J. Allen Brack: Regarding Last Weekend’s Hearthstone Grandmasters Tournament

[Relapses]

Hey, calm down there tiger. You're literally wiping Blizzard's ass constantly because you want to "stick it to the SJWs" like the typical edgy gamer. You're constantly strawmaning me despite my original post being nothing of the sort. I'm not even boycotting Blizzard, I'm pointing out their hypocrisy that Blizzard literally doesn't enforce that rule consistently, which you ignore. American University players held up a sign saying "Free Hong Kong, boycott Blizz" during a match but weren't punished AND they were offered another match. It took 7 days, after people pointed out the hypocrisy, for Blizzard to finally ban them but they had already dropped out prior. Their intent was to call out Blizzard's bluff, and they succeeded. If it wasn't pointed out, they wouldn't have been banned. The delay is proof of that.

How the fuck can you keep defending Blizzard's actions if they're not consistent? How can you not see the equivalency that Blizzard does this specifically for the money? Oh right, cause you shill for Blizzard and are against the market fighting back.

Keep up the fight for those social credits, bootlicker!

I'm not fighting for anything. I'm expressing my personal view that:

a.) There isn't enough evidence, to me, to correlate this incident with Blizzard "supporting" the humanitarian crisis in China...
b.) This occurred at an exceptionally poor time as I also believe many people are conflating Blizzard simply enforcing an already existing rule with somehow trying to "silence" political dissidents...
...and most importantly,
c.) There are a large number of people who are entirely incapable of critical thinking who don't actually care to look at this situation objectively and are instead hopping on the "voting with (my) wallet" bandwagon for no legitimate reason.

I am well aware of the counter arguments to each of these view points so save yourself the trouble of trying to debate me here. I will say, however, that at no point have I ever said my view point was more correct than anybody elses', just that I really wish people would try to approach this situation with an open mind. And for what it's worth, I actually agree that Blizzard's handling of this situation has done them absolutely zero favors in the PR department. But where I see a PR fuck-up, others (you) see a pro-China cover-up and blanket support for a totalitarian regime. I'm simply not convinced.

Finally, this is just me speaking as an individual, but I really hate to see people who work for Blizzard being negatively impacted by a hivemind mentality of the easily incensed "morally correct" sections of the internet.

[Muajin76]

Then maybe they should rise up and do something about their fucked-up government.

You people should really look up the word "collaborator" in regards to WWII, and maybe you'll get some idea of why people are disgusted by this type of behavior, as it's evoking exactly the same feelings from people.
.

This protest would never get past day ONE if it were to happen in say Beijing. Due to Xi having complete authority and power in mainland, unlike HK where it's ruled by a sub part of the Chinese government in a way. The reason nothing serious is getting done to quel the protest is due to the one country 2 system thing with HK and mainland China. Xi can't really do anything. He did think about sending troops but that would most likely escalate the situation.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizzard has no tegrity

I'm sure they did ages ago. But not in the day and age where a big gaming company does business with a country that brings in a nice steady cash flow..
It's sad I know. Had Blizz stuck to their morals and integrity, they would have lost A LOT of business and future revenue. Still f'd up on how they handled things..but big company = big company.

[Sulika]

Information is very important for any political or civil protest action, you are saying to blindly trust a bunch of strangers just because they said something the government doesn't like. What happens when the protesters are wrong, were lied to, or have an ulterior motive to protect a killer? Who are they fighting, what was the catalyst, what is the goal, what is the most likely outcome, etc.

No I'm not saying that. Saying you should express solidarity with large peaceful civilian protests is not the same as saying you should just blindly trust any random bunch of strangers. Everyone should have the right to protest against their government. Why would you even try to make such a ridiculous false equivalency.

[Sharpbladez]

Why is this topic still going? I swear every thread on here goes 100 pages. Move on

[mvaliz]

...a rule that existed to prevent stupid shit like this ...

And that's where I stopped reading.

In all that insane outrage you wrote, you accuse others of outrage - yet, in one concise sentence, you reveal your true self.

