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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    I love it when someone that rips the idiocracy of the left must be a Trumpkin or a "woke" independent. Your hive mind is adorable.
    Oh so you vote for the democratic party? You excluded the other two options.

  2. #62
    The Insane Masark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Oh so you vote for the democratic party? You excluded the other two options.
    Of course not. He votes for the American Freedom Party.

    Warning : Above post may contain snark and/or sarcasm. Try reparsing with the /s argument before replying.
    What the world has learned is that America is never more than one election away from losing its goddamned mind
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  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Oh so you vote for the democratic party? You excluded the other two options.
    The Green party?

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    It's very, very, very far from just "the left" that is aligned against Trump. It's the majority of independents and self-described centrists, and a healthy number of legitimate conservatives (not fauxservatives who are just anti-liberal reactionaries like yourself).

    Let me ask you Shanknasty... what is your exit strategy? How do you think this ends? Trump could go down in impeachment. He could go down in 2020's election. He could last until the end of his second term. It's largely irrelevant. Why?

    Because this never ends. They just got Roger Stone. They are going for Guliani. Trump himself is an unindicted co-conspirator who will almost certainly be charged the moment he is out of office. There are many others with investigations pending.

    So how does this end well for you? Because Democrat will be elected in 2020... or 20204. Or maybe 2028. Again, it doesn't matter. A Democrat will be elected, and at the top of their pile for the Department of Justice will be to bring criminal cases against wrongdoing committed by figures you like.

    So where is your happy ending? Because 3 years later, it's hard to see your entire approach as anything other than an abject failure. Trump's been entirely ineffective as a President. Democrats are in a stronger position than they've been in 10 years, a Republican President is about to be impeached, and there is severe legal peril in the future for everyone involved.

    Our side, far from being dejected, is as motivated and optimistic as ever. It's legitimately confusing what you're looking to accomplish anymore.
    You speak as if I am a Trump supporter.....LOL.

    You are all so blinded with rage over 2016 it's pathetic.

    Do you honestly think anything is going to change in Washington regardless of who is sitting in the white house?

    Congress, my friends, Congress.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Oh so you vote for the democratic party? You excluded the other two options.
    So you think there are only 2 other options?

    That explains a lot.
    Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Just because the Blue Wave was forecast, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

    Yeah folks, he said it....

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    ]



    So you think there are only 2 other options?

    That explains a lot.
    So you're just wasting your vote on independents? Who did you vote for in 2016?
    Last edited by Crispin; 2019-11-18 at 08:35 AM.

  6. #66
    Legendary! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    So you're just wasting your vote on independents? Who did you vote for in 2016?
    Shhhhh!

    Don't tell him that voting for a 3rd party in USA ultimately only hurts your own interests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ransath View Post
    Money laundering, especially prior to his election? I couldn't give a flying fuck.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Benggaul View Post
    What are you talking about? He's already gone to trial. He was found guilty on all 7 counts. All that's left is sentencing.
    Ah, my mistake, i missread. Still, he is 'free' until Feb. 6 and can somebody tell me if he can file for appeal?
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    Shhhhh!

    Don't tell him that voting for a 3rd party in USA ultimately only hurts your own interests.
    Shhhhh! Your ignorance is showing!

    https://freepress.org/article/wasted-vote-myth
    Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Just because the Blue Wave was forecast, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

    Yeah folks, he said it....

  9. #69
    The Unstoppable Force Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    somebody tell me if he can file for appeal?
    Of course, but like any appeal, there have to be some grounds. It's not an instant "I Win" button. And even then, the overturn rate is, um, not stellar. A few quick sites I visited suggested far more appeals were simply tossed (confirming the original verdict) than both taken and also overturned.

    No-one is above the law.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Of course, but like any appeal, there have to be some grounds. It's not an instant "I Win" button. And even then, the overturn rate is, um, not stellar. A few quick sites I visited suggested far more appeals were simply tossed (confirming the original verdict) than both taken and also overturned.
    It's less about him getting off but dragging things out until something happens.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  11. #71
    The Unstoppable Force Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    It's less about him getting off but dragging things out until something happens.
    Maybe. I don't see how that's realistic, though. I'm willing to bet most judges will think poorly of threatening public posts.

