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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    So shall we remove raids being weekly? as that is the earliest timegating.
    No, imo, but PvP vendors? Reputations that lead to flying and allied races and essenses?

  2. #142
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    No, imo, but PvP vendors? Reputations that lead to flying and allied races and essenses?
    funny i got pvp gear every few matches. didnt know that was timegated.
    reps leading to flying? i got flying 4 and a half days after the patch release, dont seem very "time gated" to me.
    essences? nah not really that bad, a few weeks, just like raiding.

    you have always had to wait for pvp gear, you couoldnt just do nothign but grind for a week then buy a full set, you had limits on conquest earned back in the day.
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  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by natpick View Post
    i think he did figure it very well in fact and maybe just wanted to share/talk to other people about it,you know like you do on forums.
    Agreed. Sometimes we just want to actual unburden. And that's all there's to it.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    except its not a straw man... its literally what tons of people do, you can see streamers, top 1% players, and hardcore do this, this is not a made up thing, this is something A LOT of people do.
    Literally tons? Like who? What streamers are doing this? Asmongold?

    Because every time this strawman gets trotted out, people constantly talk about wishing they could play at their own speed and wouldn't care if they rushed through the content themselves because there are a bunch of other alt activity they can do.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    So shall we remove raids being weekly? as that is the earliest timegating.
    You go from strawmans to fallacies to flatout ignoring what anybody is saying.

    Its such a dishonest argument.

    So yeah its a lazy fucking strawman.

  5. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flower Milk View Post
    I level a character to max and it's a fun time, and when I hit max level I'm met with some world quest chores to meet my goals of unlocking flying, allied races, better gear, etc. Cool. But then I start doing those chores, and the game is like "that's all the progress/WoW you can play for today, come back tomorrow". Why doesn't Blizzard trust me to play their game more? Why do they put these weird parental control time gated progress walls everywhere? I feel like I'm playing a mobile phone game and I'm about to be asked to pay real money to bypass these time gated progress walls.

    I'm a grown adult Blizzard, I can play your game for as long as I feel like it/have the time and still attend to my IRL responsibilities, you don't need to restrict my play time like this by putting everything behind a time gate. I'm not going to stop playing your game either because I've met my goals faster than you've intended me to, that's crazy. You still have so much more for me to do once I've unlocked flying, allied races, etc like making alts, collecting mounts/pets/transmogs and so much else, you do not need to heavily time gate everything like this to try to keep me playing for longer. All it does is just burn me out on the game and make me NOT want to play the game at all anymore because I'm so sick and frustrated with all these time gates everywhere.

    Why do they do this?
    the answer is easy. they don't want players to unlock stuff too fast. Because they used time to make it, they want you to use time to play it. They don't want players to sweat-play through their content too fast.

    Anyway, there are tons of player like me, that only comes back when it is something new and stop playing after 4 days because of boredom and the good new content is done. Because of players like me, Blizzard don't trust us! =)

  6. #146
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Yeah but like... You can't can you. So it is literally time-gated. Are you resorting to hypotheticals now are you?
    That is why I said technically and not that it was possible in reality. Flying is rep gated and the rep is time gated. Not a very long one if you really set your mind to do every possible rep gain but still limited by a maximum per day. I am not resorting to anything. It is a simple fact and just something I casually mentioned and didn't base any type of argument around. Don't be so touchy.
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  7. #147
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sconners88 View Post
    Keep your hypothetical Blizzard defending fantasies to yourself and stay grounded in the real world. The thread is about artificial time gating, which exists and is a fact.
    Please point out where I have said that it doesn't exist?
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  8. #148
    cause there are millions of other "you" out there and they all like different stuff. Sorry but the world doesn't revolve around you. I enjoy time gating and other people do as well.

  9. #149
    Cause I like to no life and play this game almost every day if there was no time gate I would not have much to look foward to after about a week of a new patch / expansion

    just cause I'm not a super sweaty nerd and post all the time on forums my opinion or wants are invalid. I pity the way you view others.

