Shadow priest nerfs 8.3.0

[Kilee25]

CoP was a very boring playstyle and AS scaling wasn't very good unless there were a metric fuckton of adds (see: Xhul). The biggest problem with Shadow in WoD is that an Affliction Warlock did everything a SPriest could...except better. Regardless, I'm certainly not a fan of current Shadow and I'm praying Blizzard scraps Void Form in 9.0.

Regardless of whether it was boring (which is subjective), it was a solution to a problem that people have been complaining about for years. Personally, I feel the current design is a regression of design evolution, and also (in my opinion) a cave-in to a very vocal minority.

As for AS not scaling well or CoP feeling boring, both of these issues seem like an easily fixable problem to me, and not worth dumping the entire design over.

[Relapses]

Regardless of whether it was boring (which is subjective), it was a solution to a problem that people have been complaining about for years. Personally, I feel the current design is a regression of design evolution, and also (in my opinion) a cave-in to a very vocal minority.

As for AS not scaling well or CoP feeling boring, both of these issues seem like an easily fixable problem to me, and not worth dumping the entire design over.

CoP was only marginally relevant due to the class trinket from Archi. And even then it was a pain in the ass asking my raid to wait for me to farm orbs for every single pull. (Due to the way the ring worked, this wasn't really optional.) Had they maybe baked the class trinket into the spec and given SPriest a way to begin with Orbs and balanced accordingly then yeah, maybe they could've kept it around a bit longer. My biggest complaint for CoP SPriest is that the trade off for putting a lot of effort into being a competitive DPS was equal to a very shitty Mage or Warlock from the same tier. I played a lot of WoW back then and had a fully Mythic geared SPriest, Mage, Warlock, Moonkin and MM Hunter... I remember pretty much benching my SPriest completely because it just wasn't competitive. In the tiers since, SPriest has at least been relevant but the current design paradigm leaves a lot to be desired. As I said before, hopefully we'll get a rework sans-VF in 9.0.

[Kilee25]

CoP was only marginally relevant due to the class trinket from Archi. And even then it was a pain in the ass asking my raid to wait for me to farm orbs for every single pull. (Due to the way the ring worked, this wasn't really optional.) Had they maybe baked the class trinket into the spec and given SPriest a way to begin with Orbs and balanced accordingly then yeah, maybe they could've kept it around a bit longer. My biggest complaint for CoP SPriest is that the trade off for putting a lot of effort into being a competitive DPS was equal to a very shitty Mage or Warlock from the same tier. I played a lot of WoW back then and had a fully Mythic geared SPriest, Mage, Warlock, Moonkin and MM Hunter... I remember pretty much benching my SPriest completely because it just wasn't competitive. In the tiers since, SPriest has at least been relevant but the current design paradigm leaves a lot to be desired. As I said before, hopefully we'll get a rework sans-VF in 9.0.

I don't agree with your world view of how relevant or useful CoP was throughout that expansion, but I'm fine agreeing to disagree with you. I am pretty sure I at least understand your point of view.

As to your other comments, I think that supports my statement that there were things that could have been done to fix the complaints about the spec without just simply tearing it all down and burning it.

I maintain my opinion that CoP was a decent attempt at offering a design solution to the problem of not allowing priests to be too good at everything at the same time. A lot of other classes can talent in different ways to allow themselves to adapt to fights and make themselves useful in different roles. I don't think that's too much to ask with the current design and evolution of the game in mind. If all the other "hybrid" classes have to deal with such restrictions, then I'm fine with them only being good at a few things and being poor at others. As long as other classes are in the same boat with me, then I can live with it.

[Mardux]

Shadow is fine and the nerf is well deserved. You could argue that it was too much but I seriously doubt it.

So does other more reliable shadowpriests, like LeBean #1 SP for M+. As for raids, I think there was a considerable ammount of shadowpriest going for progression AND farm, you can't complain at all.

Having said that, if you're not satisfied with the nerfs, say how much do you think it's more fair or even what is more fair to nerf instead of what they did because honestly thinking shadow is fine is not healthy.

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Dude ...
Boomies and locks doesn't even begin to compare with SP's multitarget. How did you even tried to compare them both, lol
You'd have a point if they all had the same strenght in single and multi. As it stands afflic and Moonkin should have better ST because at multi shadow is way ahead, specially bursty situations.

You say they don't compare on ST, and yet afflic and boomkins both beat (or are equal in only the case of ashvane) spriest on just 2 actual ST fights in current content. (Source: logs)

You aren't advocating for any balance between the 3. You are advocating for boomkin and afflic to be well ahead of spriest on any style fight, which is exactly what will happen with the heavy handedness of the nerfs.

[evertonbelmontt]

You say they don't compare on ST, and yet afflic and boomkins both beat (or are equal in only the case of ashvane) spriest on just 2 actual ST fights in current content. (Source: logs)

You aren't advocating for any balance between the 3. You are advocating for boomkin and afflic to be well ahead of spriest on any style fight, which is exactly what will happen with the heavy handedness of the nerfs.