    Trump could pre-pardon him I suppose, but that would require Stone drag this out until Trump is fleeing office.

    No-one is above the law.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    Shhhhh! Your ignorance is showing!

    https://freepress.org/article/wasted-vote-myth
    In a FPTP system, any vote that wasn't for the winning candidate is de facto wasted.

    This includes 3rd party votes. The philosophical ramblings of that article are interesting, but ultimately just saying "This is how it ought to be" rather than "this is how it is".
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    Damnit hubcap, you are such a retard.
    Quote Originally Posted by mojusk View Post
    Oh, and stop being a "didn't do that in vanilla"-police. If we're doing something now that we didnt do back then, it's not because we had some sorta unwritten moral code back then, it's because we hadn't thought of it yet.

  13. #73
    Legendary! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    Shhhhh! Your ignorance is showing!

    https://freepress.org/article/wasted-vote-myth
    Because that's totally how it works. As AeneasBK said, that would be ideal, but it's far from what actually happens. Your link is a wish-list. Geee, thanks for the enlightenment.

    You have a 2-party system, which is inevitable in FPTP. Voting for 3rd party is taking the vote away from the party that you most agree with. Where do you think the votes come from, when a hypothetical 3rd party is more aligned with Republicans than Democrats? That's what I mean by "hurting your own interests".

    And when people realize their 3rd party can't make a fucking dent, they vote strategically, because Spoiler Effect.

    And please, don't talk about ignorance. I've seen your posts (including this one). Good God.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ransath View Post
    Money laundering, especially prior to his election? I couldn't give a flying fuck.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    Because that's totally how it works. As AeneasBK said, that would be ideal, but it's far from what actually happens. Your link is a wish-list. Geee, thanks for the enlightenment.

    You have a 2-party system, which is inevitable in FPTP. Voting for 3rd party is taking the vote away from the party that you most agree with. Where do you think the votes come from, when a hypothetical 3rd party is more aligned with Republicans than Democrats? That's what I mean by "hurting your own interests".

    And when people realize their 3rd party can't make a fucking dent, they vote strategically, because Spoiler Effect.

    And please, don't talk about ignorance. I've seen your posts (including this one). Good God.
    Voting for the "lesser of two evils" is still voting for evil, as the article points out. Why vote for someone you don't believe will better your situation, or that of the country itself?

    The two-party system is a joke, and if you think that just voting for A or B is the only option, then you are delusional.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    In a FPTP system, any vote that wasn't for the winning candidate is de facto wasted.

    This includes 3rd party votes. The philosophical ramblings of that article are interesting, but ultimately just saying "This is how it ought to be" rather than "this is how it is".
    Fair assessment. But ultimately there comes a time where option A and option B are total trash and you can't genuinely vote for either candidate. Look at 2016 as the prime example. I also voted for a 3rd party option in 2008, as this was another example of a dumpster fire and a pile of manure as your choices.
    Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Just because the Blue Wave was forecast, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

    Yeah folks, he said it....

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    Fair assessment. But ultimately there comes a time where option A and option B are total trash and you can't genuinely vote for either candidate. Look at 2016 as the prime example. I also voted for a 3rd party option in 2008, as this was another example of a dumpster fire and a pile of manure as your choices.
    I'm British, and with a general election in a few weeks, and not one, not two, not three but at least 4 steaming piles of shit to vote for as the most probably 'winners' (There are no winners in British politics right now) it's something I've been lamenting about the FPTP system. But as of 2010, the enlightened public expressed that they are mostly satisfied with it so I guess we've made our bed. Even if we've shat all over it.
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    Damnit hubcap, you are such a retard.
    Quote Originally Posted by mojusk View Post
    Oh, and stop being a "didn't do that in vanilla"-police. If we're doing something now that we didnt do back then, it's not because we had some sorta unwritten moral code back then, it's because we hadn't thought of it yet.

  16. #76
    Legendary! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    Voting for the "lesser of two evils" is still voting for evil, as the article points out. Why vote for someone you don't believe will better your situation, or that of the country itself?