No doubt this will validate your outrage™ senses more, and become more outraged™. Having fed your outrage™, you will then strike your warrior™ stance, get to typing on the internet™ via a fury of outrage™ at me - accusing me of being an "internet outrage warrior¡©" for pointing out to you that you apparently find expressing solidarity with a repressed people from a tyranical government as "stupid shit like this" and need to outrage™ about people who outrage™ about this.

It happens all the time. Most normal people who aren't political now see this in entertainment, in sports, and - yes - in Esports now, and you know what they do when this happens? They simply *snort*, roll their eyes for a second, and move on with their lives. Meanwhile, some others get the simple message of just being aware of the plight - and it may help to serve others passively.

They don't behave like "Internet Warriors who are outraged™" like you, which is - obviously - NOT to be confused with the "Internet Outrage Warriors©" as you label others. Clearly 2 different people. Really... you totally are.

[FlashingSilver]

And that's where I stopped reading.

In all that insane outrage you wrote, you accuse others of outrage - yet, in one concise sentence, you reveal your true self.

No doubt this will validate your outrage™ senses more, and become more outraged™. Having fed your outrage™, you will then strike your warrior™ stance, get to typing on the internet™ via a fury of outrage™ at me - accusing me of being an "internet outrage warrior¡©" for pointing out to you that you apparently find expressing solidarity with a repressed people from a tyranical government as "stupid shit like this" and need to outrage™ about people who outrage™ about this.

It happens all the time. Most normal people who aren't political now see this in entertainment, in sports, and - yes - in Esports now, and you know what they do when this happens? They simply *snort*, roll their eyes for a second, and move on with their lives. Meanwhile, some others get the simple message of just being aware of the plight - and it may help to serve others passively.

They don't behave like "Internet Warriors who are outraged™" like you, which is - obviously - NOT to be confused with the "Internet Outrage Warriors©" as you label others. Clearly 2 different people. Really... you totally are.

I haven't read this thread much but by barely skimming i can tell you need to go outside and get some air

[Relapses]

And that's where I stopped reading.

In all that insane outrage you wrote, you accuse others of outrage - yet, in one concise sentence, you reveal your true self.

No doubt this will validate your outrage™ senses more, and become more outraged™. Having fed your outrage™, you will then strike your warrior™ stance, get to typing on the internet™ via a fury of outrage™ at me - accusing me of being an "internet outrage warrior¡©" for pointing out to you that you apparently find expressing solidarity with a repressed people from a tyranical government as "stupid shit like this" and need to outrage™ about people who outrage™ about this.

It happens all the time. Most normal people who aren't political now see this in entertainment, in sports, and - yes - in Esports now, and you know what they do when this happens? They simply *snort*, roll their eyes for a second, and move on with their lives. Meanwhile, some others get the simple message of just being aware of the plight - and it may help to serve others passively.

They don't behave like "Internet Warriors who are outraged™" like you, which is - obviously - NOT to be confused with the "Internet Outrage Warriors©" as you label others. Clearly 2 different people. Really... you totally are.

Bro, I don't believe I ever even responded to you directly and I'm sure all that seemed really cool when you thought about it beforehand... but uh, do me a favor and read your post out loud and then ask yourself if it was really worth it.

[shadowmatrix]

No I'm not saying that. Saying you should express solidarity with large peaceful civilian protests is not the same as saying you should just blindly trust any random bunch of strangers. Everyone should have the right to protest against their government. Why would you even try to make such a ridiculous false equivalency.

There are government and military groups who specialize in stirring up unrest using lies. Wars have started over lies, incoming WMD accusations. It doesn't matter that they are peaceful, you still should know the facts before giving them support. Just because you CAN do something doesn't always mean you SHOULD.

[Sulika]

There are government and military groups who specialize in stirring up unrest using lies. Wars have started over lies, incoming WMD accusations. It doesn't matter that they are peaceful, you still should know the facts before giving them support. Just because you CAN do something doesn't always mean you SHOULD.

