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  1. #461
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    I just thought of something, Luthen's ship, the ai, must be pretty advanced...he flew the ship but it wasn't him pressing the button to shoot the Tie-fighters...makes me think about that Mandalorian episode where Din Djarin was going with Bill Burr n co for busting out that GoT woman's brother, during their flight they had this spooky insectoid looking droid, it did some sick maneuvers with the razor crest, I'm thinking Luthen has some very advanced ai onboard..it did keep its eye on Andor pretty good..

    So his whole ship is basically a droid...dunno how he put it together, but I wonder how many took tactical droids after the clone wars n found other uses for them...



    and that maneuver with teh lazer beams cutting up two tie-fighters, n not miss, so if he is not force sensitive he would probably have missed if the ship didn't do most of the work..

  2. #462
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    I just thought of something, Luthen's ship, the ai, must be pretty advanced...he flew the ship but it wasn't him pressing the button to shoot the Tie-fighters...makes me think about that Mandalorian episode where Din Djarin was going with Bill Burr n co for busting out that GoT woman's brother, during their flight they had this spooky insectoid looking droid, it did some sick maneuvers with the razor crest, I'm thinking Luthen has some very advanced ai onboard..it did keep its eye on Andor pretty good..

    So his whole ship is basically a droid...dunno how he put it together, but I wonder how many took tactical droids after the clone wars n found other uses for them...

    [IMG]https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b4/bf/ef/b4bfefa482bf93cd14958b8c9fb22e35--star-wars.jpg[/IG]

    and that maneuver with teh lazer beams cutting up two tie-fighters, n not miss, so if he is not force sensitive he would probably have missed if the ship didn't do most of the work..

    So like the Millennium Falcon but with a hardcore murder droid instead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister K View Post
    We hating on Filoni now too?
    Nah but the man definitely has certain notes he always hits.

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  3. #463
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    trailer if the show came out before A new hope did, in 1975



    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    So like the Millennium Falcon but with a hardcore murder droid instead.
    Solo? That ai is not in og trilogy...what happened to it? Chewie flushed it out by mistake?

  4. #464
    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Solo? That ai is not in og trilogy...what happened to it? Chewie flushed it out by mistake?
    Threepeeoh comments on the Falcon's weird dialect in Empire Strikes Back.
    “There you stand, the good man doing nothing. And while evil triumphs, and your rigid pacifism crumbles to blood stained dust, the only victory afforded to you is that you stuck true to your guns.”

  5. #465
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    Maarva's not exactly a military leader, could have had some more common sense than inspire a riot where the population was unprepared to take on the empire..
    But she was in character, a pretty reckless person who follows her heart, so now many joined her in the afterlife..

    Though, imps inflicting violence upon Bee, that alone is reason enough to start a rebellion, you just don't do something like that without consequences!

    Mon Mothma threw her driver off with fake gambling accusations towards her husband, then isb accepts it as fact. But...then she anyway introduces her daughter to the gangster's son...wut?

    Liked the end credits scene!

  6. #466
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Mon Mothma threw her driver off with fake gambling accusations towards her husband, then isb accepts it as fact. But...then she anyway introduces her daughter to the gangster's son...wut?
    How did you totally misunderstand or at least not get what was going on? Mothma wasn't just looking to throw off the ISB for the missing money, she was looking for alternative banking avenues. She still needs to fund the Rebellion AND she needs to keep the ISB off her. The convo with her husband is to throw off the ISB, and the deal with the gangster is to insure a flow of credits into the Rebellion. If she kept spending the way she was, the ISB would eventually figure out that the spending wasn't just gambling.

    On the another note. I absolutely love this series. It had fan service that felt earned in the story and just not "Hey Hey, remember this? You like this right?" I think Andor is the best Star Wars Disney+ show to date. Mando Season 1 was good, but Andor blew it out of the water for me. I hope season 2 happens because this was amazingly well done. The characters are all feel real and not just set pieces on a board.
    Last edited by Darththeo; 2022-11-23 at 03:02 PM.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  7. #467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Maarva's not exactly a military leader, could have had some more common sense than inspire a riot where the population was unprepared to take on the empire..
    But she was in character, a pretty reckless person who follows her heart, so now many joined her in the afterlife..

