Less High PVE/PVP on Alliance: Who Cares?

[Pheraz]

The taurens are inspired by minotaurs. And that's ORgrimMar! I also want to remind you we have the prettiest elves with blood elves and now Nightborne (which didn't seem to choose the Alliance, despite being helped by it just as much... go figure...)

The taurens are ugly cows. Please realize it. You are playing indian cows. It's incredibly pathetic.
I really prefer the female kaldorei model over the thalassian model they look less like teenagers and more like women.
The nightborne are ugly nightelves, especially the running animation

Your cities are horrible. Please... there is actually nothing to argue about this. Orrrrrgriderpimor is a big campsite.

[Testodruid]

"B-but its called Warcraft.."

Yeah there are plenty of wars to be fought more than just against the other faction that you've been co-operating with and saving the world.

Also alliance, lul.

[bowlink]

Atleast we are getting a faction neutral expansion so alliance players will atleast get good lore this time. And if we hemorage even more players. +30% levels alot faster than +20% that we had alliance for the last few months. So theres that

[Lord Pebbleton]

Numbers may be even but the quality of players change.
Horde has been heavily favored with racials in competitive environment for years and now people that want to be competitive are horde. That's it. The situation wasn't addressed for a decade and now nothing can change it unless alliance gets an unfair edge like blatantly OP racials.

Alliance cannot progress because those that choose it don't really care about being cutting edge, and it shows. Just makes for a bad experience when you cannot trust a person to run away from the raid when the "GET OUT OF RAID YOU ARE THE BOMB" prompt comes up.

[Alvito]

Exactly, high end content is just one part of the game, RP is the other part. So technically it balance itself out, one is competitive faction, one is roleplayer faction, Population wise, both faction are equal with slight advantage for Alliance.

Not even close, trying to claim factions are balanced based on RP has to be the stupidest trollish argument I have ever seen somebody make on here.

[Wyrt]

Did you ever stop to think that maybe Alliance players don't want to be Horde and that's why they haven't gone Horde yet?

[Aphrel]

I keep seeing people scream about "wahhh Alliance dead" when the numbers show that both sides are pretty equal: it's just that less people on Alliance give a shit about serious PVP or Heroic/Mythic raiding.

This brings up a few points:
1) Why is a faction "dead" if it doesn't do as much higher content/is filled with more casual players?
2) What is stopping these people from going to Horde if they are obsessed with a bigger raiding/pve community?
3) Why can't people move on from the fact that casual play is the only reason this franchise still exists today?

1. Because the hardcore alliance players started transfering to horde during the time when racials gave considerable bonuses in pve raiding. This happend for a long enough time that the alliance hardcore audience became considerably smaller than the horde counterpart.

After the racial disparity was fixed it was already too late, the ally vs horde ratio were already so large that this alone became the main draw for hardcore allaince guilds to keep transfering to make recruitment easier. This is the snowball effect in action, the more guilds that transfer, the worse off ally side becomes wich gives an even larger incentive to transfer...

And here we are now 4 years later, that snowball has kept rolling, and the hardcore m+ and raiding scene on allyside i extremly low comapred to its horde countepart. All because blizzard started rolling that small ball all those years ago. This situation is the longterm product of their incompetence in tuning. (but oh how much money they made from it, makes me wonder if some capitalist mastermind came up with this plan).

2. Nothing, but it cost about as much as a brand new tripple A game to transfer a single toon over. Its quite a douch move by blizz to demand extra money for the alliance players to be able to play the game with the same possibilitys as their horde counterparts. But as you suggest yes, in the end even more will transfer, and the disparity will keep growing.

3. What is this bait. Doesnt look tasty.

[Doffen]

Best arguments for cross-faction play is more options, not being limited to gameplay barriers, and player agency. I've seen so many interviews at, and after blizzcon, and every wow-dev brings up the player agency. But the biggest part of player agency they ignore. What if I am RP-ing as cow that is related to Baine, so I want to join the humans of Stormwind and live there... :P

2+2=3 is what I get from it all.

[monkaW]

Not even close, trying to claim factions are balanced based on RP has to be the stupidest trollish argument I have ever seen somebody make on here.

So does claiming faction are balanced around Hall of Fame, which is like 2000 toon if you dont count alt.

Stop trolling.

[Mikazukinoyaiba]

Did you ever stop to think that maybe Alliance players don't want to be Horde and that's why they haven't gone Horde yet?

Then stay there and stop complaining you boomer roleplayer.

[Seratox]

Maybe they need to upgrade the game to have different server types.

We can have servers that people can raid across faction, let's call them PVE servers.

And for people who aren't care bears, we have the traditional servers where factions fight each other. I guess we could call them PVP servers.