  10. #150
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    I completely agree with you, OP. I've always hated these time gates that limit how much you can progress with the game. I should be able to consume as much of the content as I want, grind as much as I want. It's obvious the only reason why they do this is to keep people subscribed. It's not to make the game more fun or anything that's for sure. It's a ploy to help Blizzard keep subscribers which means more money for them. It's kind of like keeping a Twinkie in front of you while you run on a treadmill.

    How they handle rep grinds is one of the most infuriating things about WoW these days. First off they reward you with the absolute minimum amount of rep and then on top of that they only give you a small handful to do a day. THEN on top of THAT they don't even offer you any other way to continue grinding rep beyond the daily WQs. Those WQs are the ONLY way of gaining rep. What happened to wearing tabards and running dungeons to grind rep or handing in certain items in return for rep? We used to have so many different options to grind for rep and now it's just WQs everyday.

    Blizzard thinks that by limiting the amount of content you do a day will keep people interested but in reality, at least for me, it just makes the game feel more like a chore than a fun game. Also, it's lazy game design in my opinion. They make some shallow ass content and then stretch it out by putting a timer on it and call it quality content. I think it's also one of the biggest reasons why people have so many alts these days. There's nothing to do after you do all the WQs so the only other thing to do really is either raid or make a new alt or level an existing one.
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  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubenwolf View Post
    I completely agree with you, OP. I've always hated these time gates that limit how much you can progress with the game. I should be able to consume as much of the content as I want, grind as much as I want. It's obvious the only reason why they do this is to keep people subscribed. It's not to make the game more fun or anything that's for sure. It's a ploy to help Blizzard keep subscribers which means more money for them. It's kind of like keeping a Twinkie in front of you while you run on a treadmill.

    How they handle rep grinds is one of the most infuriating things about WoW these days. First off they reward you with the absolute minimum amount of rep and then on top of that they only give you a small handful to do a day. THEN on top of THAT they don't even offer you any other way to continue grinding rep beyond the daily WQs. Those WQs are the ONLY way of gaining rep. What happened to wearing tabards and running dungeons to grind rep or handing in certain items in return for rep? We used to have so many different options to grind for rep and now it's just WQs everyday.

    Blizzard thinks that by limiting the amount of content you do a day will keep people interested but in reality, at least for me, it just makes the game feel more like a chore than a fun game. Also, it's lazy game design in my opinion. They make some shallow ass content and then stretch it out by putting a timer on it and call it quality content. I think it's also one of the biggest reasons why people have so many alts these days. There's nothing to do after you do all the WQs so the only other thing to do really is either raid or make a new alt or level an existing one.
    While this has already been pointed out, I will do it for you.

    They do this to keep you subbed. They lose business if you grind out everything you want, get bored, and unsubscribe. This mind set is what led us to this point in WoW. People didn't want to spend LONG hours grinding rep, gear, honor, etc. So they made everything a little easier and more casual. Now things are too casual and people want to grind again.

    This is a game that can't win. Change one thing and you piss off half the users. Change it back. And you piss off the other half.

  12. #152
    They used to let you grind everything you wanted as fast as you wanted it, you could farm mobs for 5 rep a kill and hit exalted within a week, but then by the end of the month everyone complained that there was nothing to do because they grinded 10 hours a day and finished all the content.

    Now Blizzard time gates things so you can't do that and everyone complains that they aren't allowed to grind 10 hours a day and finish the game in a week.

    There's no way Blizz wins here, either they just let everyone grind everything and then bitch about a content drought for 6+ months at a time, or they time gate things and have people bitch that they can't grind everything.

  13. #153
    It's time gated purely to get more sub duration out of their very thin amount of content. Doing the same world quests for 2 years has to be a joke, and to those who think this is fine, you are the reason why this game is decaying.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Rucati View Post
    They used to let you grind everything you wanted as fast as you wanted it, you could farm mobs for 5 rep a kill and hit exalted within a week, but then by the end of the month everyone complained that there was nothing to do because they grinded 10 hours a day and finished all the content.
    There is nothing wrong with this, why is having a finish point so bad to you guys? Why is it alright to have the same amount of content as before but now it's coming in episodes like it's a fucking TV show? Blizz can win, go back to what actually used to work. Rep from dungeons/rep from tabards/rep from mobs.

