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  1. #1221
    Quote Originally Posted by Very Tired View Post
    Saw some article a few days ago that seemed to suggest China is finally wising up to the fact their efforts to censor speech outside of China has an overall counterproductive impact as stories like this flood the news and social media, which tends to rile more people up against your state than some random guy chanting a slogan. Really adds to my point how dumb it was for Blizzard to handle this situation like they did because it's literally worse for China than just pretending it never happened and getting on with their silly tournament like normal.
    Except they aren't. The NBA is proof of that.

  2. #1222
    Over 9000! rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Prove it. I GUARANTEE Blizzard wouldn't have done anything to a Trump protestor because it wouldn't cost them money because that is all they care about. Blizzard has a long history of only caring about money.
    It can't be proven. Just like you can't prove what you are guaranteeing. If you could prove it then you would have already provided it rather then making a dumb all caps guarantee. What are you even going to put up with collateral? Yes Blizzard has a long history of only caring about money. But that is moot since you've been supporting them over the years despite it.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  3. #1223
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So it is okay to support a morally bankrupt company if you don't use your money. Gotcha. Have to use a middle man so you come out clean. Any excuse so your argument won't apply to you. By using tokens you are enabling blizzard to get an extra $5 per subscription. So you are actually supporting them even then if you just used your $15 a month.
    I don't use them anymore. I am done and J Allen Brack's statement full of BS makes it even easier to be done.

  4. #1224
    Quote Originally Posted by Very Tired View Post
    Saw some article a few days ago that seemed to suggest China is finally wising up to the fact their efforts to censor speech outside of China has an overall counterproductive impact as stories like this flood the news and social media, which tends to rile more people up against your state than some random guy chanting a slogan. Really adds to my point how dumb it was for Blizzard to handle this situation like they did because it's literally worse for China than just pretending it never happened and getting on with their silly tournament like normal.
    You mean this?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/b...t-the-nba.html

    "Now, the Chinese government appears to be reassessing its campaign against the N.B.A. and dialing down the clamor. The government is already in a bruising trade war with the United States, and a backlash against China could hurt its image in the sporting world ahead of the 2022 Winter Olympics near Beijing."

    Please share if was something else i would love to READ it!

  5. #1225
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    I don't use them anymore. I am done and J Allen Brack's statement full of BS makes it even easier to be done.
    But you were using them. Nothing last week changed what Blizzard does with China. So you are just as morally bankrupt as anyone at Blizzard for supporting Blizzard with everything they have done in China.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  6. #1226
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    You do realize you have to literally Fight an entire country's armada (mainland China) to give freedom to all?
    Very rare in life we have "win win" situations ive learned this the hard way myself
    I kind of get that but it still feels wrong even if it is in a round about way to punish people for just being alive in the wrong place. I know business gonna business but pullouts, sanctions etc never really do anything to those who need to be punished, if these and sanctions did work we'd have got rid of Putin, PRC, Kim dynasty years ago. But in the end all it ever does is hurt the people who don't have a say and most of the time backfires. I know you can't compare playing games with human rights. Though at the same time it still feels like pulling out of china would punish people who have no say.

    If you gave me a button that said "Hong Kong free." with "High PRC members will all be shown on daytime tv being dragged through the streets." I'd press the button and grab the popcorn, press it again more times for good measure (I mean I would like the entire communist party destroyed. But China has a history of civil wars if change happens far too quickly). I know people that left HK around the time of the handover and work with them along with donating to international charities so people of HK are as safe as possible.

    I'm more mad at Google and Apple than I am at blizzard over China and HK. Blizzard basically banned a player and didn't reign in Netease when it made the Weibo statement (which no one can be 100% sure if even Netease wrote that or Weibo edited the fuck out of it like the do with anything that has a foreign logo on to make it seem like a china number 1 style post. Also not sure what any kind of statement on it would have done that wouldn't fan a flame in one direction. As for the AU thing, that was if they banned people would rebel, if they didn't people would rebel.), it's shitty. But the other two plus others have actually put lives in danger by pulling off apps that protestors use to keep themselves safe. That's magnitudes worse. When it comes to google and people using Youtube to slam blizzard to me it feels like false outrage.