[bluesock]

But the most important aspect in all of this is the following:
There are REASONS why players gravitate towards the Horde. For some it is simply the desire to play the bigger faction no matter what. But for anybody else, the quality of the content/aesthetics may be a deciding factor? And Blizzard BLATANTLY prefers the Horde in those aspects. BFA was an expansion about the Horde for the Horde. There was NOTHING in this expansion for the Alliance. All of the Allied Races were superior for the Horde. The Horde got actual story tie-ins for their Dungeons/raids while 2 out 5 raids of the entire expansion made ZERO SENSE to even be played as Alliance. They are basically out-of-game content as Alliance.
The level of polish in terms of number of bugs/quality of cutscenes/dialogue even such mundane things as spellchecking are all VASTLY better on the Horde, because Blizzard puts much more effort into their content compared to the blue faction.

This comment if fucking amazing. Both factions manage to cry about the exact same thing in the exact same way about how Blizzard prefers the other's faction.

Truly incredible.

[Khaza-R]

If Blizzard cared they would just open free guild transfers to the Alliance.

But a large part of the issue is also the community. There’s an obsession a lot of players have with playing on the more popular faction and on the most popular servers. We even saw this happen in Classic. Until Blizzard finds a way to break that mentality there is never going to be a balance

[Ashgaan]

There are more Alliance than Horde: https://realmpop.com/us.html

Those players level 1 to 119 are the most hardcore progressions dudes ever, Method is nothing compared to them.

Learn to think before posting, that way you can bring something relevant to the discussion:
1. Put the lvl filter for 120 on the site you gave as example
2. Bother to look at the hall of fame, there is a reason it looks like that, and then there is a reason for the reason you initially thought.
3. Enter any server/s and see the number of M+ 15 and above listed on each faction, and also the IO scores

[Golden]

I keep seeing people scream about "wahhh Alliance dead" when the numbers show that both sides are pretty equal: it's just that less people on Alliance give a shit about serious PVP or Heroic/Mythic raiding.

This brings up a few points:
1) Why is a faction "dead" if it doesn't do as much higher content/is filled with more casual players?
2) What is stopping these people from going to Horde if they are obsessed with a bigger raiding/pve community?
3) Why can't people move on from the fact that casual play is the only reason this franchise still exists today?

Well, I plan to play horde next expansion because of the faction imbalance and how it affects me in random BGs and Warmode.

That will mean I leave behind many alts on alliance that probably won't see any content beyond LFR. Have you considered the possibility that the reason why alliance has become so casual is because many people started out on alliance but have switched their mains to horde?

If this is a common occurrence, that means alliance has become a faction of alts/casuals the horde farms in PvP.

[Aresk]

There are more Alliance than Horde: https://realmpop.com/us.html

53% Horde vs 47% Alliance at level 120. Not that drastic of an imbalance, but considering this thread is talking about endgame, it's notable.

[Djuntas]

Yes, the epitome of playing. Playing?

Means to an end + Im much more efficent than others. I make a million gold a month or so...So why not. PS if you have 30k achive points or more, you want to ease the pain.

[Shiza]

Exactly, high end content is just one part of the game, RP is the other part. So technically it balance itself out, one is competitive faction, one is roleplayer faction, Population wise, both faction are equal with slight advantage for Alliance.

Only that the Alliance also gets shit on in this regard. We won't get the most demanded Alliance Allied Race, the second most popular Alliance race is the constant punching bag of the story and basically all roleplayers I know (speaking from a german perspective here) hate the current Alliance Story and seriously hate Anduin.

[Nagawithlegs]

Only that the Alliance also gets shit on in this regard. We won't get the most demanded Alliance Allied Race, the second most popular Alliance race is the constant punching bag of the story and basically all roleplayers I know (speaking from a german perspective here) hate the current Alliance Story and seriously hate Anduin.

The fact that the most demanded Alliance race is a Horde race since TBC is a sign that the faction has some inherently flawed players.

[Shiza]

The fact that the most demanded Alliance race is a Horde race since TBC is a sign that the faction has some inherently flawed players.

How so? The High Elves were always portrayed as members of the Alliance since Classic and they were always presented as core members with lots of screentime in many expansions. In BC they had a quest hub, in Wotlk they were really major and the alliance representatives in Dalaran, the Argent Tournament and the Quel'delar Questline, they were a bit present in Cataclysm, had a major presence in Legion at the Hunter Class Hall. Blizzard basically put them in front and center over and over again and High Elves have overall more screentime than almost any alliance race outside of humans. So how is it inheritly flawed that players demand a race which was always a core player of the alliance and received more screentime and lore than most playable alliance races?

Especially since the Horde basically got to leech off the entire magical empire heritage of the night elves through Nightborn, so it would have been the balanced decission to give the Alliance High Elves, if there wasn't the Horde bias.