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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Caperfin View Post
    This comment should be pinned/stickied.
    I know you guys talk about this, and theres disagreement on the term "viable", but this is why ppl dont like to bring dps hybrids. While you are cycling different ranks to "fix" the mana problems of your spec, the mage is just spamming max rank frostbolt and doing double your damage.

  2. #42
    You could reduce the cost of damaging spells for DPS specs (and paladin tanks) almost across the board and fix a lot of issues. I think Resto shaman needs a 30% mana regen like priest/druid.

    Quote Originally Posted by kail View Post
    No but the specs where at least playable. Can't speak for arcane mages in that expansion, they seemed non-existent until Wrath.
    Arcane was fixed late in BC and became extremely strong in the right gear.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    I know you guys talk about this, and theres disagreement on the term "viable", but this is why ppl dont like to bring dps hybrids. While you are cycling different ranks to "fix" the mana problems of your spec, the mage is just spamming max rank frostbolt and doing double your damage.
    I spam max rank starfire as Boomkin and went oom only twice for Maj and Rag fights and was saved by CDs / consumables. Innervate is for myself, demonic rune + mana potion + no silly healing out of form = no mana issues. Imp GotW, Moonkin aura, is my utility. Only getting out of chocobo form for critical BR or Tranquil.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Gratlim View Post
    I spam max rank starfire as Boomkin and went oom only twice for Maj and Rag fights and was saved by CDs / consumables. Innervate is for myself, demonic rune + mana potion + no silly healing out of form = no mana issues. Imp GotW, Moonkin aura, is my utility. Only getting out of chocobo form for critical BR or Tranquil.
    Ya for mc it's all fine cause fights are short. I'm more referring to why they are "discriminated" against in later raids

  5. #45
    The hybrid spec situation was 'fixed' in TBC. But that's not Classic. People wanted Classi, not TBC. So, yes, it would hurt - because it's not what the people wanted.
    The people who want fixed hybrid specs will have to wait until we get TBC (if) or until Blizzard decides to put out some Classic+ stuff (if).

  6. #46
    it would be nice, Spec and class balancing overall for Classic would be sweet. But you can't have any quality of life changes in Classic, due to the incoming deafness from the screeching #nochange crowd.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    it would be nice, Spec and class balancing overall for Classic would be sweet. But you can't have any quality of life changes in Classic, due to the incoming deafness from the screeching #nochange crowd.
    Ya we should add dual spec too cause I hate being locked to only 1 spec. Flight paths should be faster. Actually let's just give out flying mounts. Every class should do within 1% dmg of eachother in all situations because raids are the only thing that matters. Give druids a rez. Get rid of reagents. Get rid of hunter deadzone and the need for arrows.

    The problem with #Somechanges is that everyone has different ideas on what would be acceptable. #Somechanges is actually just #Mychanges. At least with #Nochanges people know what they're gonna get.

    The moment you start with classic+, ppl are going to have to ask for classic all over again because after ~15 years of finally getting it back, it was changed again and no longer available.

  8. #48
    You think you do, but you don’t.

  9. #49
    It would be great and is something I've been a proponent for since classic was announced. However, the #nochanges crowd will of course REEEEEEE and throw fits because hybrid classes becoming viable threatens their FOTM class choices.

  10. #50
    Only thing the game actually needs is a dungeon group finder. The content is easy enough to clear with any class/spec combo but the lack of group finder just leads to people cherry picking the best classes so stuff like dps hybrids never get invited.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ya for mc it's all fine cause fights are short. I'm more referring to why they are "discriminated" against in later raids
    True. But with gear scaling and T2 druid set bonus, it will hopefully be ok. As for the discrimination, I agree with you, and it is very real for druids at least (beside tanking 5 mans, as Bears are god tier there. But at the end of the day, only raid and pvp matters).

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexplode View Post
    Hello, 1st post on a wow forum since I lost posting privileges on AJ during WOTLK lol.

    Anyway,

    Wouldn't that make your classic experience better?.

    Is it going to hurt your nostalgia or gameplay?.

    Wouldn't that make raids and other content more fun?

    Thoughts?
    Nope. This is not what was intended for Classic to be at all. You all knew what was coming stop asking for changes.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alexplode View Post
    Hello, 1st post on a wow forum since I lost posting privileges on AJ during WOTLK lol.

    Anyway,

    Wouldn't that make your classic experience better?.

    Is it going to hurt your nostalgia or gameplay?.

    Wouldn't that make raids and other content more fun?