    Basically rallying behind a cause while actually going against your cause by using a platform that's owned by a company that is guilty of all the same things plus more. To me at least it actually feels more like "How can I make internet points and money off rage." if they're using google owned platform for the message, or use apple products at the same time which most of these people are, especially people like Heelsvsbabyface when everything he does is post anti blizzard, add commercials every 5 minutes in the video, since he can't function in a real job and lost a ton of money when he stopped playing wow (Taliesin had the best show about that with him saying he hates bananas and every five minutes Evitel finds him eating one and complaining about eating bananas when all he has to do is top eating bananas.). It's like Sideshow Bob in the Simpson's using TV to cry about TV then trying to cop out with "I know the Irony.".

    As for going forward. Imo as much as I doubt Brack banned Blitz, decided on the initial punishment etc (I'm sure that was done in Taiwan) behind the scenes he and people around him should find a way to get him a payoff for him to fall on his sword so to speak. He may not have done anything personally but he's the face of it and it's on him. Don't let the number be released (even if it was something like $1m it won't look good). Beg Morhaime to come back to steady the ship, he's like, he's presentable, he's media savvy. Everything Brack wasn't even before "You think you do but you don't.". If you're going to be the face you have to be known to the public and at least liked by a certain %. I mean Metzen if it was a figurehead position would be perfect. Loved, Charismatic to a fault, some story guys may have issues but that's about it.

    Maybe 2-3 years of leave Brack could come back at a mid tier level, he did things right before. It's just the position of President when it comes with being a face doesn't work with someone that really isn't media savvy.
    Last edited by Kallisto; 2019-10-14 at 12:39 AM.

  7. #1227
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    You mean this?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/b...t-the-nba.html

    "Now, the Chinese government appears to be reassessing its campaign against the N.B.A. and dialing down the clamor. The government is already in a bruising trade war with the United States, and a backlash against China could hurt its image in the sporting world ahead of the 2022 Winter Olympics near Beijing."

    Please share if was something else i would love to READ it!
    All they are doing is telling their media to stop talking about the NBA in hopes the outrage will go away. There isn't one mention that the government is changing it's own tactics. Yep, they are really changing their ways.

  8. #1228
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    You mean this?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/b...t-the-nba.html

    "Now, the Chinese government appears to be reassessing its campaign against the N.B.A. and dialing down the clamor. The government is already in a bruising trade war with the United States, and a backlash against China could hurt its image in the sporting world ahead of the 2022 Winter Olympics near Beijing."

    Please share if was something else i would love to READ it!
    Yeah, that looks like it. Looks like China got all the sports fans riled up with that one and all the gamers with this one.

    Kind of a joke they get to host the Olympics though with all 'issues'. But I guess everyone always knew the Olympics were corrupt, especially after Brazil.

  9. #1229
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Its morally gray...if even is gray at all.
    Doing business with people against freedom of speech and therefore against human rights.

    What will happen in 2047 when the contract with China expires?
    Will Hong Kong lose all freedom?

    I cant help feeling sorry for Hong Kong.
    China has condemned the Hong Kong protests as "behaviour that is close to terrorism" when they are only trying to have basic human rights.
    Except blizzard is not doing business with people against freedom of speech. Blizzard is doing with citizens who are being silenced by their government.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    So? Sucks to be them then. If they have a problem with it, then maybe they should rise up and take care of what cost them the chance. That is the only way it will stop. The whole world is complicit in this.
    How ironic this post is...

  10. #1230
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    I kind of get that but it still feels wrong even if it is in a round about way to punish people for just being alive in the wrong place. I know business gonna business but pullouts, sanctions etc never really do anything to those who need to be punished, if these and sanctions did work we'd have got rid of Putin, PRC, Kim dynasty years ago. But in the end all it ever does is hurt the people who don't have a say and most of the time backfires. I know you can't compare playing games with human rights. Though at the same time it still feels like pulling out of china would punish people who have no say.

