Mythic+ Help?

[Squigglyo]

How are warlocks in mythic+?

I get a lot of pushback from groups not wanting warlocks, especially affliction.

Last Season I got +10 in all dungeons and have 2 left this season but getting groups is getting hard.


I read some guides saying Affliction is great for bosses, less so on trash, but ok enough.
I read other guides saying Affliction isnt good enough for higher keys (but what is a 'higher' key).
The other specs seem to produce similair numbers, so is it really worth swapping to another?

Im 435 with a 1k IO atm.

What is good enough dps? I only want to get to +15
On bosses I will pull about 30k.
On bigger trash pulls I have 50k+
On small trash pulls, most times my dots dont make a dent cause theres no ramp up.



Last night I finished a +13 Waycrest Manor. Leader kicked me just after the final pull and I get ported out. He was hoping I wouldnt get credit as I was the lowest DPS. Avg 30k and 40k on the bosses, so I dont know what to make of that.

What numbers should I be aiming for?

[Th3Scourge]

Play demo

Afflic is possibly the worst spec in the game for M+. It doesn't have the toolkit to be efficient in keys. Being great on bosses doesn't count for much (even on high tyrannical keys) when it can't contribute much to the overall speed of the key beyond that.

[Killsy]

You are a victim of the current meta. Any class, any spec is more than capable of doing 10s and 15s. Warlocks are "fine". All 3 specs are usable; affliction is arguably the least desirable apples to apples due to the very poor aoe and necessary ramp up, though you can offset that a fair amount with Focusing Iris major essence. Demo is generally considered the go-to for M+ because it has good on demand AoE via implosion and respectable single target damage, with a short-cooldown Tyrant for more flexibility than Darkglare or Infernal. The downside is a lack of an interrupt without gimping your DPS, which your group will have to agree to work around.

I pushed to 2k this season for the first time this xpac after waltzing through 21s/22s in Legion. I did that my building a friends list and now I get groups based off the rating I earned (sometimes) simply because it's rare to see a warlock at that level. It was not easy to push that high not being a resto druid, prot warrior, outlaw rogue, etc. and I'm sure I've pretty much hit the cap of what I can do without a full premade. It isn't that warlocks are poor so much as they just aren't as good as most other classes for what's desired in M+. They don't have the interrupts melee classes do, limited uses of gateway or soulstone that couldn't be covered by shroud or invis pots, and their aoe is at best only just as good as a BM hunter, UH DK, Fury warrior, Outlaw rogue, etc. and likely worse. Interrupt requirements alone in higher keys is a reason to stack melee vs. ranged . . . you never want more than 1 ranged and you'd get same or better damage and more utility from a hunter or ele shaman, so if given the choice pugs will choose the "stronger" class just as often as they'll take the guy with 2k io over the guy with 1.5k io even though that's not a guarantee of relative skill or experience.

Stick with the class if you enjoy it and prove yourself to some regular key runners and hope they "bring the player not the class", or make one of the flavor of the month classes.

Good luck to you.

[JustaWarlock]

It isn't that warlocks are poor so much as they just aren't as good as most other classes

Lol.

I don't even... If that's not the definition of poor I don't know what is!

[asil]

Play demo

Afflic is possibly the worst spec in the game for M+. It doesn't have the toolkit to be efficient in keys. Being great on bosses doesn't count for much (even on high tyrannical keys) when it can't contribute much to the overall speed of the key beyond that.

For the record, aff is completely viable in 10s and 11s and 12s and 13s and 14s and probably even higher. I don't pug that much, but I did pug once like a month ago and played aff after convincing some noobs to take me and completely stomped them on overall damage. I did like 46k overall or something, which isn't amazing in a real group, but in small/slow pulling pugs is completely fine.

The reality is aff is fine for lower end keys, it's just trash in higher level keys but the player base tends to be stupid and not understand how much of a joke lower keys are, so they think only meta classes can do them.

The whole thing becomes more hilarious when you realize these people refusing to take off meta specs to +10s are doing like 25k overall dps playing havoc/outlaw.

To put it into perspective how easy low keys are, when we did alt keys last weekend and didn't have a healer. I went holy with no traits and 415 ilevel and we were 2 chesting 12s and 13s. Our DPS comp consisted of a 420 aff warlock, a 410 ilevel spriest, and a god damn BM hunter.

The point is, pugging in this game is awful and people have no idea what they're talking about or doing. Do you want m+ help OP? Join a decent guild.

[Hayduke]

I am 1798 raider IO score and struggle to get invites past 12-14. It sucks because the only improvements I can make to my score are in the 17-18 range but I can try all day and not get invites. Most of my 15-17 keys have been done with friends cause pugs will not give locks the time of day

[agentsi]

Play demo

Afflic is possibly the worst spec in the game for M+. It doesn't have the toolkit to be efficient in keys. Being great on bosses doesn't count for much (even on high tyrannical keys) when it can't contribute much to the overall speed of the key beyond that.