    Though, imps inflicting violence upon Bee, that alone is reason enough to start a rebellion, you just don't do something like that without consequences!

    Mon Mothma threw her driver off with fake gambling accusations towards her husband, then isb accepts it as fact. But...then she anyway introduces her daughter to the gangster's son...wut?

    Liked the end credits scene!
    Everything that happened on Ferrix was planned. It became obvious the citizens were angered by the Empire's direct involvement there. Maarva stayed there, instead of following Cassian, to prepare for an instigation event around her own funeral. The bomb was prepared, her funeral was anticipated to draw the Empire's attention, given that they were arresting and harassing people close to Andor (keeping Maarva untouched as bait). Even the spaceship to escape after the attack was prepared.

    The only deviations were: Cassian spotting Luthien, forcing his hand to encounter him, instead of escaping with the rest and Ciril saving Dedra, thus giving us the long awaited "wth is this plot about, ffs?" resolution. That one was such a slow burn and paid off so well, the making of of a huge Andor antagonist. That's the way you build mysteries into series (compared to RoP, bleh).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    How did you totally misunderstand or at least not get what was going on? Mothma wasn't just looking to throw off the ISB for the missing money, she was looking for alternative banking avenues. She still needs to fund the Rebellion AND she needs to keep the ISB off her. The convo with her husband is to throw off the ISB, and the deal with the gangster is to insure a flow of credits into the Rebellion. If she kept spending the way she was, the ISB would eventually figure out that the spending wasn't just gambling.

    On the another note. I absolutely love this series. It had fan service that felt earned in the story and just not "Hey Hey, remember this? You like this right?" I think Andor is the best Star Wars Disney+ show to date. Mando Season 1 was good, but Andor blew it out of the water for me. I hope season 2 happens because this was amazingly well done. The characters are all feel real and not just set pieces on a board.
    Just a minor disagreement here. The gangster deal was to seal off the 400k credit hole in her bank movements. Obviously, it will turn as her new way of financing the Rebellion, but that's bound to be decided in S2 as a new challenge for her. Or maybe not. Either way, we will happily see.

    Total agreement about the best SW show till today. Mostly because of its innovations and change of character. It's mature, cerebral, gritty, lacking the cuteness of the OT, the idealisation of the Rebellion, and replacing them with hard, painful and edgy truths and choices.
    /spit@Blizzard

  8. #468
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Too bad they'll likely learn the wrong lesson from Andor and just give us more Nostalgia/fan service driven shows and movies.

    Nostalgia and fan service isn't bad. Andor actually has tons in dialogue and call backs, but they are worked so seamlessly into the narrative that unless you are paying attention, they don't stand out. Unlike the Obi-wan show where callbacks and fan service were advertised or teased at point.
    I think fan service should always be the goal. Fans pay money to consume your product, and providing excellent service is how you make sure your customers give you repeat business. As good as Andor is, and as much as I've enjoyed watching it, if it was not based in the Star Wars universe it's highly unlikely I would have given it a chance. There's tons of great TV series I've never watched. It's all the nostalgia and 'member berries' going around in my head which make me excited to see what new Star Wars show/movie is coming out. If they remove the fan service, you remove the nostalgia, and your show becomes one of a thousand other shows out there struggling to find a fan base. Then when/if you find a new fan base, just don't service them either? Removing fan service seems like the 101 course of "how to quickly destroy your own business in one easy step".

    All that said, you can't shoe horn fan service into the product. You can't overwhelm the fan with fan service to the point that you aren't writing good stories. And to your first point, it seems like these producers are always learning the wrong lesson, when the right lesson is always right in front of them: write a good story.

    That said, if you are paying $4 Billion for a preexisting fan base, while you still need a good story, you also need to make sure that story is something that the fan base you purchased wants to see. (just saying, give them fans a little service).

    "Take the time to sit down and talk with your adversaries. You will learn something, and they will learn something from you. When two enemies are talking, they are not fighting. It's when the talking ceases that the ground becomes fertile for violence. So keep the conversation going."
    ~ Daryl Davis

  9. #469
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fabinas View Post
    Just a minor disagreement here. The gangster deal was to seal off the 400k credit hole in her bank movements. Obviously, it will turn as her new way of financing the Rebellion, but that's bound to be decided in S2 as a new challenge for her. Or maybe not. Either way, we will happily see.
    Wouldn't really call that disagreement, because it isn't actually contrary to what I said. But, yes, you are correct. I was pointing out that Waffles didn't see that there were two reasons that Mothma was looking for alternative banking, getting the ISB off her only solves one of those problems.

