Mega-Thread: Impeachment Proceedings & Inquiry of Trump

[Kiri]

That was a croc of shit TBH. Its not an abuse of power they are doing, but its sort of the same thing Trump did. The Dems are using our own government to meddle into the election by putting the wording impeached president trump into the election knowing it has no chance in the senate.

Shouldn't the issue kind of be that, well, the Republicans in the senate won't even give this a chance, no matter the evidence/guilt, because they want to influence the election in their favour? I mean, the alternative is to say "Trump can do anything he wants and meddle as much as he wants because he got the senate backing him", which I don't really think is a good thing?

[Kujako]

So Trump committing a crime explicitly layed out by the Constitution is not unconstitutional but the Dems using their constitutional powers is?

Not just their Constitutional powers, but their duties. Apparently not doing what the GOP wants is "unconstitutional"...

[Machismo]

Pretty much. As long as said thing done isnt a fabricated story. If there is something found then there was a point. There are a lot of things that have been done by Dem presidents i wasnt for but well to put it simple they won the election.

Honestly i just do not see a crime here. Do i believe he did hold the money back for them to look into Biden potential corruption? Yes i do. Does it look 10x worse when described the way the whistleblower blew it out of proportion yes. The way something is initially described even if exagerated should be investigated. After looking at the facts i still dont see a crime of meddling in the election.

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That was a croc of shit TBH. Its not an abuse of power they are doing, but its sort of the same thing Trump did. The Dems are using our own government to meddle into the election by putting the wording impeached president trump into the election knowing it has no chance in the senate.

So, you admitted he committed a crime, but you are really saying you just don't care. As for the whistleblower, how exactly was he wrong?

They even wrote Zalensky's speech for him.

[Dontrike]

Does it look 10x worse when described the way the whistleblower blew it out of proportion yes

How did the WB blow it out of proportion? They described it pretty well and it turned it out to be right.

"Aw man I just spilled water on my pants and now they're wet. Shucks."
"You're blowing that out of proportion by describing they are wet."

[Trunksee]

How did the WB blow it out of proportion? They described it pretty well and it turned it out to be right.

"Aw man I just spilled water on my pants and now they're wet. Shucks."
"You're blowing that out of proportion by describing they are wet."

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

[Karrotlord]

Not just their Constitutional powers, but their duties. Apparently not doing what the GOP wants is "unconstitutional"...

The inverse is true too. Everything the GOP does is constitutional even though they constantly get shot down by the courts by "activist judges."

Now to merge these topics, is there any legal standing to the trial in the Senate? I know the Chief Justice is supposed to preside of everything but what does he actually do there? Does he have any power to stop the "activist GOP" when they choose to ignore the law and their constitutional duties?

[Dontrike]

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

I see you were #1 in your civics classes. Doesn't matter if the other person isn't feeling bribed, they are still being bribed.

Just because someone steals from a Wal-Mart but the alarm doesn't go off and no one notices doesn't mean something wasn't stolen.

Seriously, what's so hard about this?

Also, you have no issue with finding out anything Biden did, no matter how it was done, in illegal ways or not, but you're going to try and skirt around obvious bribery? Really? Really? Really?!

[Karrotlord]

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

The money was approved by Congress. The President can't withhold the funds for so long as Trump did. He used Ukraine's own promised money to coerce them into opening a sham investigation because there was already one into the Bidens that found no wrong doing.

[Noxx79]

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

So you have NO problems with the next Democrat president using all of his power, including blackmailing allies, to investigate every single republican aiding and abetting trump, and you have serious issues with trump hiring his unqualified daughter and son-in-law into his administration.

[Orbitus]

I see your point to a degree but wouldnt you wait for a new power to take control and not ask the people the person was believed to be working with? You wouldnt have gotten anything out of the current admin that was in power while Biden was there.

If he had done it through the DOJ which was more than feasible wouldnt the left still be saying the same thing. And honestly the only way to get some thing done by another country that they dont want to do for whatever reason is to hold something over their head. It seems like normal practice.

Also come on by the election Biden could have sunk his own ship with the creepy kid stuff.

I have no idea what you are talking about with the first paragraph. Who is the "new power"? I mean, the investigation into Burisma and Hunter Biden happened in 2016, so, yeah, there is no reason for this "investigation" to happen. Trump just wants the illusion that an investigation is happening because it would look bad for Biden.

And no, if Trump would have done it through the DoJ like any other president, and not his personal lawyer, it would have been probably perfectly fine. But when he held the aid up, it was then bribery.

And no, Trump is OBJECTIVELY WORSE when it comes to "creepy" stuff, since he is credible accused of rape of his first wife, a 13 year old girl, and E. Jean Carroll. And there are 67 other women that he is credibly accused of sexual assault.

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Hey we know the GOP and their bad faith posting supporters here don't give a shit about the truth.



It is OK to disparage a post or ideas but do NOT do so against posters.

