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  1. #21
    Depends on the breeding stage, whether said breed has the right traits to integrate and establish itself as a non-threatening and productive asset of a social setting.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by the game View Post
    So I often see people saying things like "oh that animal should be out in the wild," when they see an animal they don't agree with as a pet. They're ok with dogs and cats being domesticated though. People seem to forget that at one point in time Dogs and cats were not domesticated.

    So how long does an animal have to be domesticated before it's not considered an exotic pet or people stop saying it belongs in the wild.
    Your question is nonsensical. Once a species is domesticated it’s domesticated.
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  3. #23
    The Unstoppable Force Queen of Hamsters's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the game View Post
    Since you like sugar gliders





    Oh my GOOD! Look at them! You even have a white one! I was shocked to learn that whilst regular Sugar gliders cost 200 euro around here, the white ones go for as much as 700 euro! O.O

    They are just too sweet. I went and met some sugar gliders when I was visiting family in Gothenburg and they were soft, careful but still inquisitive and so open to human contact. Whilst I never hope they'll be as common as hamsters, it's nice to see them growing as a pet here in Sweden! The breeders are more selective about who they sell to than dog breeders at this point, which is awesome.
    How very odd...
    It would seem that one simply can't make Classic sound good, without first attempting to make Retail sound bad.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Queen of Hamsters View Post
    Oh my GOOD! Look at them! You even have a white one! I was shocked to learn that whilst regular Sugar gliders cost 200 euro around here, the white ones go for as much as 700 euro! O.O

    They are just too sweet. I went and met some sugar gliders when I was visiting family in Gothenburg and they were soft, careful but still inquisitive and so open to human contact. Whilst I never hope they'll be as common as hamsters, it's nice to see them growing as a pet here in Sweden! The breeders are more selective about who they sell to than dog breeders at this point, which is awesome.
    I paid $500 for my cremino. She's actually more of a cream color than white. She also has the garnet eyes. but yes good breeders are selective about who they sell to. I had to sign an contract for the 2 greys and answer a quiz. For the cremino I had to answer a quiz and prove the enclosure and diet was good enough for them.
    Last edited by the game; 2019-08-16 at 03:06 PM.
    The one force of nature they call by name.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Thekri View Post
    I have heard this argument before, and I am not sure I agree with it. I don't disagree with any of the facts, just the conclusion. While cats probably did join forces with us voluntarily (Dogs likely did too), I don't think that disqualifies them from being domesticated now, since humans have exerted influence on cat breeding for a very long time now. My preferred conclusion is that cats are domesticated, just that their role in human society (Primarily rodent control) was so close to their wild role that the animal is still perfectly capable of functioning either wild or tame.


    This I do disagree with. There is very little difference between a Zebra and a Mongolian Wild Ass (One of the several ancestors of modern horses), as both are quite vicious. For that matter even domestic donkeys and horses can be extremely vicious if they are not tamed early in their life. I think the main reason Zebras were never domesticated is exactly because Africans never attempted it. Because they domesticated Dromedaries instead, which are a far more efficient work animal for the climate. To this day horses are extremely rare in Africa, while there are literally millions of Dromedaries. Zebras that are raised in zoos and such are as dependable as any other wild animal, and they have in fact been used to pull carriages and such (Although not often, because they are of course not domesticated). I see no reason why a few dozen generations of tamed Zebras couldn't result in a domesticated variant. There is just literally no reason to do so, because Horses and Camels both exist.
    .
    The domestication of Zebras has been attempted more recently by others than Africans. There are a couple of problems with that which go beyond their temperament.

    While Zebras travel in herds, they don't actually have a social structure. This seems to be very necessary for animals that are supposed to have some sort of utilitarian use. Again, taming and domestication are wildly different things. Their behavior is highly unpredictable and they can easily kill humans. They also have a very well developed dodge reflex, which is surprisingly relevant as the dodge reflex triggers their fight or flight response.

    Attempting to domesticate Zebras was all the fad during the colonial era.

    https://thomsonsafaris.com/blog/tami...tion-attempts/

    https://www.sciencealert.com/this-is...n-domesticated
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    Today Obama once again kneeled at the altar of environmental naziism and hurt this once great country. He has now banned all drilling in the Atlantic Ocean

  6. #26
    It takes the animal trusting you and ability to learn your body language, maybe a few generations depending on how long the lifespan of the animal is. Some are just better at learning our language. No animal is ever fully domesticated either.
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  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    The Domestic Hedgehog (1980s) and Domesticated Red Fox (1950s) say otherwise.
    The red foxes are a very interesting example of a concerted methodical work to domesticate an animal from wild. They are still not as domesticated as dogs/cats but they willingly will interact with people and stay around them. Also demonstrates that certain physical changes happen during domestication to favor more puppy like appearances.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    15,000 years..
    Give or take a few decades.
    That time was probably from Google and it was when the first domesticated dogs first appeared. From what little i've just looked up it's not a time thing per se but a process that must follow:

    Domestication is when humans take a plant or animal species and, through selective breeding, transform the species into something beneficial for humans. ... When we think of domestication, we typically think of animals, but plants can also undergo a fairly radical domestication process.

    So there will be no fixed time. It wil be radically different for each thing.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by the game View Post
    So I often see people saying things like "oh that animal should be out in the wild," when they see an animal they don't agree with as a pet. They're ok with dogs and cats being domesticated though. People seem to forget that at one point in time Dogs and cats were not domesticated.

    So how long does an animal have to be domesticated before it's not considered an exotic pet or people stop saying it belongs in the wild.
    While cats are small and they mostly sleep anyway, most people do say about dogs that you need a small dog for a small yard. At least they do around here. If you live in an apartament building but want a caucasian mountain dog, most people would call you out on it like "they deserve more space, get one of the lil rat dogs" . So while yes not sending them in the wild, we do still say they need more space, which is still pretty close considering we're talking about dogs.

  10. #30
    Scarab Lord Logwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaid View Post
    The red foxes are a very interesting example of a concerted methodical work to domesticate an animal from wild. They are still not as domesticated as dogs/cats but they willingly will interact with people and stay around them. Also demonstrates that certain physical changes happen during domestication to favor more puppy like appearances.
    I agree. I find domestication an interesting topic.

  11. #31
    Humans are slowly self-domesticating over thousands of years. Human brains are getting smaller, as all domesticated animals do, in the area that governs confidence and aggression.

    What seems to be happening is that, as an animal gets hyper-intelligent, it gets REALLY efficient at killing its rivals. This makes it a huge threat to the group so it is killed. So over time, we select out the aggressive and confident from the gene pool.

    We might look at docile and passive people as losers, but the truth is we are so intelligent that if our species ISNT filled with docile and passive people, wed all kill each other.
    Last edited by Kokolums; Today at 08:54 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    I want the ruins of K'aresh for 9.0 as I envision it as Netherstorm on steroids. A broken, shattered world. Eco-domes are stuck on various chunks to protect flora & fauna. I imagine a K'aresh ocean & maybe some islands contained in an eco dome or a snow-capped peak with some jungle valleys in another. Flesh version of Ethereals that never got altered. Space platforms as in Starcraft. Just a totally fantastic tileset & theme that I'd be very keen to explore. They could do some wild things.

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