    If you gave me a button that said "Hong Kong free." with "High PRC members will all be shown on daytime tv being dragged through the streets." I'd press the button and grab the popcorn, press it again more times for good measure (I mean I would like the entire communist party destroyed. But China has a history of civil wars if change happens far too quickly). I know people that left HK around the time of the handover and work with them along with donating to international charities so people of HK are as safe as possible.

    I'm more mad at Google and Apple than I am at blizzard over China and HK. Blizzard basically banned a player and didn't reign in Netease when it made the Weibo statement (which no one can be 100% sure if even Netease wrote that or Weibo edited the fuck out of it like the do with anything that has a foreign logo on to make it seem like a china number 1 style post. Also not sure what any kind of statement on it would have done that wouldn't fan a flame in one direction. As for the AU thing, that was if they banned people would rebel, if they didn't people would rebel.), it's shitty. But the other two plus others have actually put lives in danger by pulling off apps that protestors use to keep themselves safe. That's magnitudes worse. When it comes to google and people using Youtube to slam blizzard to me it feels like false outrage.

    Basically rallying behind a cause while actually going against your cause by using a platform that's owned by a company that is guilty of all the same things plus more. To me at least it actually feels more like "How can I make internet points and money off rage." if they're using google owned platform for the message, or use apple products at the same time which most of these people are, especially people like Heelsvsbabyface when everything he does is post anti blizzard, add commercials every 5 minutes in the video, since he can't function in a real job and lost a ton of money when he stopped playing wow (Taliesin had the best show about that with him saying he hates bananas and every five minutes Evitel finds him eating one and complaining about eating bananas when all he has to do is top eating bananas.). It's like Sideshow Bob in the Simpson's using TV to cry about TV then trying to cop out with "I know the Irony.".

    As for going forward. Imo as much as I doubt Brack banned Blitz, decided on the initial punishment etc (I'm sure that was done in Taiwan) behind the scenes he and people around him should find a way to get him a payoff for him to fall on his sword so to speak. He may not have done anything personally but he's the face of it and it's on him. Don't let the number be released (even if it was something like $1m it won't look good). Beg Morhaime to come back to steady the ship, he's like, he's presentable, he's media savvy. Everything Brack wasn't even before "You think you do but you don't.". If you're going to be the face you have to be known to the public and at least liked by a certain %. I mean Metzen if it was a figurehead position would be perfect. Loved, Charismatic to a fault, some story guys may have issues but that's about it.

    Maybe 2-3 years of leave Brack could come back at a mid tier level, he did things right before. It's just the position of President when it comes with being a face doesn't work with someone that really isn't media savvy.
    Wow, you really had a lot on your chest in this matter thanks for the nice read
    Im not sure how to reply (>_<)
    I just feel sorry for Hong Kong, that is all...they are fighting for freedom
    "Police have arrested more than 2,300 people since June. Hong Kong leader Carrie Lam has said that, since September, nearly 40% of those arrested were under the age of 18 and 10% under 15, without giving the total number of arrests."

    KIDS...fucking kids fighting for freedom...so sad

  11. #1231
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Except blizzard is not doing business with people against freedom of speech. Blizzard is doing with citizens who are being silenced by their government.
    They cannot get WoW to the people without the ISP and specific approval. Guess who controls the ISP and has to give their approval before they can? The Chinese government. So, they absolutely are doing business with communist regime against freedom of speech. To say they don't is to be wrong.

  12. #1232
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Except blizzard is not doing business with people against freedom of speech. Blizzard is doing with citizens who are being silenced by their government.
    Very nice point, i give you that.

  13. #1233
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Wow, you really had a lot on your chest in this matter thanks for the nice read
    Im not sure how to reply (>_<)
    I just feel sorry for Hong Kong, that is all...they are fighting for freedom
    "Police have arrested more than 2,300 people since June. Hong Kong leader Carrie Lam has said that, since September, nearly 40% of those arrested were under the age of 18 and 10% under 15, without giving the total number of arrests."