  14. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potatowizard View Post
    While this has already been pointed out, I will do it for you.

    They do this to keep you subbed. They lose business if you grind out everything you want, get bored, and unsubscribe. This mind set is what led us to this point in WoW. People didn't want to spend LONG hours grinding rep, gear, honor, etc. So they made everything a little easier and more casual. Now things are too casual and people want to grind again.

    This is a game that can't win. Change one thing and you piss off half the users. Change it back. And you piss off the other half.
    Yeah...that's what I just said in my comment. You don't need you to lecture and patronize me about it. What I don't understand though is why some people here are defending this instead of wanting something better, more options. It's lazy game design and the worst part about it is that its purpose is to make Blizzard more money not to make the game more fun. Why are people who claim to love this game ok with this and willing to defend it?

    Also I'll have you know I was not one of those people who complained about spending long hours grinding content. This game and all other MMOs will always have grind content, it's what keeps the game alive, so the grind isn't the problem it's how it's handled. Things are not as black and white as you may think. It's not about being too casual either it's about limiting the amount of content I can consume in one day as if they are like my parents giving me a curfew. If I want to grind rep all day I should be able to do that. If they want WQs to be the primary way of gaining rep thats fine but add in some other ways to gain rep so that for those of us that have extra time to continue grinding we can choose to do so. The game shouldn't be kicking me off and telling me to do something else. How exactly does that make for a fun game?
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  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Very rare pepe View Post
    There is nothing wrong with this, why is having a finish point so bad to you guys? Why is it alright to have the same amount of content as before but now it's coming in episodes like it's a fucking TV show? Blizz can win, go back to what actually used to work. Rep from dungeons/rep from tabards/rep from mobs.
    It's not bad for grinders, it's bad for Blizzard because grinders will grind it out in a few days then unsub. Making it a "tv show" if it lasts more than a month gives them another sub and that's money. It's always about the money.

    Time gating is also casual friendly, which is the general theme of wow, because you progress at the same rate whether you have 20 mins a day free or all day. Meanwhile if you create a "mob grind" that will occupy grinders for more than a month, it's gonna be insurmountable work for the casual who can't sink endless hours into said mob grind.

    As I said, a casual can unlock 80% of the allied races the day they launched, as long as he's not a cyclical unsubber, 8 out of 10 allied races used reps you could pre-farm with the "tv episode" schedule of 10-20 mins a day. Same story with flying. The theme is here minimal effort, but something you can't just finish in an afternoon and unsub.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubenwolf View Post
    Yeah...that's what I just said in my comment. You don't need you to lecture and patronize me about it. What I don't understand though is why some people here are defending this instead of wanting something better, more options. It's lazy game design and the worst part about it is that its purpose is to make Blizzard more money not to make the game more fun. Why are people who claim to love this game ok with this and willing to defend it?

    Also I'll have you know I was not one of those people who complained about spending long hours grinding content. This game and all other MMOs will always have grind content, it's what keeps the game alive, so the grind isn't the problem it's how it's handled. Things are not as black and white as you may think. It's not about being too casual either it's about limiting the amount of content I can consume in one day as if they are like my parents giving me a curfew. If I want to grind rep all day I should be able to do that. If they want WQs to be the primary way of gaining rep thats fine but add in some other ways to gain rep so that for those of us that have extra time to continue grinding we can choose to do so. The game shouldn't be kicking me off and telling me to do something else. How exactly does that make for a fun game?
    Yep, I was also never one of those people who complained about spending long hours on grinding content. That's what a MMO is to me. Time gating my ability to grind in a MMO makes it feel less like a MMO to me, it feels more like a chore that I have to log into and play for a few hours a day instead of play and grind whenever I feel like for however long I feel like. I enjoy grinding, that was never an issue for me, I would not bother playing a MMO if it was.

    I also never unsubbed over feeling I finished a grind and got the goal I was hoping for. I just... made an alt, unlocked mounts, pets, transmogs, etc. I have unsubbed many times now after Blizzard added in time gates to everything and made this game feel more like a chore. I wish Blizzard would trust me that I wouldn't automatically unsub from their game just because I unlocked flight or new races without time gates.