    Thoughts?
    It was fixed. That fix was called BC.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Gratlim View Post
    True. But with gear scaling and T2 druid set bonus, it will hopefully be ok. As for the discrimination, I agree with you, and it is very real for druids at least (beside tanking 5 mans, as Bears are god tier there. But at the end of the day, only raid and pvp matters).
    I'm not sure. I'm assuming you talking abt the 3set? With that, and the talent, you are looking at 30% mana regen while casting. You have to wear 3 pieces of the gear which has +healing and not +dmg heal so you are giving up abt 100+ dmg right there. Those 3 pieces have abt 45 spirit on it. I'd figure out the gear your aiming for and add up the spirit on that, and figure out just just how much mana regen you are actually looking at. Also I'm sure you know but just in case you dont, be sure to equip a spirit staff when you innervate.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gasparde View Post
    The hybrid spec situation was 'fixed' in TBC. But that's not Classic. People wanted Classi, not TBC. So, yes, it would hurt - because it's not what the people wanted.
    The people who want fixed hybrid specs will have to wait until we get TBC (if) or until Blizzard decides to put out some Classic+ stuff (if).
    Sadly this is the case. I really do hope that TBC does get a "Classic 2.0" experience too. I miss my boomkin so very much...
    "Why of course the people don't want war…. But, after all… it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexplode View Post
    Hello, 1st post on a wow forum since I lost posting privileges on AJ during WOTLK lol.

    Anyway,

    Wouldn't that make your classic experience better?.

    Is it going to hurt your nostalgia or gameplay?.

    Wouldn't that make raids and other content more fun?

    Thoughts?
    They actually put out a version of classic where they fixed many of those class balance issues, they called it Battle For Azeroth.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    It wouldn't be THAT hard to fix. It would definitely need to be part of a "Classic +" thing though. I wouldn't suggest you should do this for Classic Classic. But it wouldn't be too difficult to provide ways to make mana less of a burden for DPS specs and not be something that all healers would just go for. Make it less passive than the TBC Boomkin approach and more related to the act of doing dmg.

    My initial very early rough draft for Boomkins for Classic+ for example would give them mana regeneration from melee atks (which is actually something that was baked into TBC Boomkin form by the way), a way to shapeshift into cat or bear form without using mana (my initial idea was that Wrath would give a stacking buff until you could eventually pop cat form for free), and that would essentially function as your mana regen. Cat forms speedy attacks would be the best way to regen mana, but you also can't just pop in and out of cat form for healing either. There would be a delay in how quickly you can pop back into cat form so you can just regen some mana, throw up heals, and then pop back into cat form as a form of sustainable OP-ness.
    Can you imagine how OP boomkins would be in PvP if this happened. They'd be better than DKs on release.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Caperfin View Post
    An IMPORTANT distinction.

    Hybrid specs have mana issues but don't go out of mana, if you put in the effort to solve it.
    Yeah you can solve the Mana issues or you can solve the damage issues. You'll always be worse than your proper counterparts though.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Ifeanychukwu View Post
    It would be great and is something I've been a proponent for since classic was announced. However, the #nochanges crowd will of course REEEEEEE and throw fits because hybrid classes becoming viable threatens their FOTM class choices.
    I dunno, I Shaman Tank better than most warriors I have seen, old Meta doesn't mean shit because most of the data was pulled for poorly tuned pservers. when Vanilla was retail 95%+ of the wow players had no idea how to properly itemize anything.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ya we should add dual spec too cause I hate being locked to only 1 spec. Flight paths should be faster. Actually let's just give out flying mounts. Every class should do within 1% dmg of eachother in all situations because raids are the only thing that matters. Give druids a rez. Get rid of reagents. Get rid of hunter deadzone and the need for arrows.

    The problem with #Somechanges is that everyone has different ideas on what would be acceptable. #Somechanges is actually just #Mychanges. At least with #Nochanges people know what they're gonna get.

    The moment you start with classic+, ppl are going to have to ask for classic all over again because after ~15 years of finally getting it back, it was changed again and no longer available.
    This is why things should be voted on who have level 60's already. They should do a survey and they can find out what people would be ok with after Naxx has been played out.
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  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Unholyground View Post
    I dunno, I Shaman Tank better than most warriors I have seen, old Meta doesn't mean shit because most of the data was pulled for poorly tuned pservers. when Vanilla was retail 95%+ of the wow players had no idea how to properly itemize anything.

    - - - Updated - - -



    This is why things should be voted on who have level 60's already. They should do a survey and they can find out what people would be ok with after Naxx has been played out.
    So they make the threshold 75%. The vote passes. Now 25% of players dont agree with the change and just want to play the game they've been asking for for 15 years. Then the next vote comes and it passes. 25% of those no longer like the change and just want to play the game they originally played. Repeat until over half the current playerbase quits and / or just wants to play the "museum" they were promised.

    Only way classic+ is gonna happen is if classic servers get left alone and they open classic+ servers. Which I honestly dont see happening because theyd want to avoid splitting the playerbase further.
    Last edited by ellieg; 2019-10-18 at 03:21 PM.

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