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  1. #1

    Penalties for quitting Chinese military. T.T

    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/15/a...cli/index.html

    These are pretty harshe penalties. Including being fined and not able to get a govt job for life..

    Having to reimburse the govt for what they spent on you during training..etc Public shaming. Ouch.
    Last edited by Muajin76; 2019-12-16 at 06:26 AM.
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  2. #2
    The Undying Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    i guess one has to take their oaths seriously in China.
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  3. #3
    Pit Lord Kontinuum's Avatar
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    At least they keep their organs.
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    i guess one has to take their oaths seriously in China.
    ....uh what?

  5. #5
    Doesn't China do onscription?

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Muajin76 View Post
    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/15/a...cli/index.html

    These are pretty harshe penalties. Including being fined and not able to get a govt job for life..

    Having to reimburse the govt for what they spent on you during training..etc Public shaming. Ouch.
    Harsh? No prison sentence. Deserting here gets you 2 years. How much is it in the USA? I'm sure they don't take kindly to that either.

  7. #7
    I am Murloc! shadowmouse's Avatar
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    Erm, whatever? It must have been a hella slow day in news for this to be worth coverage, and even slower for it to get posted here.
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  8. #8
    Fines and denied government jobs, are not entirely uncommon. What is really harsh, and quite insane when you think about how much power the government holds to enact these penalties:
    He faces a total of eight penalties that include a two-year ban on foreign travel; traveling within China on planes, long-distance trains or buses; buying real estate; getting loans or insurance; opening a business; and enrolling or studying in college or secondary school.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post
    Erm, whatever? It must have been a hella slow day in news for this to be worth coverage, and even slower for it to get posted here.
    I have to agree, I mean the country is beseiging students and sending ethnic minorities to re-education camps, its draconian punishments for its own soldiers seems like small potatoes in the human rights abuse stakes.
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  10. #10
    I am Murloc! shadowmouse's Avatar
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    @Mormolyce The part that I found odd is that this draws directly on an English language PLA source, with an embedded link. This is news the PLA wanted put out in English (target wouldn't be Chinese) that dangles a click through to their English language site.

    Yes, bungee said a very loud, profanity laden oops and is now running every malware search and cookie check he has. :P I suggest that anyone else who made that mistake do the same.
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  11. #11
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    i guess one has to take their oaths seriously in China.
    Appears so. As all people should who take one.
    " If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher.." - Abraham Lincoln
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Amerissis View Post
    Harsh? No prison sentence. Deserting here gets you 2 years. How much is it in the USA? I'm sure they don't take kindly to that either.
    He didn't desert. He joined up and about 1 month into training discovered he didn't like it and asked for a release.

    In western countries you wouldn't get much of a penalty for that. China is just being a dick about it.

  13. #13
    The Insane Aeula's Avatar
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    Not uncommon to be honest. Being forbidden from getting a government job is really common in countries with mandatory military service, fines too.

  14. #14
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeula View Post
    Not uncommon to be honest. Being forbidden from getting a government job is really common in countries with mandatory military service, fines too.
    Even non government employers here will hesitate at times to hire a vet with less than honorable discharges. It sends up a red flag and they will want to know why.
    " If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher.." - Abraham Lincoln
    The Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to - prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms..” - Samuel Adams

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    He didn't desert. He joined up and about 1 month into training discovered he didn't like it and asked for a release.

    In western countries you wouldn't get much of a penalty for that. China is just being a dick about it.
    He refused to continue serving. That's deserting. You can't just quit the army in the US either, especially not when on active duty, and obviously you can't in China either. He knew the consequences and did it anyway. I see no problem.

  16. #16
    Somehow that article reminds of me Starship Troopers and the difference between a citizen and a civilian.

    "The junior hoodlums who roamed their streets were symptoms of a greater sickness; their citizens (all of them counted as such) glorified their mythology of ‘rights’ . . . and lost track of their duties. No nation, so constituted, can endure."

    “Citizenship is an attitude, a state of mind, an emotional conviction that the whole is greater than the part...and that the part should be humbly proud to sacrifice itself that the whole may live.”

  17. #17
    Scarab Lord Thekri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amerissis View Post
    He refused to continue serving. That's deserting. You can't just quit the army in the US either, especially not when on active duty, and obviously you can't in China either. He knew the consequences and did it anyway. I see no problem.
    It isn't deserting if the military agrees to an early release.

    This sort of thing happens in the US all the time, a Soldier in basic figures out that military life isn't for him/her, and files for release. This results in a general discharge, and typically they have to reimburse the government for several expenses, including cost of transportation and sometimes lodging and food. It certainly isn't as severe as this, but there are penalties to it.

    AWOL is something different, that carries some fairly significant penalties under military law. Deserting is an even more serious charge, that carries a 5 year prison sentence, forfeiture of all pay, and of course a dishonorable discharge. During time of war, Desertion can actually be given a death sentence, although that hasn't happened since WWII, and it is very unlikely too. Typically the military puts people in jail for about a year, takes all their pay, and kicks them out. A lot of military justice uses the principle of "Just go away and stop bothering us".
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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Amerissis View Post
    He refused to continue serving. That's deserting. You can't just quit the army in the US either, especially not when on active duty, and obviously you can't in China either. He knew the consequences and did it anyway. I see no problem.
    In the military, desertion is the abandonment of a duty or post without permission and is done with the intention of not returning. That's not what is happening here.

    For example in the US there is such a thing as Entry Level Separation, it's possible during the first 180 days after enlistment, but it's tricky as it is not something you can request, but get if you are struggling to adapt or perform.

    If you just refuse to serve while being enlisted what you'd be charged with is Dereliction of Duty the penalty for that ranges from 1 to something like 10 years depending on your pay grade, suspension of your political franchise and a ban from owning firearms, which also means you cannot really work in law enforcement or any government job that would require a security clearance of any sort.
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  19. #19
    Honestly was expecting something more extreme like an execution or jailed for a decade.
    Reimbursing the government is common,no government job for life isn’t that bad.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostpanther View Post
    Appears so. As all people should who take one.
    Interesting to see you agreeing with a hostile foreign authoritarian regime once again.

    I guess if you're a bootlicker, a boot is a boot.
    Last edited by Thwart; 2019-12-17 at 02:18 PM. Reason: Infracted for flaming
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