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  1. #21
    From the article Connal linked and, going by his history, likely only read the headline of:

    "By mobilizing his white, rural base, Trump matched Democratic enthusiasm in purple states such as Florida and Ohio and overwhelmed Democratic incumbents in red states such as North Dakota, Indiana, and Missouri. It’s an old game: W. E. B. Du Bois famously called it the “psychological wage.” Instead of protecting white people from economic hardship, you protect them from the racial demons you’ve stirred up in their minds. And Trump is this era’s undisputed master of that game. He understood that as frightened as many Americans are of losing their health care, he—with the help of Fox News—could make them even more frightened of Honduran asylum-seekers. Now that the election is over, I suspect the caravan will disappear from Fox’s screens and Trump’s Twitter feed—until something like it is needed again.

    The harsh truth is this: Racism often works. Cross-racial coalitions for economic justice are the exception in American history. Mobilizing white people to protect their racial dominance is the norm. The lesson of 2018 is that American politics is not reverting to “normal.” In many ways, Trumpism is normal. It’s not Trump who is running uphill against American tradition, it’s the people who are trying—bravely but with mixed success—to stop him.
    "

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Tribalism works because it’s in our nature. A person tapping into that truth is sure to get support.

    If you want to counter that create stronger institutions that maintain order and goodwill between tribes instead of continuously pushing for more division. Trump is a symptom of our cultural decline... not the cause of it.
    I don't particularly give a shit about Trump's role in all of this, so yeah no argument there. Of real note are the abetters, enablers, and collaborators who are racing headlong to die on a hill somewhere on the wrong side of the trash heap of history.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    History has a funny way of reverting from one extream to the other.

    Saying we need moderation and temperance is not enabling one side or the other. It’s seeking common ground between two perspectives.

    The right can go too far. So can the left.
    as you claim to be a student of history you ought to be familiar with what happened the last time people gave ground to fascists in the name of "moderation."

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    History has a funny way of reverting from one extream to the other.

    Saying we need moderation and temperance is not enabling one side or the other. It’s seeking common ground between two perspectives.

    The right can go too far. So can the left.
    Racists, sexists, and homophobes are not willing to live in peace with their neighbors, so there is no "common ground" to be had with them. Indulging it with "moderation" and "temperance" IS enabling it, and has generally proved to be the worst strategy for it, in fact.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I’m well aware. So I would like to avoid it by stopping the flow of chaos from an ideology that seeks to free us from all norms and traditions.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I’m not taking about those people. I’m talking about people that nominally support minorities, and tolerate the differences.

    Racists, homophobes, etc, have existed and will continue to exist until humanity as is, is no more.
    well you've been proven wrong on your points already, back to vague proselytizing.

  6. #26
    This is like the umpteenth time Connal claims that the middle between two points is always the right one, even if said point is in the middle of moderation and extremism, and people are still getting baited into responding to his nonsense.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    What did Obama do to be so polarizing? besides you know being black.
    Well, he was pruported be a messianic figure that would bring America together. By the end of his presiency race relations hadnt been worse since Jim Crow.

    Also somethign about taking away his Nobel Peace Prize.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I’m well aware. So I would like to avoid it by stopping the flow of chaos from an ideology that seeks to free us from all norms and traditions.
    No one's doing that.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I’m not taking about those people. I’m talking about people that nominally support minorities, and tolerate the differences.

    Racists, homophobes, etc, have existed and will continue to exist until humanity as is, is no more.
    So many straw men. Yeah, no one's confused about that. The issue was your ongoing, debunked, and generally moronic claims that appeasing them is suddenly going to work out better for the rest of us this time.

  9. #29
    Banned Kangodo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    History has a funny way of reverting from one extream to the other.
    No, it does not.
    When has it ever?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    Was a good thing... Cuba has a better healthcare system than the USA. Chew on that for a while.
    Socialist nations will always have better healthcare than neoliberal ones. That's the idea of socialism.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Demasiados View Post
    Well, he was pruported be a messianic figure that would bring America together. By the end of his presiency race relations hadnt been worse since Jim Crow.

    Also somethign about taking away his Nobel Peace Prize.
    he said besides being black.
    there's a reason you had to reference jim crow there.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    What new tradition has the left put forward that is not hated by many on the right?
    The right is free to hate whatever good ideas and new traditions it wants; I really don't give a shit.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    No, it does not.
    When has it ever?
    To him, moderation is in itself a form of extremism; it's an answer that stems from his aboulomania.

    I once asked him to make a simple choice between killing and not killing random innocent people off the streets, he went into some incoherent rant about how murderers are people too and how nobody is truly innocent. Absolutely couldn't give a straight answer.

    Would any other person who's healthy in mind have the slightest hesitation or reservation giving the right answer to such a simple and narrowly-framed moral question?
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I know you don’t. But since they make up roughly half of the population in a given nation, that’s very short sighted of you.
    No, they don't, and no, it's not. They were on the wrong side of the Civil War and WWII; they're on the wrong side of history now. The sooner they're smacked down and marginalized away, the better. For the good of the country and its future.

  14. #34
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levelfive View Post
    Representative democracy. The REAL problem.
    It’s the worst form of government, with the exception of all other attempted forms of government.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Levelfive View Post
    No, they don't, and no, it's not. They were on the wrong side of the Civil War and WWII; they're on the wrong side of history now. The sooner they're smacked down and marginalized away, the better. For the good of the country and its future.
    Yes, half the country needs to be silenced and put away.

    Yikes, do you realize how insane you sound right now? And America has identified more as conservative than liberal in its entire history, anyway. Yes that gap is shrinking but you act like the majority of the country identifies as liberal which is not true.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    Yes, half the country needs to be silenced and put away.

    Yikes, do you realize how insane you sound right now? And America has identified more as conservative than liberal in its entire history, anyway. Yes that gap is shrinking but you act like the majority of the country identifies as liberal which is not true.
    I'm specifically claiming they're not half the country--do you guys realize you're claiming half the country is racist, sexist, and homophobic?

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Well you can go the other route... violence... but the left knows it won’t win that one. Most of the guns are on the right.

    Compromise, stalemate or violence are our current choices.
    Yeah, the far right has a great track record in warfare... except the ones where there is actual fighting involved. Hell, they cried real tears when Richard Spencer got Debo'd. Where are you getting this idea from?
    9 out of 10 people agree that in a room full of 10 people one person will always disagree with the other 9.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    Ok, so violence it is.

    And yes they are... look up studies on conservative and liberal voters in a country. It’s not a perfect 50-50, but close enough. And people tend to get more conservative as they age and make families... I know, a foreign idea to a lot of liberals today who have no children.
    Not all conservatives are racist, sexist, and homophobic...right? But like I said, unwilling to live in peace. Thanks for proving the point.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Levelfive View Post
    I'm specifically claiming they're not half the country--do you guys realize you're claiming half the country is racist, sexist, and homophobic?
    I believe Endus also said something similar to that end of how ironic conservatives are by taking offense to Hillary's claim of half of Trump's supporters being a basket of deplorables.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Demasiados View Post
    Well, he was pruported be a messianic figure that would bring America together. By the end of his presiency race relations hadnt been worse since Jim Crow.

    Also somethign about taking away his Nobel Peace Prize.
    So what policies did he implement that did that? not sure where you got the messianic figure part and I will say this neither Trump or Obama magically summon racism. We aren't even a century removed from the civil rights era racism was always live and well in the US people just put their white hoods in their closets.

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