King Anduin and the irrational haters

[Eggroll]

I don't agree with some of the stuff you've written but this part... yeah, actually. He's the representation of everything the Alliance isn't and doesn't want to be but the devs keep pushing on us so they can more easily develop their horde storylines. Which incidentally are everything the horde doesn't want.

Yeah They manage to piss off both factions to some degree.

Interestingly the people who don't agree with Sylvanas are not dubbed "irrational haters". I wonder why.

[Raisei]

I think a lot of the hate boils down to people thinking Anduin is soft. Which could not be further from the truth really. At most he is soft-spoken because he does not yet have the secrity a High King needs. I mean he is barely 18 for n'zoth's sake, were you a fully grown adult ready to command halve the planet at 18?

Now look back what this teenage boy has done in those few years:
- He convinced Varian to accept the Gilneans back into the Alliance and make peace with Genn.
- He tried to stop Garrosh when he wanted that bell in Pandaria. He stood up to the orcish Warchief about twice his size when he was what 15? He very nearly died for this courage.
- Barely healed a bit later he again stood up to Garrosh during his trial and it is quite aparant that Garrosh started to feel a certain respect for the boy. He could have killed him, but chose not to. Anduin gave back this respect by allowing Garrosh to "walk like a warrior" to his sentence with no foot chains. (Yes, that was a mistake, but it did not change the outcome particularly).
- He explores the Broken Shore alone, with only the player as help and no guards, despite an entire demon army being around and he reawakens Shalamayne through sheer willpower.
- In the Battle of Lordaeron he revives and heals dozens of his soldiers with ONE spell. This might just be the most powerful display of Light powers we have seen apart from what some Naaru did. Later on he protects everyone around him from the Blight.
- Finally when he confronts the Banshee he not only silences Genn Greymane with ONE word but again stands tow to tow with the Horde warchief, this time an incredibly powerful undead.

When I see these events, I see a boy with an incredbly strong will and courage. Sure he is young and surely he will make mistakes, but "soft"? No way. He wants peace but he is ready to fight for it, just as Varian said in his last letter. Contrary to Sylvanas he is a leader I can be proud to stand behind.

[Lumineus]

Saurfang was the one that created the plan for assaulting Kalimdor. That's probably why people include Teldrassil even if it's not totally accurate

If that wasn't part of his plan, why the incendiary siege weapons and flame shaman? Those were totally needed for an occupation force...?

[Eggroll]

Anduin helps carry a Horde general, a man directly responsible for the fall of Ashenvale and who put Teldrassil in the sights of those Demolishers in the first place, to his funeral pyre. If you can't see the problem with that then you're beyond reason and cannot be helped.

I main Horde, champ. Try again.

He also "rewarded" him with an honorable death, and we know that's all an orc is living for. AND he handed him his father's blade Shalamayne, which happens to be a night elven blade - to the butcher of Ashenvale... I can't even.

Varian in MoP
"If you fail to upold honor - like Garrosh did - we will end you."

Varian in Legion
"I believe now as you do that peace is the nobelest aspiration - but to preserve it, you must be willing to fight."

Anduin in BfA
"Fuck you, daddy, I'm giving your blade to a war criminal."

[Trumpcat]

Anduin is a good guy trying to make the best decisions fuelled by a lot of compassion and respect towards others. I really like him and am glad we have this character.

But he is also naive and inexperienced and often thinks he knows better. He should not be a leader of the Alliance, only a king of Stormwind.

[Eggroll]

I think a lot of the hate boils down to people thinking Anduin is soft. Which could not be further from the truth really. At most he is soft-spoken because he does not yet have the secrity a High King needs. I mean he is barely 18 for n'zoth's sake, were you a fully grown adult ready to command halve the planet at 18?

That's just not true. He has a huge cast of leaders with literally MILLENIA of combat experience at his disposal, technology and divine/nature forces the Horde can only dream of. Yet he is written as if he is "all alone".

I think they wrote him well until MoP.

In BfA he's simply a stupid adolescent - which he wasn't before. Remember he was a student of Velen the Prophet! So he must be smart and talented. If his character was continued from MoP he had accepted the counsil of all of his war veterans who bring THOUSANDS of years of combat experience to the table. Who fought the Burning Legion in space.

Of course as a nelf player I hate him for abandoning the Kaldorei. And humiliating them every step of the way. And where is he ready to fight for it? Nowhere.
He's not "standing up against Sylvanas". He lets her escape. Yet again. He allowed the bloodshed in his allies (nelven) territory. Not stirring a finger.

[ConstantinetheGreat]

So Anduin doesn't annoy me because he's a priest or wants peace. We had Varian already and he was cool but it's fine to depart from that and have a different kind of leader for a while. Anduin annoys me because Blizzard seems intent on making him a hapless fool. Sylvanas played him like a fiddle from the beginning to the end of BFA and he didn't have a single moment I can remember where he outmaneuvered her. Mary Sues are annoying in storytelling, but it's equally annoying to go in the complete opposite direction and have your protagonist be so incapable they can't get out of their own way. Anduin needs a win for us to start respecting him. He needs a real win of his own, not by proxy, or via someone else. Hopefully we'll get that in the next expansion. Anduin really needs a "coming into his own" story arc.

[Eggroll]

Anduin is a good guy trying to make the best decisions fuelled by a lot of compassion and respect towards others. I really like him and am glad we have this character.

But he is also naive and inexperienced and often thinks he knows better. He should not be a leader of the Alliance, only a king of Stormwind.

You know, when my character came back from the "Burning of Teldrassil" scenario, his comment was something like "Well, how unfortunate", "now back to business, we must go to Kul'tiras"... does that sound compassionate to you?