This is 100% accurate.

Unless you have a group that is okay with trading your high ST, for low AoE, then you will have to play Demo.

I ran most keys upwards of 15, but it was a guild group, and ST aff burst is still pretty good. So they knew I would do mechanics, etc and it was a decent trade off as the other two dps went a tiny bit more AoE.

If I pugged though, I would literally be asked to swap to Demo, or leave the group. It is one of the reasons I unsubbed. M+ is my favorite aspect of the game, and it is ruined because of how we go from being #1 for M+ to being dead last. Makes zero sense, unless you're Blizzard of course.

On bosses your burst should be upwards of 60-80k, then come down to about 40-45k depending on the length of the fight.

AoE, could be all over the place depending on mob density as well as CDs available, etc. But if you consistently average 50k, while your other dps are over 100k , or more, hard to keep you around. Trash tend to take longer than bosses.

[enigma77]

M+ in Bfa is a design failure. Dungeons packed full of obnoxious trash requiring short cd interrupts and aoe stuns and mass stealth all the time.

And Blizzard doesn't change a damn thing about it. A whole expansion long.

[evertonbelmontt]

@JustaWarlock

Right? I was thinking to myself:

"WTF is this, a gaidax warlock smurf account?" Kek

@Gaidax

♡

@Killsy

We suck, plain and simple.


@OP

I have 2.2k, Afflic is the worst of them all, maybe the worst in the game for m+. If you're aiming for 15, go demon. If you're aiming at 15+, I prefer destro. We do big pulls and capitalize on destro's infernal for 18 and higher.

Destro also has purge and interrupt that may make or break some keys.

Imp's dispell too.

But expect a lot of denials into getting groups. Mages can do what we do way better and is more fast paced for chain pulls.

[JoeGood]

I am 1798 raider IO score and struggle to get invites past 12-14. It sucks because the only improvements I can make to my score are in the 17-18 range but I can try all day and not get invites. Most of my 15-17 keys have been done with friends cause pugs will not give locks the time of day

I get your problem but.. go make the group of your own?

[slickwilly]

For the record, aff is completely viable in 10s and 11s and 12s and 13s and 14s and probably even higher. I don't pug that much, but I did pug once like a month ago and played aff after convincing some noobs to take me and completely stomped them on overall damage. I did like 46k overall or something, which isn't amazing in a real group, but in small/slow pulling pugs is completely fine.

The reality is aff is fine for lower end keys, it's just trash in higher level keys but the player base tends to be stupid and not understand how much of a joke lower keys are, so they think only meta classes can do them.

The whole thing becomes more hilarious when you realize these people refusing to take off meta specs to +10s are doing like 25k overall dps playing havoc/outlaw.

To put it into perspective how easy low keys are, when we did alt keys last weekend and didn't have a healer. I went holy with no traits and 415 ilevel and we were 2 chesting 12s and 13s. Our DPS comp consisted of a 420 aff warlock, a 410 ilevel spriest, and a god damn BM hunter.

The point is, pugging in this game is awful and people have no idea what they're talking about or doing. Do you want m+ help OP? Join a decent guild.

Show the raider.io link

[Kaver]

I am 1798 raider IO score and struggle to get invites past 12-14. It sucks because the only improvements I can make to my score are in the 17-18 range but I can try all day and not get invites. Most of my 15-17 keys have been done with friends cause pugs will not give locks the time of day

I never try to build my rio scores with other people’s keys because I don’t want to depend on others like that. I want to be my own boss. I only join other people’s groups if I need an item from a certain dungeons or if I just need a dungeon for the weekly chest. However, when building my rio score I ALWAYS use my own key because I can then much better control what happens in the setup and I don’t have to rely on “mercyful invites” from other people.

[Hayduke]

I get your problem but.. go make the group of your own?

Obviously I run with friends as much as possible but the group is not always available

[valky94]

How are warlocks in mythic+?

warlocks are good, demo is great but is lacking an interrupt, destro is decent with traits

I get a lot of pushback from groups not wanting warlocks, especially affliction.

cuz aff suck donkey balls in m+ because their aoe is hot garbage

- - - Updated - - -

For the record, aff is completely viable in 10s and 11s and 12s and 13s and 14s and probably even higher. I don't pug that much, but I did pug once like a month ago and played aff after convincing some noobs to take me and completely stomped them on overall damage.

wouldnt call them viable but i guess that its a subjective opinion, if you managed to have 46k overall then that group must have been hella trash if aff was stomping and shit wasnt dying fast enough

[Squigglyo]

Ok so update on this.