If you are suspicious of hundreds of thousands of peaceful protesters because you think they could all be some sort of brain washed manchurian candidates you might need a break from the internet for a while. That is not normal healthy scepticism, that is being paranoid.

[GreenJesus]

This whole #boycottblizzard is kinda funny. You still buy clothes and electronics that are made by companies who have factories in china that exploit chinese workers. But hey Blizzard is the real evil here.

It's more like Blizzard is increasingly catering to China and we are lashing out at Blizzard for ignoring their original audience and making games for China. This Hong Kong disaster is the cherry on the cake that proves their future direction doesnt care about us or our values.

[Relapses]

It's more like Blizzard is increasingly catering to China and we are lashing out at Blizzard for ignoring their original audience and making games for China. This Hong Kong disaster is the cherry on the cake that proves their future direction doesnt care about us or our values.

Uh huh. And what's your smoking gun that relates this entire fiasco as anything other than a rule enforcement? China = BAD isn't convincing enough, sorry.

[Eapoe]

It's more like Blizzard is increasingly catering to China and we are lashing out at Blizzard for ignoring their original audience and making games for China. This Hong Kong disaster is the cherry on the cake that proves their future direction doesnt care about us or our values.

No, it’s more that Blizzard did something in the public light which set people off. The same people who still pay $30-50+ taking their children to see Disney movies and making Disney billions of dollars. The same people who buy clothing, that if they simply looked at the label would see it was made in China. The same people who buy electronics with parts assembled in China.
It’s fine to be upset about something happening in China if you don’t agree with the political views or something they are doing, just don’t be hypocritical about it.
I also like how reading thru some of these posts people have shown outrage at Blizzard because they alter some of the content for the Chinese market, while ignoring the U.S. for censoring out things like people smoking cigarettes in children’s cartoons produced in other markets.
Be upset. Be outraged. Be complacent. Don’t care. Just don’t be hypocritical because then you look like an ignorant imbecile that just jumps on hype trains.

[shadowmatrix]

If you are suspicious of hundreds of thousands of peaceful protesters because you think they could all be some sort of brain washed manchurian candidates you might need a break from the internet for a while. That is not normal healthy scepticism, that is being paranoid.

If it was pre-Trump you would be right but these days people easily allow themselves to get heated and stop thinking. When Rudy Giuliani is willing to say in federal court that even if the president murdered someone in the streets the law could not persecute till they left office. It is a pathetically stupid argument yet there are idiots who believe that.

[Elkfingers]

This whole #boycottblizzard is kinda funny. You still buy clothes and electronics that are made by companies who have factories in china that exploit chinese workers. But hey Blizzard is the real evil here.

Oh look. It's the argument from "Other people are doing the bad thing too".

[Relapses]

Oh look. It's the argument from "Other people are doing the bad thing too".

It's not the best argument but it does smack of hypocrisy when you see,

"BOYCOTT BLIZZARD!!!1 WURST COMPANY EVR, BLIZZARD FROM 20 YEARS AGO WOULD NVR DO THIS!!!"

-Posted from my iPhone 11

Don't get me wrong, people should be allowed to pick and choose their own moral battlefields but a lot of this, to me, seems to be surface level hatred of Blizzard's recent design choices somehow validated by a very tenuous relation to an innocuous rule enforcement in a politically volatile region.

[Elkfingers]

It's not the best argument but it does smack of hypocrisy when you see,

"BOYCOTT BLIZZARD!!!1 WURST COMPANY EVR, BLIZZARD FROM 20 YEARS AGO WOULD NVR DO THIS!!!"

-Posted from my iPhone 11

Don't get me wrong, people should be allowed to pick and choose their own moral battlefields but a lot of this, to me, seems to be surface level hatred of Blizzard's recent design choices somehow validated by a very tenuous relation to an innocuous rule enforcement in a politically volatile region.