    KIDS...fucking kids fighting for freedom...so sad
    I tend to ramble a lot at times. I swear I'm not old :P

  14. #1234
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Very nice point, i give you that.
    Except it isn;'t a point at all. Blizzard cannot get it's game to the people without the ISP which is run by the government. They cannot get their game to the people without approval of said government. That means Blizzard is doing business with the Chinese government and therefore doing business with people that are against freedom of speech.

  15. #1235
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    They cannot get WoW to the people without the ISP and specific approval. Guess who controls the ISP and has to give their approval before they can? The Chinese government. So, they absolutely are doing business with communist regime against freedom of speech. To say they don't is to be wrong.
    And that is
    1. A necessary evil to provide services to the Chinese people, companies and governments have done this for as long as humans have traded.
    2. What do you want blizzard to do about it, hire a private army to take out the Chinese government?

  16. #1236
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    And that is
    1. A necessary evil to provide services to the Chinese people, companies and governments have done this for as long as humans have traded.
    2. What do you want blizzard to do about it, hire a private army to take out the Chinese government?
    1. No it is not necessary evil. There is zero law that says they are required to to business with China. AT ALL.
    2.What I want them to do is cease all business with China until the government cleans up their act. Otherwise J Allen Bracks claims about what Blizzard tries to be is a bunch of BS.

    But I guess it is OK by you for their people to be slaughtered and abused by their government as long as you can make money off of them.
    Last edited by rrayy; 2019-10-14 at 01:06 AM.

  17. #1237
    Over 9000! rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    A necessary evil to provide services to the Chinese people, companies and governments have done this for as long as humans have traded.
    A necessary evil still means they are doing it. Blizzard has modified their product at the direct request of the Chinese government. They need direct approval in order to do business at all. It doesn't matter who the end consumer of the product is. For example The Witcher 3 did not require direct US government approval in order to be sold to United States citizens.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  18. #1238
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    1. No it is not necessary evil. There is zero law that says they are required to to business with China. AT ALL.
    2.What I want them to do is cease all business with China until the government cleans up their act. Otherwise J Allen Bracks claims about what Blizzard tries to be is a bunch of BS.

    But I guess it is OK by you for their people to be slaughtered and abused by their government as long as you can make money off of them.
    Selling stuff to the Chinese people does not mean you condone what Chinese government is doing. Or else no country would do business with china. Germany, turkey or Russia, even America.

    Even back in world war 2 America and Germany still traded goods

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    A necessary evil still means they are doing it. Blizzard has modified their product at the direct request of the Chinese government. They need direct approval in order to do business at all. It doesn't matter who the end consumer of the product is. For example The Witcher 3 did not require direct US government approval in order to be sold to United States citizens.
    ActuAlly yes, witcher 3 did need government approval to be sold here. Any and all big media does. Just like how many pokemon. And yugioh episodes got banned or massively changed. Same with video games and stuff like yugioh cards

  19. #1239
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Selling stuff to the Chinese people does not mean you condone what Chinese government is doing. Or else no country would do business with china. Germany, turkey or Russia, even America.

    Even back in world war 2 America and Germany still traded goods
    Yes it does. If you truly didn't condone it, you wouldn't do business in the first place. That is how you show you don't condone it. As I said, It's OK by you as long as you can make money off of them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Selling stuff to the Chinese people does not mean you condone what Chinese government is doing. Or else no country would do business with china. Germany, turkey or Russia, even America.

    Even back in world war 2 America and Germany still traded goods

    - - - Updated - - -



    ActuAlly yes, witcher 3 did need government approval to be sold here. Any and all big media does. Just like how many pokemon. And yugioh episodes got banned or massively changed. Same with video games and stuff like yugioh cards
    No they didn't. The only government involvement was the rating the game was given. No government approval needed and none had to be asked for. Unlike China.

  20. #1240
    Quote Originally Posted by tmamass View Post
    Seriously? Are you that ignorant to think China will just say "ok ppl you won you can have hong kong for yourself"? if you think that you should see some professional help.
    Nobody is suggesting that totalitarian regimes will go down without a fight.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

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