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  1. #141
    I will say a lot of the issues with today's youth is no one taught them how to actually live and thrive in the real world and being addicted to social media and the pressures it brings.
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  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Unholyground View Post
    I will say a lot of the issues with today's youth is no one taught them how to actually live and thrive in the real world and being addicted to social media and the pressures it brings.
    Indeed I agree with the social media pressure part you can see that everywhere today.
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  3. #143
    I like numbers and graphs. So here are the numbers of youth suicide, numbers not rates, between 1995 and 2015 for CA and the US. The flat trend in CA does not reflect the increase in the US. Since CA’s population has gone up by 10M between 1995 and 2015, the rate has actually gone down.





    If there is a universal force contributing to the rate of youth suicide, you would expect to see the impact reflected equally in the population of the US and CA which is the largest state in the US. However, that is not what we are seeing. What we are seeing is that although the rate has gone up in the majority of states, the largest increase is concentrated in the Mountain West states. You could draw a line enclosing all the states with the highest youth suicide rate.

    Why? Not sure. Lack of access to mental health facilities and professionals? Ease of access to guns?

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post

    Why? Not sure. Lack of access to mental health facilities and professionals? Ease of access to guns?
    Your last question there is a good one to ask. I understand that there is some decent evidence to suggest that one of the best ways to reduce suicide rates is to put up as many barriers as possible to it. There was evidence (can't remember the country) that a bridge was a particular suicide hot spot. So they erected high fences and drastically cut the numbers. Suicidal generally people don't want to die, they just want to be free of the pain they are in. If you put up obstacles to taking this method of being free then you can cut the numbers. Though this was a small study, I don't know how well you can generalise it, and I can't remember the country, so I don't know what the mental health facilities were like. I have done courses in suicide prevention, and this was something that was raised however, so it does seem to be generally accepted, even if I cannot personally attest to the strength of the evidence, that making it as difficult as possible to end your life does have an impact, because people don't want to die, they just don't want the pain.
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  5. #145
    Good thing i don't care about my career. Can't become suicidal over academics and work if you are a NEET :tapshorehoead:

  6. #146
    Over 9000! Vash The Stampede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    I like numbers and graphs. So here are the numbers of youth suicide, numbers not rates, between 1995 and 2015 for CA and the US. The flat trend in CA does not reflect the increase in the US. Since CA’s population has gone up by 10M between 1995 and 2015, the rate has actually gone down.



    https://i.imgur.com/TzQqdma.png

    If there is a universal force contributing to the rate of youth suicide, you would expect to see the impact reflected equally in the population of the US and CA which is the largest state in the US. However, that is not what we are seeing. What we are seeing is that although the rate has gone up in the majority of states, the largest increase is concentrated in the Mountain West states. You could draw a line enclosing all the states with the highest youth suicide rate.

    Why? Not sure. Lack of access to mental health facilities and professionals? Ease of access to guns?
    Your first graph seems to go well with my hypothesis that we've never left the 2008 recession and this is causing a massive depression among Americans. Notice the incline at around 2008 and has been increasing steadily since. Would also explain our opioid addiction as well since people are using medications to deal with their depression.

  7. #147
    Yeah I feel like the same way why youth is having more depression and think about suicide, it is like right now the cost of living, work pressure keeps increasing, study fees/student loan keep growing and if you are in a good career it is still tough to find job, even if you have a decent job but like all the living expense, housing it is just way too experience to cover them, this leads to youth depression.

  8. #148

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash The Stampede View Post
    Your first graph seems to go well with my hypothesis that we've never left the 2008 recession and this is causing a massive depression among Americans. Notice the incline at around 2008 and has been increasing steadily since. Would also explain our opioid addiction as well since people are using medications to deal with their depression.
    Maybe. I am not totally convinced that economy is the sole driving force of the increasing suicide rate in the USA. Many on this board like to point out the fact that CA has the highest supplemental poverty rate in the USA. Yet, the state has some of the lowest suicide & depression rates, by any age group, in the US.

    As long as we are talking opioid, here are some statistics on opioid by state. Hawaii (#1) definitely deserved it's “Paradise” moniker. Texas and California (#2 and #3) show that the two largest economies in the USA actually have a lot in common.


  10. #150
    One important aspect is how our society looks at mental health first and foremost. That stigma is very real and makes people feel like they can not get some help. It does not take long to look at some of the indicators and see that having no chance at help or being shamed for helping someone whom is already in a very unstable mental space will only lead them further down the path. The next thing is that we all went to high school which can be seen as a constant torture by their peers who look down upon them day after day which can add up over period of time. Its a disgusting situation that will likely not change for a generation.

