Haven't touched Frost since it went dual wield. Fuck that.
    nah unholy is a slow moving unkillable force, love seeing unholy dks in bgs 9 million damage, 7 million healing, fucking resto knights.

  15. #75
    Dual wield should not be a DK thing at all IMHO, never liked that it was a part of the class in wow.

    Frost always felt shite cause its abilities were without any personality or character.
    It has "frost fart" and "hit harder" type of attacks... that is it... really lame and boring and not even memorable.
    The spec is a generic basic fighter with blue colored attacks... braindead simple mechanics...
    Frost Mages at least have "icicles" and "shatter" mechanic that somewhat resembles a frost theme.

    Unholy has a lot of character (unlike frost) with the disease spreading and frenzied undead pets and the overall theme of plague/undeath.
    However its gameplay mechanics have often been impractical or just not all that convenient to use or keep track of.
    But at least the "fantasy" of an unholy oriented Death Knight is portrayed well in unholy.
    BfA = second worst product ever made by Blizzard.
    War3 Reforged took the title for worst product.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    Wotlk dk was even more clunky.
    lol Ok. It was quite simple, and wasn't clunky for me at all.

  17. #77
    Immortal Kithelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Somewhere where canon still exists
    Posts
    7,892
    Always felt Unholy should probably be a death by a 1000 wounds while Frost makes more sense with the big weapon...also be nice since we only have 2 melee pet specs and both of them are 2H...would set it a little more apart from Survival if Unholy were DW.
    Hope, the greatest power of all!

    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  18. #78
    If any Death Knight spec was going to dual wield, makes most sense for Unholy, with the spreading of diseases seems would be smarter to have two weapons that do that, sort of like Assassination Rogue. And Frost should only be a giant 2h weapon, smashing the enemy with gigantic blasts.

    But the biggest issue with DK's in BfA is the slow rune regeneration, and cool down and wait times for spells to be ready. I want it to fele almost like Lust is on 24/7, super fluid fast spell casting.

    I want a nonstop smooth rotation of Outbreak X1, Festering Strike X1, Scourge Strike X2 or 3, Epidemic X1, and let me rinse and repeat that nonstop with zero waiting and keep it gong smooth at wrap speed. ye sit's easy to start off with that rotation I just gave, but once you start doing a second round of it, some slow downs come up, and then a third round of it forget it, there's major slow downs.

    Or I can just Scourge Strike x 3 or 4 and Death Coil X 1, rinse and repeat, that works, but doesn't do much. Which is my quick World Quests rotation for fast kills, and is fun.
    Last edited by Zorachus; 2020-02-20 at 06:48 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •