Why economy is so bad at bfa?

[Kelathos]

This is BFA, I have struggled to not LOSE gold by playing this game and obtaining food / flasks / pots for raiding. I'd be broke by now if I did not skip on potions except for the most difficult of progression fights. AOTC raider, apparently super casual and zero gold accumulation since Blizzard killed mission tables.

[ultima ratio]

Is it because people are trying to buy the dino/AH mount?
People don't want to spend much gold?
People need to remove gold on BMAH because of mounts?



(FOR EXAMPLE TOO, i was going for sha of anger mount on BMAH, 2M on my server, a guy booster just comes with his gold bank and puts it to damn gold cap, you can't LITERALLY compete with that. It's really unfair. Someone don't have time or patience to boost and gets wrecked. It's pointless.)

u ask the wrong question. economy isnt bad at all. in fact, with the removal of passive income its more balanced and plays into casual gaming behavior (who coulndt do gold missions 4xday on 20 toons)-

the real question is: y r u bad a BFA economy? cuz without gold missions u dont earn, hm?
hint: rlly shouldnt trust reddit woweconomy, gumdrops is a srub, the real deals wont ever be posted there.

there r many many ways of income... i earn 2-2,5m simply via daily cds.

but dont blame someone who earned, to have stolen ur mount.


butbutbut itsosounfair. not it isnt, its called free market. if u r a scrub, well then u dont get ur BMAH mount.

[Final Verdict]

u ask the wrong question. economy isnt bad at all. in fact, with the removal of passive income its more balanced and plays into casual gaming behavior (who coulndt do gold missions 4xday on 20 toons)-

the real question is: y r u bad a BFA economy? cuz without gold missions u dont earn, hm?
hint: rlly shouldnt trust reddit woweconomy, gumdrops is a srub, the real deals wont ever be posted there.

there r many many ways of income... i earn 2-2,5m simply via daily cds.

but dont blame someone who earned, to have stolen ur mount.


butbutbut itsosounfair. not it isnt, its called free market. if u r a scrub, well then u dont get ur BMAH mount.

But it really is unfair for pl like Shakana. They simply dont know how to earn. Someones gotta show them? Maybe Blizzney should offer a tutorial on flipping or Garrisons... or maybe Gumdrops?

[Th3Scourge]

And what is the damn problem with that? You're playing a game that you don't want to do shit to farm yourself and just to get boosted and fill the trade with boosts everywhere, and then complains that "social" part of the game is dead.. I wonder why....

The market demand shifted to other products and services that you don't want to be a part of for several reasons. That's not the games fault.

[Marrilaife]

The ATV is also a good one

Lol. Before my guild crumbled I've done Mechagon for like 2 months, saw a pattern drop once, not for me though. And then you need the other half too on some alt, or partner with someone who has it. Maybe when they put Mechagon hc in 8.3 the pattern will be actually farmable more than 1 try per week.

Also ppl are spamming trade selling it for 21k on my server, not exactly a golden egg.

I'm selling the green corehound for more, only gated by how eager I am to farm legion bloods.

Tbh most stuff I'm selling is from old xpacs, like wod bags still sell...

[textz]

or maybe just roll on Sha of Anger once a week? does it really matter? i rolled 210 times on Rukhmar without success, but have 410 mounts, so what?

its not the markets fault, economy is much more stable in BFA than Legion due to (others already mentioned it) the removal of passive income, which actually support casual players (as they neither had time nor the alt army to earn big).

maybe just invest some brain and learn how to play the AH or join M+community, organise sell-runs etc. complaining wont help her, cuz Blizzney for sure wont roll up economy, cuz Shakana got overbid on her BMAH mount by a "gold bank"...

its not a them-problem, its a u-problem, but self-insight is obv a challenge for some.

[betonstahl]

[video=youtube;zRIbf6JqkNc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRIbf6JqkNc[/vieo]

[Shakana]

Your logic is lacking serious foundation. Like in every market, where there is a demand there is also a supply.
And since boosting requires you to put effort and have skill it is justly rewarded.

Yes boosts are fine, it is a core of economy from the very start. Funny enough, it's nowhere near the best method to earn gold.

What is lacking "serious foundation"? Everyone "can be a booster" it's what it seems. So now if you want to make gold you need to want be a booster? Instead of doing your own shit? I didnt know when i started playing this game, it was called "boosting community"

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The market demand shifted to other products and services that you don't want to be a part of for several reasons. That's not the games fault.

No, it's "ours" for saying boosts are fine. And continue the reign of that. If they were take in moderation, there would be no problem.
Also you log in wow, go orgrimmar "hmm what am i going to do today? ah right boosting" that's such a content for a player. And also social element is so unique: "How much?" " 300K" "Oh i want to have have of the curve cause i'm incapable of finding myself a guild and i suck at playing this game but i want to show people i can play it, can you please book me a spot" "sure" *talks no more* as it lets boosters do everything and themselves don't talk. Sure, it's really entertaining, and also how a game with such a big world should be.
They only do it for cosmetics, boosters are killing guilds, community and economy.

[ghays]

Yep, basically casual player has no gold because they nuked mission tables and professions barely produce anything worth buying, so 2 sources of gold for casuals gone. Who has gold? People who buy it for $$$ through tokens. What do they spend this gold on? Boosts. The cycle completes.

Boosting also got "institutionalized", back in MOP with CM runs it was small groups of people, usually a team just advertising for themselves, same with raids, usually a guild would advertise curve boost or old mount sell (my guild used to sell Blackhand and Guldan mounts) to fund consumables for raiding. Nowadays everywhere are boosting "communities" and "discords", they take the lion share of the market and small teams / guilds can't compete anymore while the big fish are making billions. It's like shopping malls vs family business corner stores. The second ones stand no chance.

People say boosting always existed, and they're right, but it was never before so dominant, it went from something shameful and done under the table to basically half the trade chat filled with boost offers (and the other half is guilds desperately trying to recruit), the biggest loser of this system is a casual player because he has no gold to buy boost, no time / dedication to push themselves to the gear level where they can boost and probably don't have connections to join successful boosting organizations, and the worst part is, he will have to deal with all the boosted animals in his pugs afterwards, who have ilvl / score, but no clue cuz they got it afk.

And I don't think much will change, and if it will, it will be for the worse, because Activision is enthralled with how market of mobile gaming works where 99% of playerbase is an irrelevant mass and a background for whales. So yeah, in wow we have whales (boost buyers), people who provide services to whales (boosters), Blizz gets 5$ cut from every token sold and is happy, and everyone else doesn't matter in the equation.

I miss MOP where I made bank from cutting gems. However you can see what they did now. They was a great analysis on the forums, sadly I don't remember the author. But what he said was the prospect rate of green / red gems is deliberately set to low so people are forced to prospect thousands of ores for JC rings (somehow blacksmiths and other professions are nowhere near as close in mats cost for their BOP items) and then market gets flooded with redundant gems of other colors so the price got driven to the ground very fast.

Even in legion there were avenues of "obliterum shuffle" or selling your blood of sargeras for something valuable.

Nowadays your options are: grind for "minimal wage", buy gold, boost, or be an AH tycoon (usually works on medium to low pop servers, on high pop competition won't let you easily keep prices where you want them or corner / monopolize a market). Small fries of the AH went the same way as small scale boost teams - got pushed out to the point of little profitability.

Since average casual has little money, they won't be as interested in buying vanity / luxury goods like transmogs, pets, mounts, toys, "fun" seasonal items, expensive boes, etc. So the market got much smaller, compounded with the fact BFA has seen a massive sub dropoff. Some people will try to question that, since Blizzard doesn't provide numbers, but their aggressive campaigns like 2 6-month sub promos and now new RAF suggest they're really trying to get back subs and not just "1-month visitors for a new patch". And the second category of people are only present when a new patch launches, then quickly go into hiatus, so when you're in the "in between patches" period the market shrinks significantly.

Not to mention Blizzard changed how AH deposits are calculated somewhere in 8.1 or so, which basically strangulated markets for mats / consumables that aren't of the "sold within a day" category (majority of old expansion mats). I hope they'll revert it in 8.3 with the AH changes.

Activision is most certainly the worst thing to happen to WoW ever.

[Th3Scourge]

What is lacking "serious foundation"? Everyone "can be a booster" it's what it seems. So now if you want to make gold you need to want be a booster? Instead of doing your own shit? I didnt know when i started playing this game, it was called "boosting community"

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No, it's "ours" for saying boosts are fine. And continue the reign of that. If they were take in moderation, there would be no problem.

Boost are fine. There's a market for people wanting to get weekly caches, M+ runs for loot. So long as there's people buying boosts, there'll always be people selling boosts, and a competent team can clear 10s in no time, move on to the next sale and make more gold than playing the AH.

[kaminaris]

Boost are fine. There's a market for people wanting to get weekly caches, M+ runs for loot. So long as there's people buying boosts, there'll always be people selling boosts, and a competent team can clear 10s in no time, move on to the next sale and make more gold than playing the AH.

There isn't a better way than playing AH. Boosting is nowhere near as much as you can earn from flipping for the same amount of time spent.

[Shakana]

Boost are fine. There's a market for people wanting to get weekly caches, M+ runs for loot. So long as there's people buying boosts, there'll always be people selling boosts, and a competent team can clear 10s in no time, move on to the next sale and make more gold than playing the AH.

Keep that thinking, you will sooner or later, understand the game is just a plague of boosting communities, when before was just chinese farmers. Also blizzard has no interest in taking boosters down, cause they don't want to lose more players. And since it's FILLED with it, my orgrimmar trade every 1 milisecond has a boosting spam, they know for a fact there's a lot of this. Max i used to see about boosting before bfa and legion with m+ and so on, was about leveling boosting. It's unbalanced as hell, and they don't have moderation at all.

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or maybe just roll on Sha of Anger once a week? does it really matter? i rolled 210 times on Rukhmar without success, but have 410 mounts, so what?

its not the markets fault, economy is much more stable in BFA than Legion due to (others already mentioned it) the removal of passive income, which actually support casual players (as they neither had time nor the alt army to earn big).

maybe just invest some brain and learn how to play the AH or join M+community, organise sell-runs etc. complaining wont help her, cuz Blizzney for sure wont roll up economy, cuz Shakana got overbid on her BMAH mount by a "gold bank"...

its not a them-problem, its a u-problem, but self-insight is obv a challenge for some.