    Total agreement about the best SW show till today. Mostly because of its innovations and change of character. It's mature, cerebral, gritty, lacking the cuteness of the OT, the idealisation of the Rebellion, and replacing them with hard, painful and edgy truths and choices.
    This show made me feel like the Empire were actually villains in the universe and not just faceless mobs to fight against.

    I absolutely adore this show because it is about building to the hope of a better future. It plays directly into what Rogue One and then the OT is. I honestly hope that Andor Season 2 is true, I want more of this.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ragedaug View Post
    I think fan service should always be the goal. Fans pay money to consume your product, and providing excellent service is how you make sure your customers give you repeat business. As good as Andor is, and as much as I've enjoyed watching it, if it was not based in the Star Wars universe it's highly unlikely I would have given it a chance. There's tons of great TV series I've never watched. It's all the nostalgia and 'member berries' going around in my head which make me excited to see what new Star Wars show/movie is coming out. If they remove the fan service, you remove the nostalgia, and your show becomes one of a thousand other shows out there struggling to find a fan base. Then when/if you find a new fan base, just don't service them either? Removing fan service seems like the 101 course of "how to quickly destroy your own business in one easy step".

    All that said, you can't shoe horn fan service into the product. You can't overwhelm the fan with fan service to the point that you aren't writing good stories. And to your first point, it seems like these producers are always learning the wrong lesson, when the right lesson is always right in front of them: write a good story.

    That said, if you are paying $4 Billion for a preexisting fan base, while you still need a good story, you also need to make sure that story is something that the fan base you purchased wants to see. (just saying, give them fans a little service).
    As I said, Fan Service itself isn't bad. It is bad when it is the selling point or they are pointing at it. Look at the teasing of "Hello there" in the Kenobi series. Reva was a youngling who survived Anakin slaughtering her friends. Even Vader vs Obi-wan in the series was fan service. Everything appeared to just be fan service. The only fan service thing that I didn't get mad at was the Clone Trooper appearance, because that felt natural in the series. But the rest was just "Hey remember this? You like this right?"

    Now with Andor, you have the Rakata reference with the kyber crystal. Spoken dialogue and fans who know what that is went crazy. The shop has tons of easter eggs in it, but they make sense because the shop is about relics, so having those things there make sense. Referencing the movies with how scenes were shot work. And all this fan service is naturally woven into the show, none of it feels out of place or done so for the purpose of appealing to nostalgia. There are tons of references and call backs in Andor, hell, I could argue as much or even more than Kenobi or Mandalorian Season 2 at least. But, they don't take away from the narrative, unlike what prior seasons did.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  10. #470
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    How did you totally misunderstand or at least not get what was going on? Mothma wasn't just looking to throw off the ISB for the missing money, she was looking for alternative banking avenues. She still needs to fund the Rebellion AND she needs to keep the ISB off her. The convo with her husband is to throw off the ISB, and the deal with the gangster is to insure a flow of credits into the Rebellion. If she kept spending the way she was, the ISB would eventually figure out that the spending wasn't just gambling.

    On the another note. I absolutely love this series. It had fan service that felt earned in the story and just not "Hey Hey, remember this? You like this right?" I think Andor is the best Star Wars Disney+ show to date. Mando Season 1 was good, but Andor blew it out of the water for me. I hope season 2 happens because this was amazingly well done. The characters are all feel real and not just set pieces on a board.
    She wanted to get out of the empire's lense, not enlist a gangster.. I have to say I'm disappointed in her decision to fight the empire by taking into her family gangsters, foolish even, as if a crook like that wouldn't want to take control over her finances n then sell out the rebels when it becomes profitable to do so..

    She should have spoken to Luthen before making these decisions..
    Last edited by Ihavewaffles; 2022-11-23 at 04:21 PM.

