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  1. #121
    I think they should ditch the current art style for a grittier one like Diablo I & II. Also, if they could add a couple more classes at launch that don't suck, and a talent tree system that isn't as insignificant as the paragon system because unlocking talent points is a lot more fun and rewarding than unlocking random abilities. Basically, bring back the RPG elements that made it more like D&D or Oblivion and not an action RPG. Lastly, the story and cinematics in Diablo I & II were way, way more cool and interesting. The story in DIII was so bad.

  2. #122
    Story in first 2 Diablo wasn't top class either, but the gameplay and generally the capability of keeping people hooked up has been way more significant.

    ARPGs are a tricky genre to develop on - especially now that players digest content as fast as possible because "if you're not first it doesn't count" mentality, which a game like D2 could be played at very different paces without anyone fussing about "i have finished all, what do i do now?".

    PoE manages to go through it by being F2P, being deliberately slow on some things (which i appreciate) and periodically releasing new mechanics and content, which is a tremendous workload just to stay relevant. At this point the game is solid, but it took quite a bunch of time and effort. PoE manages to give exactly that feel of constant progression - leveling by the passive tree, then crafting for links, then atlas, then Delve, bestiary, they managed to add many parallel progressions other than farming the BiS items so people is costantly experiencing "going ahead".

    D3 has fallen short just because of this. GRs are fine, but ONLY GRs is not. But i'm sure a lot of things that could have been were just cut off because of the product not being on par with corporate expectations. Diablo Legacy is also a pretty big reason.
    No one wants to choose. Everyone wants everything.

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Hinastorm View Post
    PoE has many fatal flaws though, at least for the non-super hardcore types (awful, time consuming trade, hard to access respecs, headache inducing depth)

    Bliz could basically clone PoE, but with a trade interface, sane respecs, and non-cosmic brain systems, and be a huge success.
    I thought the same, and it took me three characters in three different leagues to understand how the game works. Now, I couldn't even consider playing a more "basic" ARPG.

    The problem with the genre as a whole is that the actual basic premise is pretty tedious - kill thousands of enemies to get more gear so you can kill thousands of enemies faster. The only way to make that interesting for an extended period of time is to add extreme depth to the systems outside of that core gameplay loop, like synergies and runewords in D2 were, to a lesser extent than PoE's current systems. Sure, Blizzard might make a commercial success out of a basic gameplay loop and some fancy graphics, but they're unlikely to capture any of the people who are still playing the genre right now without at least 70-80% of PoE's depth.

    PoE's trade mechanic can suck a dick, though.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Story in first 2 Diablo wasn't top class either, but the gameplay and generally the capability of keeping people hooked up has been way more significant.

    ARPGs are a tricky genre to develop on - especially now that players digest content as fast as possible because "if you're not first it doesn't count" mentality, which a game like D2 could be played at very different paces without anyone fussing about "i have finished all, what do i do now?".

    PoE manages to go through it by being F2P, being deliberately slow on some things (which i appreciate) and periodically releasing new mechanics and content, which is a tremendous workload just to stay relevant. At this point the game is solid, but it took quite a bunch of time and effort. PoE manages to give exactly that feel of constant progression - leveling by the passive tree, then crafting for links, then atlas, then Delve, bestiary, they managed to add many parallel progressions other than farming the BiS items so people is constantly experiencing "going ahead".

    D3 has fallen short just because of this. GRs are fine, but ONLY GRs is not. But i'm sure a lot of things that could have been were just cut off because of the product not being on par with corporate expectations. Diablo Legacy is also a pretty big reason.
    Its not tricky. When you have a lot of competition in your field, you need a "value add". Blizzard had an incredible value add in battle.net. They made ARPGs a social experience. Everyone else was focused on single player and Blizzard went a different way and captured a market no-one else was trying for. The biggest mistake D3 made was dumping the social aspect. It lost its value add and couldn't compete with other games. For D4 to succeed, it needs to have a value add. That could mean a strong social experience. Or do something else to capture a market that doesn't normally play ARPGs. If they just roll out an ARPG with standard ARPG features and a lot of gloss without a major value add, it'll fail.