Afflic doesn't beat shadow on first boss mythic, they are pretty equal.
On Behemoth it does beat it but it's only one boss and it's the two easiest bosses and mostly irrelevant. No one will push you to dps hard on those bosses anyway, but the disparity and the NECESSITY to bring a shadow priest over any other dot class in the latest 3 bosses are very well perceived.

If you think the nerf is too much, feel free to say (quoting me again on that) what you think should have been done instead.
If you think the nerf is unnecessary then good luck I guess.

[Sinaa]

its a well deserved nerf, shadow is overperforming in Palace atm, being atleast 10% better than the 2nd best spec,

never trust sims when it comes to DPS (btw the sims you linked are BfD sims not EP sims), Tier 23 is dazar alor

This is one of the reasons priest needs a second non dot dps spec, so that when they nerf shadow because of raiding, the rest of the more casual players won't get punished alongside raiders.

[Ilnez]

Why nerf our scaling into the ground though? Anyone with any level of experience (except maybe that one guy in this thread talking out his ass who is mad because a SPriest crushed his tiny manhood on Zaqul) know that we're middle of the pack at best barring Gimmicky garbage.

This change basically removes us from competitive viability and turns us into a "bad warlock" more than anything else.

There are no other specs to play either; both Holy and Disc become unplayable with their own nerfs.

RIP essences.

[deviantcultist]

turns us into a "bad warlock" more than anything else.

It always boils down to this. Feels sad to be forced into this situation for the sake of playing a true Shadowy class.

[united]

Why nerf our scaling into the ground though? Anyone with any level of experience (except maybe that one guy in this thread talking out his ass who is mad because a SPriest crushed his tiny manhood on Zaqul) know that we're middle of the pack at best barring Gimmicky garbage.

This change basically removes us from competitive viability and turns us into a "bad warlock" more than anything else.

There are no other specs to play either; both Holy and Disc become unplayable with their own nerfs.

RIP essences.

Yep, the disc schism + essence nerf is huge. RIP :/

[Relapses]

It always boils down to this. Feels sad to be forced into this situation for the sake of playing a true Shadowy class.

6.2 Affliction is the best version of SPriest Blizzard ever developed.

[gaaara]

I saw some of the videos of the first couple of bosses, shadow priests were still dominating there. Not sure if the fixes were still in though.

[rips]

I saw some of the videos of the first couple of bosses, shadow priests were still dominating there. Not sure if the fixes were still in though.

its raidtesting. people play with old stuff thats overpowered. and the AS "bug fix" isnt in. which is the big nerf that destroy the spec

[Heavens Night]

Reminder that Shadow Priests *should* be terrible single target, or at least near the bottom in relation to every other spec. DoT specs should never be able to compete with other classes for top dps on 1 target, and right now they're near the top, and far and away the best spread dot dps.

This is just garbage.

Shadow has been awful for a long time before right now. The reason why we now have these nerfs are plain and simple because Blizzard failed miserably at class design in BfA, and when you fail at the start you then have repercussions down the line.

[qactuar]

I'm only concerned with nerfs as far as how they affect being out in the world. Damage keeps getting lowered but shadow's still go just about nothing as far as meaningful defensives or even escape tools...other classes/specs have buttons to press if things start going badly for them with a pull, but with shadow all I can do is hit dispersion and hope I don't get dazed as I'm running away. Feels bad and I know most people won't care because it has nothing to do with raiding but this stuff's important to me too!

[Heavens Night]

I'm only concerned with nerfs as far as how they affect being out in the world. Damage keeps getting lowered but shadow's still go just about nothing as far as meaningful defensives or even escape tools...other classes/specs have buttons to press if things start going badly for them with a pull, but with shadow all I can do is hit dispersion and hope I don't get dazed as I'm running away. Feels bad and I know most people won't care because it has nothing to do with raiding but this stuff's important to me too!

This stuff is important to me too. I care just as much about this as raiding. It's very frustrating indeed.

[Sarkol]

This is just garbage.

Shadow has been awful for a long time before right now. The reason why we now have these nerfs are plain and simple because Blizzard failed miserably at class design in BfA, and when you fail at the start you then have repercussions down the line.

The only people who think it's garbage are people very happy with their OP status and want to keep it. Rational people would probably accept that if a spec completely dominates spread dot fights, they probably shouldn't also be near the top, or on top of ST. This is not really a class design issue, but a numbers issue.

[Heavens Night]

The only people who think it's garbage are people very happy with their OP status and want to keep it. Rational people would probably accept that if a spec completely dominates spread dot fights, they probably shouldn't also be near the top, or on top of ST. This is not really a class design issue, but a numbers issue.

Good lord.

[Kaver]

Ranged dot specs should be great at multi-target cleave and bad at single target fights. It’s a simple trade off.

[Hilaw]

Shadow priest has been top tier for 3 raids now, It's well deserved nerf, but some nerfs might be too much. Hopefully they monitor how it does and throw some buffs if needed.

[Ilnez]

Shadow priest has been top tier for 3 raids now, It's well deserved nerf, but some nerfs might be too much. Hopefully they monitor how it does and throw some buffs if needed.

It'll be too late. Once we're all on alts for week 1 heroic prog it'll be too late to go back.