  17. #157
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flower Milk View Post
    I wish Blizzard would trust me that I wouldn't automatically unsub from their game just because I unlocked flight or new races without time gates.
    But here is the conundrum. You can hit revered with the reps for 8.2 pathfinder in a week with doing everything. Or more casually at a 2-3 weeks. It has been almost six months and you are still complaining about a time gate on flying. This indicates that you are not interested in a grind being an alternative because you haven't put in even the small amount of time to unlock flying in six months. And that the time gate is self imposed.

    About the only real dumb time gate in WoW right now is LFR taking a month to fully unlock. It really kills the buzz to not be able to do more of the "new raid" when it feels new.
    Last edited by rhorle; 2019-12-12 at 05:58 PM.
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  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubenwolf View Post
    Yeah...that's what I just said in my comment. You don't need you to lecture and patronize me about it. What I don't understand though is why some people here are defending this instead of wanting something better, more options. It's lazy game design and the worst part about it is that its purpose is to make Blizzard more money not to make the game more fun. Why are people who claim to love this game ok with this and willing to defend it?

    Also I'll have you know I was not one of those people who complained about spending long hours grinding content. This game and all other MMOs will always have grind content, it's what keeps the game alive, so the grind isn't the problem it's how it's handled. Things are not as black and white as you may think. It's not about being too casual either it's about limiting the amount of content I can consume in one day as if they are like my parents giving me a curfew. If I want to grind rep all day I should be able to do that. If they want WQs to be the primary way of gaining rep thats fine but add in some other ways to gain rep so that for those of us that have extra time to continue grinding we can choose to do so. The game shouldn't be kicking me off and telling me to do something else. How exactly does that make for a fun game?
    Great dude. Go outside now. Take a breath

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Grubenwolf View Post
    Yeah...that's what I just said in my comment. You don't need you to lecture and patronize me about it. What I don't understand though is why some people here are defending this instead of wanting something better, more options. It's lazy game design and the worst part about it is that its purpose is to make Blizzard more money not to make the game more fun. Why are people who claim to love this game ok with this and willing to defend it?

    Also I'll have you know I was not one of those people who complained about spending long hours grinding content. This game and all other MMOs will always have grind content, it's what keeps the game alive, so the grind isn't the problem it's how it's handled. Things are not as black and white as you may think. It's not about being too casual either it's about limiting the amount of content I can consume in one day as if they are like my parents giving me a curfew. If I want to grind rep all day I should be able to do that. If they want WQs to be the primary way of gaining rep thats fine but add in some other ways to gain rep so that for those of us that have extra time to continue grinding we can choose to do so. The game shouldn't be kicking me off and telling me to do something else. How exactly does that make for a fun game?
    Did it ever occur to you people like things the way they are? YOU need to realize your opinions are just that. They are not fact.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    But here is the conundrum. You can hit revered with the reps for 8.2 pathfinder in a week with doing everything. Or more casually at a 2-3 weeks. It has been almost six months and you are still complaining about a time gate on flying. This indicates that you are not interested in a grind being an alternative because you haven't put in even the small amount of time to unlock flying in six months. And that the time gate is self imposed.

    About the only real dumb time gate in WoW right now is LFR taking a month to fully unlock. It really kills the buzz to not be able to do more of the "new raid" when it feels new.
    Absolutely correct on the first paragraph. In all the time he is wating whining about Blizzard not catering the game solely to him. he could have the grinds he is complaining about done.

    As for LFR, they do that so regular raiders have the opportunity to clear the raid first.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Very rare pepe View Post
    There is nothing wrong with this, why is having a finish point so bad to you guys? Why is it alright to have the same amount of content as before but now it's coming in episodes like it's a fucking TV show? Blizz can win, go back to what actually used to work. Rep from dungeons/rep from tabards/rep from mobs.
    Because it's an MMO, and the point is to play and improve your character. If you could finish everything in a week by grinding 10+ hours a day then there's no reason to play the game after you're done, so you quit until the next patch, so every 6 months you play for a week, except you don't because you quit because playing a game once a week every 6 months is stupid.

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