    Look at Blizzards history:

    + War3, Starcraft, Diablo 2 all succeeded because they were all on bnet which provided a cutting edge social experience as a value add.
    + WoW succeeded because it provided strong social play as a value add with global chat and forcing people to talk and make friends on a single server. PvE Guilds were locked on one small server and raced each other like its a tournament.
    + SC2 failed because they ripped all the social elements out, it almost didn't have chat channels.
    + D3 failed because they ripped all the social elements out, it almost didn't have chat channels. Plus, Rifts were too much of the game which made it repetitive.
    + Hearthstone was a success because it had a value add in the fact that it was the ONLY card game that was pushed BOTH on PC and mobile. All competitors focused on one or the other.
    + Overwatch started strong but its failing as it really has no social elements. If something like Overwatch was released on a social platform like a modernized bnet 1.0, it would have crushed all competition and Forenite or PUBG never challenge them.
    Last edited by Kokolums; 2019-10-12 at 02:28 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    I want the ruins of K'aresh for 9.0 as I envision it as Netherstorm on steroids. A broken, shattered world. Eco-domes are stuck on various chunks to protect flora & fauna. I imagine a K'aresh ocean & maybe some islands contained in an eco dome or a snow-capped peak with some jungle valleys in another. Flesh version of Ethereals that never got altered. Space platforms as in Starcraft. Just a totally fantastic tileset & theme that I'd be very keen to explore. They could do some wild things.

  5. #125
    More variety in builds. Now, personally I'm perfectly fine with set bonuses in an ARPG even though I've oven heard people complaining about those in regards to D3. But while I'm OK with them, I want sets like the later ones that offer a range of spells that they buff as opposed to Barbarians' Wirlwhind set. On top of that, each set should have a wide plethora of legendaries that work in conjunction with it. As in, multiple items per slot so that you can make a more personalized build. Having a supplementary small set or two for the slots not taken by the primary is also nice.
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    Slant is an extremist, willing to sacrifice the lives of everyone to keep his wet dream of the EU alive.
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  6. #126
    >Keyforging. The ability to be able to choose what monsters will be in your key, if you have affixes like in WoW's mythic + keys where you'll have random effects such as aoe spawning on you for the negative affixes. But you could also get benefic affixes giving you for example a chance to reanimate a monster or some random and cool bonus like that.
    >Better crafting. Outside of reforging the Diablo 3 crafting is boring. You can check some mods for D2 like Median XL to see how good it can be
    >No more in-game cutscene. I know this one might look weird but I think that one of the things that made D2 and even Classic WoW more immersive was the absence of ingame cutscenes. They simply break the rythm and the surprise of the first encounter
    >Having true farm road again like in D2 and not being forced to do rift. Rift should be rare and rewarding.
    >D3 legendary effect and D2 style of stats.

  7. #127
    in d3 the main way that i equipped my gear for my barbarian was through the auction house. the auction house was really good idea to get new gear on the characters. optional gold buyout. i don't know why blizzard scrapped the auction house really stupid and that just killed the game for playing any other characters. there no Magic find on any gear so diablo3 was robbed in its experience. blizz just keeps making bad decisions..

    diablo4 needs a way for players to progress one way was by trade with the auction house. or anotherway is using magic find for getting gear on bosses. have to have the gear to progress to the next difficulty other wise its just a waste of time.
    Last edited by Proper Ninja; 2019-10-15 at 01:02 AM.
    “Choose a job you love and you'll never have to work a day in your life” “Logic will get you from A to Z; Imagination will get you everywhere.”

  8. #128
    it needs good design.

  9. #129
    I'd answer with more like what it DOESN'T need, and what it doesn't need is Greater Rifts. This absolutely ruined the game for me.

  10. #130
    Scarab Lord Velshin's Avatar
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    Dark Souls playstyle but with Diablo lore and universe...now that is a dream come true....

  11. #131
    that would be interesting... but it kiiiiinda sounds like it would be close to a nioh by blizz? not that i would mind that
    "There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man."
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  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Dark Souls playstyle but with Diablo lore and universe...now that is a dream come true....
    Don't think something like that will happen - if i have to give credit to the Kotaku article that went out some time ago, some sort of concept for this kind of game was created and pursued, but didn't went well.

    I think that since blizzard tends to aim to the largest playerbase possible, a somewhat niche game like a soulslike isn't feasible.

    Would that have been interesting? Sure.
    No one wants to choose. Everyone wants everything.

  13. #133
    Bring some damn complexity back to the game. Blizzard seems to consider talent/skill trees anathema, but one of the things that kept me coming back to D2 was trying new crazy build ideas.

    It doesn't need to be PoE-level complex, nor should it be, but there's ample design space between that and the over-simplified character mechanics of D3.