  11. #471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    She wanted to get out of the empire's lense, not enlist a gangster.. I have to say I'm disappointed in her decision to fight the empire by taking into her family gangsters, foolish even, as if a crook like that wouldn't want to take control over her finances n then sell out the rebels when it becomes profitable to do so..
    Yes, that's kind of the point of Mon Mothma's storyline in Andor. At some point, Mon Mothma needs to flee as she becomes hunted by the Empire and they find out she was funding the rebellion. So, it will not be surprising to anyone who knows the lore, if what you said is exactly how it happens.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  12. #472
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    She wanted to get out of the empire's lense, not enlist a gangster.. I have to say I'm disappointed in her decision to fight the empire by taking into her family gangsters, foolish even, as if a crook like that wouldn't want to take control over her finances n then sell out the rebels when it becomes profitable to do so..

    She should have spoken to Luthen before making these decisions..
    She already spoke to Luthen. She didn't take the gangsters in her family. Yet. She agreed to a meeting, not a betrothal. She obviously hopes that either the kid won't appeal to her daughter or that, along with her husband (despite her enstrangement with him) will convince their daughter to not go along the Chandrilan way.

    The rest are your fears. The gangster is into buying political influence in Coruscant, while staying out of Empire's way. There's no way he'd sell out the mother of his kid's wife, unless the "profit" was her life or theirs.
    /spit@Blizzard

  13. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fabinas View Post
    She already spoke to Luthen. She didn't take the gangsters in her family. Yet. She agreed to a meeting, not a betrothal. She obviously hopes that either the kid won't appeal to her daughter or that, along with her husband (despite her enstrangement with him) will convince their daughter to not go along the Chandrilan way.

    The rest are your fears. The gangster is into buying political influence in Coruscant, while staying out of Empire's way. There's no way he'd sell out the mother of his kid's wife, unless the "profit" was her life or theirs.
    Yes, because gangsters are known for holding back n not being greedy opportunist scums..

  14. #474
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Yes, because gangsters are known for holding back n not being greedy opportunist scums..
    You're generalising here and before. While you may prove to be right in the future, the story doesn't seem to go that way yet.

    Mind you, when you give someone up, you still have to ensure you're valuable or not responsible for malice, else an Empire might take you and the person you sell out in one swift stroke.
    /spit@Blizzard

  15. #475
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    I think Andor is the best Star Wars Disney+ show to date. Mando Season 1 was good, but Andor blew it out of the water for me. I hope season 2 happens because this was amazingly well done. The characters are all feel real and not just set pieces on a board.
    Yeah, Andor is great.

    What's amazing for me too, is how they ended season 1 in a way that neatly sets up a second season but if that somehow never gets done it wouldn't matter since you can watch Rogue One right after this and it would work too.

    And that end credit scene... holy fuck how satisfying was that. It makes the prisons hit harder and also explains why they grab people from the streets for the smallest offence and hand out 6y sentences like candy. Season 1 going out with a punch like a truck.

  16. #476
    Is that guy a gangster? I thought he was just a rich guy looking for a strategic marriage for his son.

  17. #477
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jotaux View Post
    Is that guy a gangster? I thought he was just a rich guy looking for a strategic marriage for his son.
    He is. /10char
    /spit@Blizzard

  18. #478
    Quote Originally Posted by Fabinas View Post
    He is. /10char
    Wookiepedia has him as just a banker with a bad reputation.

  19. #479
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    On the another note. I absolutely love this series. It had fan service that felt earned in the story and just not "Hey Hey, remember this? You like this right?" I think Andor is the best Star Wars Disney+ show to date. Mando Season 1 was good, but Andor blew it out of the water for me. I hope season 2 happens because this was amazingly well done. The characters are all feel real and not just set pieces on a board.
    Yeah tbh everything else is pretty juvenile by comparison.

    Which I know isn't completely fair because they are different types of shows, but even for a gunslinger show, the mando doesn't have to be nearly as cheesy as it is. Or have so many plot points/world stuff that makes no sense.

    Boba and ObiWan were bad by basically every standard and not worth talking about
    A better way to think about Casual v Hardcore: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...asual-Hardcore

  20. #480
    I need to talk with my attorney regarding my will.

    I now realize that I want my ashes put into a brick. And then I want someone to take that brick and then use it to hit the face of someone who really, really deserves it.

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