[Newname1234567890]

I dunno what you're talking about really. I just read the first part about how the Horde is 3 times stronger than the Alliance which is just bullshit (well maybe player-wise you are right, but not lore-wise). If anything, the Alliance is far more stable, larger, stronger than the Horde. At worst they're equally strong.

Lore wise it makes fuck all sense but apparently Slyvannas has the only army that can fight Nzoth

[Eggroll]

Yeah uh, that's a bit of a stretch. Indirectly responsible at best.

Putting an axe into Malfurion's back, preventing him from defending his people makes him DIRECTLY responsible.

[Raisei]

Lore wise it makes fuck all sense but apparently Slyvannas has the only army that can fight Nzoth

Very likely what Alleria meant is that Sylvanas has an UNDEAD army. Since WoTLK it has been established that undead are not susceptible to Old God corruption and thus can fight N'zoth without worrying about that. I just refuse to believe that the Horde suddenly is so much stronger just because we lost a few ships, that is ridiculous.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Personally I only hate how he looks in the HQ cinematics, the ones with the ingame art style are okay, he looks a bit like his father. The boyband bullshit look in the HQ ones though is just dumb.

[Makorus]

He's not edgy enough, that's why people don't like him.

- - - Updated - - -

That's just not true. He has a huge cast of leaders with literally MILLENIA of combat experience at his disposal, technology and divine/nature forces the Horde can only dream of. Yet he is written as if he is "all alone".

I think they wrote him well until MoP.

In BfA he's simply a stupid adolescent - which he wasn't before. Remember he was a student of Velen the Prophet! So he must be smart and talented. If his character was continued from MoP he had accepted the counsil of all of his war veterans who bring THOUSANDS of years of combat experience to the table. Who fought the Burning Legion in space.

Of course as a nelf player I hate him for abandoning the Kaldorei. And humiliating them every step of the way. And where is he ready to fight for it? Nowhere.
He's not "standing up against Sylvanas". He lets her escape. Yet again. He allowed the bloodshed in his allies (nelven) territory. Not stirring a finger.

I'd rather not want guidance from the faction who managed to have demons fuck up their shit several times by basically inviting them to or from the faction who screwed over so, so, so many countless worlds because they were unwilling to take a stand and were the reasons orcs landed on Azeroth to begin with.

Just because Tyrande is old does not mean she is smart, and she has proven that time and time again (and no, not just in WoW, she wasn't any better in WC3).

[Thelxi]

It's his face tbh, very hateable and punchable.

[lagiacrux]

People hate Anduin because he is the amalgamation of the devs hate for the Alliance. He is the embodiement of the devs desire to make Alliance dumb losers.

your persecution complex is showing ...

[mysticx]

Couldn't agree more. It's nice to see a character who is something different than the angry warmongers. I am glad to see the game evolve to something new and different.

My main issue is that anybody who remains a peacenik when surrounded by angry warmongers is a fool, and since he leads the Alliance for... reasons, that makes the whole Alliance look like fools with him.

[Inukashi]

Every character always has some haters.

Anduin may have some more because he isn't Varian 2.0, but that's okay as it is, because what people need is variety in story telling. So rather give them something to hate, than staying the same forever.

Also as some said. High King was not invented for Anduin. The Title is a bit older, is not exclusive to humans and isn't a leader of all races, but of their military ( https://wow.gamepedia.com/High_King ) and while I think Anduin really isn't fit as the strategic leader of a huge army I also think that he listens to his advisers like Gen.

His Character is as he should be. He is young and got taught by priests. This may not be good in a war driven environment, but is fine storywise. In a Monarchy you don't get to vote your next king.

[Super Dickmann]

Anduin has been right every single time. He always makes the correct choice and when something doesn't go his way, it's someone else's fault and they are either removed as baddies or come around to his viewpoint. His viewpoints are never challenged except by easily defeated strawmen and he never suffers any setback that affects him personally, only other people.

[Greengrim]

...but I fail to see why any of the Alliance races would decide to be ruled by the king of Stormwind. It makes no sense whatsoever.

Because the dogman and the moonemo need a leash, otherwise they'd create an even bigger mess.

And about Anduin, I don't think he's a bad king, it's just that he has yet to show us what he's capable of. He's still young and being very cautious.

What I DO hate about him, however, is his girly looks. I get that he needs to look like the boy he is, but he just looks too feminine. He's named after Anduin Lothar and is a son of Varian fucking Wrynn the Lo'Gosh and wielder of the twin-blades. If it was up to me, I'd visualize him as a freaking tasmanian devil (yes the one from looney toons) wielding lightsabers (literal ones). But I guess that doesn't fit the story huh? His father and godfather were just not that big part of his life... kinda sad, all the potential... soo sooo sad..

[Trumpcat]

You know, when my character came back from the "Burning of Teldrassil" scenario, his comment was something like "Well, how unfortunate", "now back to business, we must go to Kul'tiras"... does that sound compassionate to you?

I agree with you and think Teldrassil is unforgivable, much like Gilneas, Theramore or Southshore. Or Brennadam where civilians were impaled on spikes in front of their children. The way the writers have shown the Horde crimes leaves no room whatsoever for cuddling, yet Anduin is quick to do so. I see this as weak plot writing, but if we look at the character itself - he is portrayed as compassionate, even if story has inconsistencies and plot holes.

His overwhelming goodness is a great weakness - every single time the Alliance suffered some defeat or betrayal Anduin had people advising him against it, yet he proceeded with his ideas and that led to enormous loss of life. We can't excuse his errors that cost so much death just because he is naive, but that is why he should not be leader of the Alliance. We've got Turalyon, Velen, Genn, Jaina, Tyrande, Malfurion - all of them have greater experience, greater insight and greater track record of success. Not to mention that as an "alliance" we should have a council, not a "high king".