I fixed up my traits and talents and essences. Usually would not be last on dps and on big trash pulls sometimes even first.

Have now completed all +10 and did a +17. I'll leave it at that. Getting all +15 isnt really possible with all the hate warlocks get.

The bottom line is, Warlocks, and Affliction seem to be fine if properly done, infact the higher the key the more dps i would do due to the ramp up needed.

[Kaver]

Ok so update on this.

I fixed up my traits and talents and essences. Usually would not be last on dps and on big trash pulls sometimes even first.

Have now completed all +10 and did a +17. I'll leave it at that. Getting all +15 isnt really possible with all the hate warlocks get.

The bottom line is, Warlocks, and Affliction seem to be fine if properly done, infact the higher the key the more dps i would do due to the ramp up needed.

Now, stop that crying my friend. Of course a Warlock can complete all keys on +15. Just don’t expect to be invited to +15 keys if your rio score is much below 1600 and that goes for all classes.

However, this is where using your own key becomes handy. Once you get a high key in hand you will see that making groups is extremely easy. People love those keys and they are in high demand so you will very quickly have a lot of highly experienced players applying to your group. Like flies on shit. And guess what.. none of those people are going to give you shit for being a Warlock because it is YOUR key and YOUR group. And if they do, you can just kick them. You’re the boss mate.

Tl;dr - Be the BOSS instead of crying about other people.

[Squigglyo]

Now, stop that crying my friend. Of course a Warlock can complete all keys on +15. Just don’t expect to be invited to +15 keys if your rio score is much below 1600 and that goes for all classes.

However, this is where using your own key becomes handy. Once you get a high key in hand you will see that making groups is extremely easy. People love those keys and they are in high demand so you will very quickly have a lot of highly experienced players applying to your group. Like flies on shit. And guess what.. none of those people are going to give you shit for being a Warlock because it is YOUR key and YOUR group. And if they do, you can just kick them. You’re the boss mate.

Tl;dr - Be the BOSS instead of crying about other people.

Thanks.

Have a higher io score to get into higher groups?
Use my own keys to run what I want?
Get more gear to do more damage?



Mind
Blown

[Kaver]

Thanks.

Have a higher io score to get into higher groups?
Use my own keys to run what I want?
Get more gear to do more damage?



Mind
Blown

It seems simple, but for some reason I still see a lot of people crying and complaining about it. If people want to stay miserable then be my guest. If you don’t have the io score you’re not going to get the invite. Being a Warlock has nothing to do with it and crying wont help.

[Squigglyo]

It seems simple, but for some reason I still see a lot of people crying and complaining about it. If people want to stay miserable then be my guest. If you don’t have the io score you’re not going to get the invite. Being a Warlock has nothing to do with it and crying wont help.

Who the hell is crying?

I got what I needed. I asked for advice, got better and got to where I wanted to go.

I dont see any other class being overlooked as much as warlocks or any other class being kicked the second another class pops up.
There are genuine issues if the community doesnt want x class to be somewhere all classes should be ok enough in. The perception is that Warlocks are bottom of the barrel to pick from.

Talking about an issue, asking questions, seeking advice... none of those things are 'crying and complaining'.

And ignoring the issues or pretending they are just in the heads of everyone else complaining doesnt help at all.


But no, its ok. I'll just solely rely on making my own groups, as should every single other warlock, since thats the only way we should be able to play. Clearly that doesnt imply issues. The issues arent real and every other warlock experiences them is just crazy.

[Amariw]

Who the hell is crying?

I got what I needed. I asked for advice, got better and got to where I wanted to go.

I dont see any other class being overlooked as much as warlocks or any other class being kicked the second another class pops up.
There are genuine issues if the community doesnt want x class to be somewhere all classes should be ok enough in. The perception is that Warlocks are bottom of the barrel to pick from.

Talking about an issue, asking questions, seeking advice... none of those things are 'crying and complaining'.

And ignoring the issues or pretending they are just in the heads of everyone else complaining doesnt help at all.


But no, its ok. I'll just solely rely on making my own groups, as should every single other warlock, since thats the only way we should be able to play. Clearly that doesnt imply issues. The issues arent real and every other warlock experiences them is just crazy.

You're very much in the right. I also make my own runs or join friends for 15s and higher, but i do it with demo and i admire you for doing it on Aff. It just sucks in m+, its aoe is lackluster and the design is pretty bad. Your aoe rotation is... Spam seed. No burst tool, no choices (double shard for instant seed? Another shard spender that applies agony to all targets with corruption? Interesting rotation isn't rocket science to make). no way to quickly cast dots, on the specc which needs it most (unholy dks press one button to aoe dot, i mean come on).

Sure, you can barely make it work, but its clearly bad, it needs an aoe design and tuning pass. The sooner the better, and its not "crying" to note this.