Oh aye for sure, there are a bunch of people with loosely defined ideological convictions jumping on the bandwagon despite not really being remotely coherent as to why they're really against this sort of thing...but it's still weird to me when people use that as a reason to vindicate Blizzard's part in all this.

People are right to think that Blizzard's response has been just a tad disingenuous, even if they're right for the wrong reasons.

[Relapses]

Oh aye for sure, there are a bunch of people with loosely defined ideological convictions jumping on the bandwagon despite not really being remotely coherent as to why they're really against this sort of thing...but it's still weird to me when people use that as a reason to vindicate Blizzard's part in all this.

People are right to think that Blizzard's response has been just a tad disingenuous, even if they're right for the wrong reasons.

I don't know if I'd sway into disingenuous territory but this whole PR debacle could have been handled much better. I don't envy their position because with the hyper-sensitive nature of outrage culture nearly any response would have resulted in offending some portion of their playerbase. That's sort of the crux of this whole debate... some people believe Blizzard chose to side with their benevolent Chinese overlords while others see this in a far more pragmatic light. I'm in the latter camp but apparently criticizing the former camp makes me a keyboard warrior so, well, nature of arguing on the internet I guess.

[Corroc]

Oh look. It's the argument from "Other people are doing the bad thing too".

Because Blizzard isn't even remotely as bad as the other companies. Blizzard doesn't want to get in to politics, only wants to offer entertainment in games for people all around the world, including China. Meanwhile other companies only manufacture clothes or electronics in China because the workers there have less right and get less money for doing that stuff. Other companies are literally exploiting the chinese citizens as economic decision while Blizzard only wanted to keep politics out of their esports.

[DotEleven]

Oh aye for sure, there are a bunch of people with loosely defined ideological convictions jumping on the bandwagon despite not really being remotely coherent as to why they're really against this sort of thing...but it's still weird to me when people use that as a reason to vindicate Blizzard's part in all this.

People are right to think that Blizzard's response has been just a tad disingenuous, even if they're right for the wrong reasons.

Here's the thing. If they're upset about the severity of the punishment, that's one thing. The time he was banned for was WAY too much. But there are so many people out there that aren't upset for that reason. They are upset because Blizzard punished someone for political beliefs they believe in. These same people would be cheering Blizzard on had they banned someone for chanting "Lock Her Up" or "Make America Great Again". That makes them hypocrites because once again, they aren't upset that Blizzard punished someone for a political saying, they punished someone for a political saying they personally believed in.

[Elkfingers]

Here's the thing. If they're upset about the severity of the punishment, that's one thing. The time he was banned for was WAY too much. But there are so many people out there that aren't upset for that reason. They are upset because Blizzard punished someone for political beliefs they believe in. These same people would be cheering Blizzard on had they banned someone for chanting "Lock Her Up" or "Make America Great Again". That makes them hypocrites because once again, they aren't upset that Blizzard punished someone for a political saying, they punished someone for a political saying they personally believed in.

Yeah that's exactly right. Politics isn't sports, and political decisions have consequences. I don't want the companies that I deal with to take some sort of pseudo-apolitical stance, not do they actually do that in practice.

Blizzard for example has a very clear policy on what it doesn't tolerate in the way of hate speech, and I'm sure that there are people who choose not to give them money because they disagree with that stance. Blizzard's platforms have also been used in the past to promote civil rights issues that Blizzard also promotes, and no action was taken against those people. The difference here is that Blizzard has chosen to remain neutral on Hong Kong (whether that's possible to do when you have a trading interest in the Chinese market is another conversation entirely), and I disagree with that choice.

The whole point of holding companies to account for their political stances is to make them reconsider that stance. China should not be trying to encroach on Hong Kong's political automony, nor is it right for them to brutally suppress protests as that is clearly a free speech issue. When the cards are down, I think it is wrong for Blizzard to be neutral when it comes to whether or not authoritarian regimes are ok - they're not ok.

It is specifically the inconsistency of their approach when it comes to this particular issue that I have a problem with because it inadvertently reveals a clear bias.