I know this, you know this, but apparently he-who-shall-not-be-named, apparently got mad that you spoke the truth.

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Like i said i dont see what he did as unconstitutional. I see what the democrats are doing as unconstitutional because its so bipartisan. Im honestly waiting to see how many dems defect during the vote. It was 2 to start im betting 6 to 8 vote against now and not one republican for. The look it sends to the gop is that the dems are going to pretty much be on this road if they have any power. This next election should be interesting and telling of which direction this country goes. Britain just took a hard right turn. It would not surprise me if the US does the same.

Well, we know you aren't a constitutional lawyer, or a professor, or even know what you are talking about. And you see what Democrats are doing is "bipartisan"? I think you mean partisan, and no, the Republicans don't care about the constitution or the law anymore. That is clear. Especially when they changed their platform in 2016 to be good with the Russians that they hated since forever.

[Belize]

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

So let me ask you this.

If kidnappers told the victim's family not to call the cops or else the kidnapped victim gets the hose again, and they comply, do they wave all of their legal protections since, clearly, they must not be concerned? Isn't it still blackmailing?

In the same vein, if Ukraine bows to Trump's every whim and fancy, because they desperately need the aid that was legally approved by congress to even remain a nation in the face of being invaded by Russia, are they still not being blackmailed? Ukraine literally has no choice in this situation, it's either accept being blackmailed by a petty President or cease existing as a nation.

[Daelak]

Honestly because it takes two to tango. If the side being supposedly bribed does not feel they have been how is it bribery? It seems like a business deal to me. I do not see what he did as unconstitutional. If it was any country other than the us sending money to a party would be and it happens all the time on both sides. As long as Hunter Biden os found to have done something corrupt with his father knowing of it while in office then i have no issue with how its found out.

The fallacy in your logic is that if Trump really gave a shit about Biden/Ukrainian corruption then he would have created a DOJ investigation in conjunction with the Ukrainian AG, not through a six month subversive operation through his SOS, SOE, personal lawyer, and Amb. of the EU.

[Grapemask]

The fallacy in your logic is that if Trump really gave a shit about Biden/Ukrainian corruption then he would have created a DOJ investigation in conjunction with the Ukrainian AG, not through a six month subversive operation through his SOS, SOE, personal lawyer, and Amb. of the EU.

This is a big thing that the democrats didn't seize on enough (or at all, mostly).

If this was a legitimate corruption inquiry, why was Zelensky told to coordinate with Trump's personal lawyer? Why was Giuliani the primary point of contact, not the State Department? Why did Trump go out of his way to make this "corruption investigation" avoid all documented, government channels, and instead use his own personal channels?

Why was he not concerned with giving aid when the country was knowingly run by a corrupt government? Why did he only become concerned when we entered our own election season?

[Paranoid Android]

I don't even know where to post anymore since the Republicans and Trump have so much going on at once.

So McConnell stated, stated. No sources, that he will coordinate with the White House on the upcoming Impeachment Trial. So no rule of law, or that whole US Constitution thing.

[Adam Jensen]

Like i said i dont see what he did as unconstitutional. I see what the democrats are doing as unconstitutional because its so bipartisan. Im honestly waiting to see how many dems defect during the vote. It was 2 to start im betting 6 to 8 vote against now and not one republican for. The look it sends to the gop is that the dems are going to pretty much be on this road if they have any power. This next election should be interesting and telling of which direction this country goes. Britain just took a hard right turn. It would not surprise me if the US does the same.

Point to the part in the constitution where it says the House has to be bipartisan when it brings articles of impeachment to the Senate. The Constitution gives the House the authority to write up articles of impeachment. And that's what they're doing. They're going by a process defined in the Constitution, ergo, not unconstitutional.

[Trunksee]

The money was approved by Congress. The President can't withhold the funds for so long as Trump did. He used Ukraine's own promised money to coerce them into opening a sham investigation because there was already one into the Bidens that found no wrong doing.

And who sets foreign policy? Am I missing something here?

[Kujako]

And who sets foreign policy?

Right now? Apparently Rudy Giuliani....

[Machismo]

And who sets foreign policy? Am I missing something here?

Yes, you are missing plenty. He's still not allowed to withhold aid that was congressionally-approved, and hes still not allowed to seek assistance from a foreign government to aid against a political opponent.


You. Are. Welcome.

[Belize]

And who sets foreign policy? Am I missing something here?

The executive branch enforces what was passed by Congress.

No ifs or buts. If it passes Congress and is not vetoed, then the President cannot decide to withhold what was passed indefinitely or until he has something to gain. Period.

[Kujako]

So, I'm out of Pocket Constitutions. But how about we all chip in a few cents and buy a ten pack for some of the people here?
https://shop.aclu.org/product/ACLU-P...-United-States
Edit: Crap.... they're out of stock.

See what I used to do when traveling around for work is swap these out for the bibles in hotel rooms. Ah well.

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Judiciary articles of Impeachment passed the House.