  11. #151
    The Insane Masark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeezusisacasual View Post
    Its a disgusting situation that will likely not change for a generation.
    Without extensive intervention, it will just damage the next generation.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/au/b...od-experiences

    https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S...017-8/fulltext

    And it should be noted that this study used subjects in California, so the results can probably be considered as optimistic compared to the USA as a whole.

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  12. #152
    Over 9000! Vash The Stampede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Maybe. I am not totally convinced that economy is the sole driving force of the increasing suicide rate in the USA. Many on this board like to point out the fact that CA has the highest supplemental poverty rate in the USA. Yet, the state has some of the lowest suicide & depression rates, by any age group, in the US.

    As long as we are talking opioid, here are some statistics on opioid by state. Hawaii (#1) definitely deserved it's “Paradise” moniker. Texas and California (#2 and #3) show that the two largest economies in the USA actually have a lot in common.

    https://i.imgur.com/VR8njCt.png[/IMG][IMG]https://i.imgur.com/metDA4k.png
    Then what other reason do Americans have to be in such a depressed state? Here's a chart showing opioid deaths and around 2016 is when it really began to exponentially increase. About 2016 when Americans have reach maximum debt, and no longer have disposable income. Which would explain the incoming recession, as people can no longer afford things. People are stressed about their future, both short term and long term futures.

    There's an explanation for the sudden depression Americans have and it isn't just mental health issues. Something is driving them to depression.

    https://www.economist.com/graphic-de...pioid-epidemic

    Last edited by Vash The Stampede; 2019-09-15 at 02:23 PM.

  13. #153
    I feel like drugs, losing religion, loneliness, and academic pressures are all contributing to suicides that are just going to increase and increase in the coming years.

  14. #154
    on the one hand, i feel bad they feel like they need to do that.

    but on the other, i am envious, since i'll probably always be too much of a coward.
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  15. #155
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    I'm not surprised to see Utah so high on that list. Pressure on top of pressure on top of pressure. You have the Mormon church and its members telling young people how to think and act, you have schools telling you that you're worthless if you don't go to college, you have colleges telling you that you will be in debt for dozens of years to enroll, you have politicians telling you you're a lazy no-good millennial when you ask for a little bit of help...it's quite a lot.

    I don't disagree that the current parenting model of coddling your kids isn't helping, but it doesn't really address the root issue here.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash The Stampede View Post
    Then what other reason do Americans have to be in such a depressed state? Here's a chart showing opioid deaths and around 2016 is when it really began to exponentially increase. About 2016 when Americans have reach maximum debt, and no longer have disposable income. Which would explain the incoming recession, as people can no longer afford things. People are stressed about their future, both short term and long term futures.

    There's an explanation for the sudden depression Americans have and it isn't just mental health issues. Something is driving them to depression.
    Economy is probably a factor. However, is it the sole factor, or even a major factor? I have my doubt. The aggregate trend for the entire US does appear to support your supposition. However, the correlation breaks down at the state by state level.

    Assuming your hypothesis is correct, we would expect to see the suicide rate by state to match the poverty rate. However, that is not what we are seeing. Utah, New Hampshire, Vermont and North Dakota have some of the lowest poverty rate, and Iowa, North Dakota, Wyoming and Minnesota have the lowest supplemental poverty rates in the nation. However, these are also the states with some of the highest suicide rates.

    California has the 15th highest poverty rate in the nation, and 1st when it comes to supplemental poverty rate. Yet it has the fifth lowest suicide rate in the nation. One of the few states where youth and adolescent suicide rates are on the decline.

    In fact, we get a much better correlation between suicide rate and factors such as access to mental health support, gun ownership and medicaid spending per capita.

  17. #157
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puzzlesocks View Post
    As other people have posted, traditionally conservative states show a higher suicide rate.