  14. #134
    Honestly, i just want to play ARPGS with my friends again, diablo 3 brought that without feeling like youre slowing yourself down considerably, if i play with my friends in PoE it just feels like shit unless someone else sacrifices his own fun to play an aura bot. in D3 you always felt like you played your part and you actually progressed quicker playing with others.
    Beyond multiplayer staying fun; alternate progression to Greater Rifts and Paragon Grind, Reworked Gems, Reworked Classes(Some more Overall complexity than beeing shoehorned into a particular set evry season).
    On the other hand, if PoE 4.0 brings good meaningful multiplayer, id probably prefer ther overall game to D4 unless the reworks are godly
    Last edited by Dreen; 2019-10-15 at 12:04 PM.

  15. #135
    Scarab Lord Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Don't think something like that will happen - if i have to give credit to the Kotaku article that went out some time ago, some sort of concept for this kind of game was created and pursued, but didn't went well.

    I think that since blizzard tends to aim to the largest playerbase possible, a somewhat niche game like a soulslike isn't feasible.

    Would that have been interesting? Sure.
    The question is why? I mean really how many company and games tried to copy and did a soul like game and a lot of them were successful and popular? (not all of them ofc because Lords of Fallen was garbage) but you got what I mean. My point is Soul like game is very popular nowadays so a company as big as Blizzard why didn't they do it yet? they can't be that blind really.

  16. #136
    A perfect Diablo 4 for me?

    Diablo 2's itemization and systems (runes, talents) with Diablo 3 graphics\animations.

    i'd play that forever.

  17. #137
    Unfortunately, imo, it will be more of the same with slight improvements. They are probably scared to change it much after the whole "no changes" vanilla thing and the cell phone game, any changes they make to anything will be heavily scrutinized. Now isn't the time for risk, and risks would be things like making D4 an open world wrpg like skyrim, or a 3rd person action rpg like Dark Souls.

    No, imo, the next diablo game will be just like diablo 3 but with different levels, more loot, different bosses, slightly different classes, but very much a similar game to D3. In fact, it may revert a bit and be more similar to D2 than D3, but I don't think we're getting anything outside the box here. You'll click around, get set bonuses and legendaries, ring sets, you'll probably fight similar types of stuff in a similar engine. They will probably remix the progression system. Most stuff will be the same, just a new version of it imo.
    Last edited by Zenfoldor; 2019-10-15 at 01:33 PM.

  18. #138
    *single player campaign that is longer than 2 hrs. No, playing the same shit on a higher difficulty doesn't mean the game is longer.

    *more story interaction and meaningful choices.

    *being able to play other things than just humans. Fallen angels and neutral demons, for example.

    Oh wait, it just a game for zoomers with the attention span of a gold fish, who lose their shit when a bis orange drops.
    Yeah, nvm, carry on.

  19. #139
    Immortal Fahrenheit's Avatar
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    More variation in classes and being able to customize your hero would help.
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  20. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    The question is why? I mean really how many company and games tried to copy and did a soul like game and a lot of them were successful and popular? (not all of them ofc because Lords of Fallen was garbage) but you got what I mean. My point is Soul like game is very popular nowadays so a company as big as Blizzard why didn't they do it yet? they can't be that blind really.
    It's not a problem of being blind, but more of what you're good (good is subjective) at doing. A new type of game like a soulslike given in the hands of a team not used to create them would take much more investment and time.

    I think (but take this with a grain of salt) they're just aiming to create a solid Diablo experience people remember from the days of D2 with new/improved systems so they can recover from the PR damage the franchise has sustained from D3 release and afterward.

    It's a crucial point, they cannot afford to miss the shot so they're going the safe route here. If Diablo had a successful game still rolling, they could have easily made a soulslike spinoff to test the waters, but this is not the case currently.

    Just my guesses anyway.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zenfoldor View Post
    Unfortunately, imo, it will be more of the same with slight improvements. They are probably scared to change it much after the whole "no changes" vanilla thing and the cell phone game, any changes they make to anything will be heavily scrutinized. Now isn't the time for risk, and risks would be things like making D4 an open world wrpg like skyrim, or a 3rd person action rpg like Dark Souls.

    No, imo, the next diablo game will be just like diablo 3 but with different levels, more loot, different bosses, slightly different classes, but very much a similar game to D3. In fact, it may revert a bit and be more similar to D2 than D3, but I don't think we're getting anything outside the box here. You'll click around, get set bonuses and legendaries, ring sets, you'll probably fight similar types of stuff in a similar engine. They will probably remix the progression system. Most stuff will be the same, just a new version of it imo.
    Basically this, though i can see a new Diablo having a world more structured like WoW, another title where they're pretty solid on building out enviromental stuff.
    No one wants to choose. Everyone wants everything.

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