    The two-party system is a joke, and if you think that just voting for A or B is the only option, then you are delusional.
    Again, going for the wish-list. Not how things work, buddy, no matter how much you wish it did. I already covered that. And please, if people gave a rat's ass about evil, people would not have voted for Trump. Even if you lob Hillary into the evil camp, which I find rather ludicrous, then how come 3rd party got fucking nowhere? Because that's not how this works.

    I also didn't say that 3rd party isn't an option. Pay attention now. I said it's hurting your own interests. Sure, go ahead, vote for whatever. I don't care.

    Anyway, this is terribly off-topic, and I'm going to drop it now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ransath View Post
    Money laundering, especially prior to his election? I couldn't give a flying fuck.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    Again, going for the wish-list. Not how things work, buddy, no matter how much you wish it did. I already covered that. And please, if people gave a rat's ass about evil, people would not have voted for Trump. Even if you lob Hillary into the evil camp, which I find rather ludicrous, then how come 3rd party got fucking nowhere? Because that's not how this works.

    I also didn't say that 3rd party isn't an option. Pay attention now. I said it's hurting your own interests. Sure, go ahead, vote for whatever. I don't care.

    Anyway, this is terribly off-topic, and I'm going to drop it now.
    How is it hurting your best interest to not vote for some someone you feel does not have your best interest at heart? Your logic is not quite sound.

    Sadly it's people like you who disillusion others with this type of bullshit. But please, go on with your "it is what it is" shtick.
    Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Just because the Blue Wave was forecast, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

    Yeah folks, he said it....

  18. #78
    Please wait Temp name's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanknasty View Post
    How is it hurting your best interest to not vote for some someone you feel does not have your best interest at heart? Your logic is not quite sound.

    Sadly it's people like you who disillusion others with this type of bullshit. But please, go on with your "it is what it is" shtick.
    Okay, in case you actually believe this, let me explain very quickly:

    Let's say we have 2 major parties:
    Party A, and Party B
    They are both bad, but they are the only parties you can vote for, even if no one really likes them.
    Every election they swap places as winning as a few people in the middle swap sides (getting 48 and 52% of the vote, alternating).
    Along comes Party C. They're pretty close to Party B in what they would do if they won.
    Now, the next election comes, and Party C does super well, they get a whole 10% of the vote.
    But where did those votes come from? They came from Party B.
    So instead of the election results being Party A (48%) and Party B (52%), it's now Party A (48%), Party B (42%), and Party C (10%).
    Party A now won, and everyone who voted Party C caused it to happen, meaning they're now more miserable than if Party B would've won.

    In a FPTP system, you can only have 2 parties. Anything more and you're hurting yourself. If you want more than 2 parties, get another voting system. Alternative Vote is a good one.

    But this is still off topic for this thread, which is about a Trump confidant being found guilty of lying to congress

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Temp name View Post
    Okay, in case you actually believe this, let me explain very quickly:

    Let's say we have 2 major parties:
    Party A, and Party B
    They are both bad, but they are the only parties you can vote for, even if no one really likes them.
    Every election they swap places as winning as a few people in the middle swap sides (getting 48 and 52% of the vote, alternating).
    Along comes Party C. They're pretty close to Party B in what they would do if they won.
    Now, the next election comes, and Party C does super well, they get a whole 10% of the vote.
    But where did those votes come from? They came from Party B.
    So instead of the election results being Party A (48%) and Party B (52%), it's now Party A (48%), Party B (42%), and Party C (10%).
    Party A now won, and everyone who voted Party C caused it to happen, meaning they're now more miserable than if Party B would've won.

    In a FPTP system, you can only have 2 parties. Anything more and you're hurting yourself. If you want more than 2 parties, get another voting system. Alternative Vote is a good one.

    But this is still off topic for this thread, which is about a Trump confidant being found guilty of lying to congress
    I see you are as blinded as the rest.

    It's not a wasted vote if you cast it for someone you believe in, regardless of their chances. Especially if you do not plan to vote otherwise.
    Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Just because the Blue Wave was forecast, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

    Yeah folks, he said it....

  20. #80
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    Drain the swamp!
    The irony is when this is all finished and the swamp monsters are in jail, we will be able to say that Trump did indeed drain the swamp.

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