    More than that, suicide rates spike the less support systems are in place. The more we "let people face adversity" by ignoring slums and ghettos by blaming the people in them instead of trying to help them, the higher rates of all sorts of mental illness climb. You might as well be making the argument that peasants had higher rates of depression than bureaucrats because they were weak-minded. It obviously had nothing to do with environmental factors at all!
    So do say Indian Reservations show really high rates of suicide. In my view, the two are related. It isn't simply "Facing adversity" as everyone faces that, it is facing adversity with no clear sign that your struggle even matters on a local level. When a way of life, a sense of orientation and continuity vanishes, what hope even is there? Add on that with brutal adversity you don't even have the sweat numbing succor of mindless play and perpetual adolescent life that a urbanite might enjoy and its a no wonder one might commit suicide.
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  18. #158
    Over 9000! Vash The Stampede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Economy is probably a factor. However, is it the sole factor, or even a major factor? I have my doubt. The aggregate trend for the entire US does appear to support your supposition. However, the correlation breaks down at the state by state level.

    Assuming your hypothesis is correct, we would expect to see the suicide rate by state to match the poverty rate. However, that is not what we are seeing. Utah, New Hampshire, Vermont and North Dakota have some of the lowest poverty rate, and Iowa, North Dakota, Wyoming and Minnesota have the lowest supplemental poverty rates in the nation. However, these are also the states with some of the highest suicide rates.

    California has the 15th highest poverty rate in the nation, and 1st when it comes to supplemental poverty rate. Yet it has the fifth lowest suicide rate in the nation. One of the few states where youth and adolescent suicide rates are on the decline.

    In fact, we get a much better correlation between suicide rate and factors such as access to mental health support, gun ownership and medicaid spending per capita.
    What I believe is the reason for this discrepancy is that not everyone handles poverty the same. Some states have better social safety nets than others, and some states you can afford to live happily poor while others you cannot. You also have to look at which states have people with the most debt, as while you may not be poor you may instead be at the brink of bankruptcy. Every state on average has people owing $50k without too much deviation. Another thing to consider is medical debt and how many people choose not to see a doctor and get treated, including the need to be treated for mental health. We're also one of the few countries in the world that doesn't have Universal Health Care and that maybe biting us in the butt in more ways than we thought. How many people choose not to go to college because they can't afford it? How many people aren't getting married and having children because they can't afford it?

    You're not going to find out that food has too much Zinc in it, or that Americans have had their brains fried from using their cell phones too much. People have a lack of money and can't sleep and blame others for their situation. This even includes racism as humans have a tendency to blame others for their situation, usually people not like them. The 2008 recession has a cascade effect that nobody has thought of and won't agree that we've been in a recession this entire time because they have jobs and the unemployment is low, because that's how we measure a recession. That and the stock market.

  19. #159
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash The Stampede View Post
    What I believe is the reason for this discrepancy is that not everyone handles poverty the same. Some states have better social safety nets than others, and some states you can afford to live happily poor while others you cannot. You also have to look at which states have people with the most debt, as while you may not be poor you may instead be at the brink of bankruptcy. Every state on average has people owing $50k without too much deviation. Another thing to consider is medical debt and how many people choose not to see a doctor and get treated, including the need to be treated for mental health. We're also one of the few countries in the world that doesn't have Universal Health Care and that maybe biting us in the butt in more ways than we thought. How many people choose not to go to college because they can't afford it? How many people aren't getting married and having children because they can't afford it?

    You're not going to find out that food has too much Zinc in it, or that Americans have had their brains fried from using their cell phones too much. People have a lack of money and can't sleep and blame others for their situation. This even includes racism as humans have a tendency to blame others for their situation, usually people not like them. The 2008 recession has a cascade effect that nobody has thought of and won't agree that we've been in a recession this entire time because they have jobs and the unemployment is low, because that's how we measure a recession. That and the stock market.
    California's county by county suicide rate though doesn't totally help this. The counties with the highest suicide rates are those furthest from the coast. But California also has a really low birth rate, and the proportion of the population that is young and starting out in Cali is lower and lower each year. I.E. there are less young people to commit suicide in general. Cities like San Francisco are increasingly a playground for singles and void of children as is most of the coast. The suicide rate for young people is likely still high but the suicide rate in Cali is lowered by how many people are already wealthy when here, or who are older.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
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  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    California's county by county suicide rate though doesn't totally help this. The counties with the highest suicide rates are those furthest from the coast. But California also has a really low birth rate, and the proportion of the population that is young and starting out in Cali is lower and lower each year. I.E. there are less young people to commit suicide in general. Cities like San Francisco are increasingly a playground for singles and void of children as is most of the coast. The suicide rate for young people is likely still high but the suicide rate in Cali is lowered by how many people are already wealthy when here, or who are older.
    I picked ten of the most remote counties in California. Tell me if you can see any trend.


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