Oh i do, but sha of anger mount ain't even worth a gold cap, even less. That person just made that to show off and as he said "make history" with multibox characters after mounting on it, just to say "deal with it", truly feels amazing that you can compete for it, and someone just goes there to rub it on your face "boosting life YO". Lol It's just pointless, but economy itself on wow it's like dead besides this little things. As i said, i'm not against boosting, i'm against the uncontrollable way they reign on the market. And kinda reflects nowadays irl, the richer gets richer, and the poor gets poorer. Some have so much by doing something like boosting, who doesn't like boosting gets literally nothing in return and have to compete with that, that is not fair, whatsoever.

[Averrix]

That is one of the major things that killed the herb/ore market. That multiboxers can now just go around and herb or mine a node 5 times. The thing that made star roses so expensive is cause they were a bit rare to get, you had to herb a lot before you even got one. And also, herbs and ore are EVERYWHERE. Most of the time I don't even stop for herbs or ore anymore because it's in such abundance everywhere there's no point.

[Th3Scourge]

There isn't a better way than playing AH. Boosting is nowhere near as much as you can earn from flipping for the same amount of time spent.

It would appear that the OP seems to think there is no money in AH flipping anymore because boosts ruined the AH

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Keep that thinking, you will sooner or later, understand the game is just a plague of boosting communities, when before was just chinese farmers. Also blizzard has no interest in taking boosters down, cause they don't want to lose more players. And since it's FILLED with it, my orgrimmar trade every 1 milisecond has a boosting spam, they know for a fact there's a lot of this. Max i used to see about boosting before bfa and legion with m+ and so on, was about leveling boosting. It's unbalanced as hell, and they don't have moderation at all.

Well I'd hope they don't take them down because I enjoy selling keys.

There far more unbalanced issues in WoW than selling keys, AOTC and mythic kills. You can also just add the chat spam to your ignore list.

[Steelcryo]

One thing I think the game desperately needs is a level squish, not because leveling to 120 seems intimidating to new players, but because it gives the perfect opportunity to undo the stupidity that is expansion specific profession skills. While in theory, it was a great idea, in practice is was dumb. It meant players who spent all their time maxing professions are suddenly back on the same playing field as someone that just rolled a new character. There's very little time and effort needed to get to the max recipes of professions, which means anyone can do it super easily on alts and new toons, which means professions have no value.

That in turn means most things you can make and sell, are worth nothing on the AH. Sure, it wasn't too hard to max professions before, but much fewer people actually did and people couldn't just reroll a new toon and have a second set of professions maxed within an afternoon. Which meant that there was some value to the harder to create items. We need to go back to that.

I get it was done so new players could easily catch up with veterans, but frankly that's wrong. Sure, it gives the new player a sense of "I can compete" which keeps them playing, but it absolutely killed professions and did far more harm to the game than good. Besides, most new players will stick around if they enjoy the game, not because they can max professions super quick. But then they'll just join the veterans and realise, catching up easily was pointless as professions are worthless.

I think that directly is why boosting has become so popular, because it's about the only good source of gold left. Professions are dead, farming old content is dead, farming BoE's is dead thanks to Benthic gear, they were the main three consistent money makers that most players could and would do before. Now all that's left is boosting people, which means people wanting boosts sell tokens, give the gold to the boosters, the boosters buy tokens (which gives gold back to the people wanting boosts and selling tokens) and the cycle repeats.


Edit: Yes things like AH flipping still exist, but the markets and margins for that are smaller on most items and the ones that aren't, are already highly competed and dominated by people with far larger banks than the average player. The issues above I was talking about the average player, not the AH tycoons and such who can and do still make large amounts from AH flipping, but if every player did that, no-one would make any money from it.

[Aphrel]

Because everything was made so easy that players can effortlessly get the mats they need to craft what they need.
This results in there being a higher supply than demand for pretty much everything.

Thus its ahrder to earn gold on ah.

Pots and vantus runes are pretty much the only thing easily sold now.

[monkaW]

Dont sell herbs, there are less raider these days to buy mats like pot, runes, and flask, the number of raiders is pretty much halved every tier, and so does mats consumption, and the supply isnt going down either.

Sell a carry run, do a double carry run if you can (during a good affix), that's almost 250k divided to 3 people per 30 minutes these days, you can buy 1 token in 1 hour.

[Drusin]

And it's a step on a right direction that they did this change also, to not use addons for AH

You're funny

[Sarkol]

Things are selling as well as ever. Alchemy, Inscription, Boe's and flipping have made me 9m gold since 8.2, and 2.6m in the last month alone. It's as easy as checking what's profitable and crafting it. People haven't stopped buying things.

[Sevaara]

I was about to start 4-5 hours of herb/ore farming, 10 druids landed on my node and now I see no point. Druids are on the same realm as me so the market will be saturated. Ah well.