View Poll Results: Burning Crusade in 2021?

Voters
368. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    104 28.26%
  • No

    86 23.37%
  • Maybe

    46 12.50%
  • What are you smoking?

    132 35.87%
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  1. #141
    What they could and should do in the future is have one client and allow people to choose which expansion experience they want to have by setting it from the main screen after WOW opens from the launcher. An x.1 patch and a final patch (or current patch if you want retail) for each expansion could be chosen and you need to restart the client if you want to change between them.

    I personally think such a system would be considered too much work, but it would be cool nonetheless if they would implement it.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Poopsnacker View Post
    At first, find yourself the source. It is some pages in the back on this site, or in this forum etc, that the Server population are not actual numbers.

    You rely on scan sites now with actives players now, too. But you still show, that you don't understand these sites. It's about CHARACTERS, NOT PLAYERS.
    As nothing beside Blizz can get the actual playerbase. But you can guess them.

    The highest scan numbers now show 750k different characters worldwide. Seeing that forum and simply my friendlist (the only one that still plays Classic) plays at least 2 characters. A lot of these forum even state they play multiple characters. If you think about that fact and divide it by the scan numbers, even when you add a number for possible missed characters unscanned you will come down roughly to 200-250k players. And that fits perfectly the site only scanning characters online at the same time which comes clostest to the actual playerbase.

    These numbers may not be too bad and it is enough to keep at least some servers active, but it is definetly not closely enough for another set of servers with BC. And stick your Server Population tag in your arse. My Classic servers was dead after the first month and it still says 'High'. A literal joke.

    But as you said, as I said, it does not matter as long as you enjoy what you are doing. But I love how people are blind about facts when they don't want them to be true. I mean, in the end every retail players has something from a healthy classic as it is free money for blizz with almost no effort that flows into other development. And, as I said, retail was freed from so much toxic waste while the Classic community is widely complaining about growing toxicity.
    And there are tons of players back in retail that played classic and came back to retail after several years right now. WIn WIn, right?
    So. you don't have a source and ask me to find something on MMO-champ? I only read blue as source, sorry. Didn't read rest, since all your credability went down the drain.

    They did change how the population was shown, but not in any way close to what you said. They just changed it from how it works on retail to more how it works on classic, but the classic servers also have a lot higher max population. Low on classic = high on vanilla.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    Do you have some detailed breakdown of Blizzard's income that nobody else has access to?
    Everyone has access to their tax revisions and they have frequently been a discussion topic on these very forums. the actual sub numbers is a guestimate though, hence the inaccuracy when describing them. but i doubt anyone would argue that they were significantly lower in BFA than during its peak at the end of wotlk / start of cata.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumile View Post
    Everyone has access to their tax revisions and they have frequently been a discussion topic on these very forums. the actual sub numbers is a guestimate though, hence the inaccuracy when describing them. but i doubt anyone would argue that they were significantly lower in BFA than during its peak at the end of wotlk / start of cata.
    You have absolutely no idea what percentage of Blizzard's current income is currently coming from value added services because they don't release a break down of their revenue.

    It's a bit disingenuous to compare Blizzard in WotLK when they had just WoW and WoW alone to Blizzard today which has its income shared across OW, HotS, D3 and Hearthstone. Add to that the fact that Blizzard booted 800 employees recently (Q4 2018) and it paints a picture that, no, Blizzard really isn't reaping the same profit from value added services as they would have back at peak WoW. I won't disagree with your contention that, yes, value added services likely do allow WoW to operate successfully with lower subscriber numbers and huge profit margins; however, to say that these services make Blizzard the same amount of revenue as they would have from subscriptions back in WotLK is a bit of an exaggeration which cannot be substantiated without knowing information about Blizzard's income streams that hasn't been released.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    You have absolutely no idea what percentage of Blizzard's current income is currently coming from value added services because they don't release a break down of their revenue.

    It's a bit disingenuous to compare Blizzard in WotLK when they had just WoW and WoW alone to Blizzard today which has its income shared across OW, HotS, D3 and Hearthstone. Add to that the fact that Blizzard booted 800 employees recently (Q4 2018) and it paints a picture that, no, Blizzard really isn't reaping the same profit from value added services as they would have back at peak WoW. I won't disagree with your contention that, yes, value added services likely do allow WoW to operate successfully with lower subscriber numbers and huge profit margins; however, to say that these services make Blizzard the same amount of revenue as they would have from subscriptions back in WotLK is a bit of an exaggeration which cannot be substantiated without knowing information about Blizzard's income streams that hasn't been released.
    not even gonna bother arguing this with you, go look it up yourself, you don't even understand the basics of what I've told you. the profits are segregated.

  6. #146
    Why is the word "new" in the title?

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    WoW is a subscription game and as such temporary bumps in player subscriptions aren't always the best indication of quality. Sustainability is far more important to Blizzard than a quick burst of millions of subscribers. If Blizzard was satisfied with simply the temporary surge that Classic brought to the game, I'm sure we would have heard them announce additional expansions at BlizzCon. Instead, we heard barely anything. To me, that tells me that they're still very concerned with how well Classic trends six-months-plus out and do not want to commit to additional products until they know that there's a reliable, easily sustainable audience for the content.
    Errr, exactly? It's a subscription game and Blizzard is a business -- with a simple goal: Make money. A temporary boost in subscriptions for relatively little man-hours of work compared to a new expansion? That's not just financially viable -- it's a financial no-brainer.

    Sustainability is important for retail, yes. But we're talking about legacy expansions here. It's a different business approach. They'd happily take a huge shot of re-subs (which benefits retail too since they're the same sub), especially when the team required to bring back TBC (as they did Vanilla) is minuscule compared to making a new retail expansion.

    This is pretty basic business. Your heart cannot argue with cold hard maths.

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    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    I don’t think TBC servers will ever happen, unless they actually have backups of the servers available and can just plant them into Classic.

    Doing so would create an odd precedent of just where they’d draw a line in re-releasing old expansions.
    If you studied business studies you wouldn't be saying you don't think they will ever happen. You'd instead be thinking they're quite likely to happen.

  8. #148
    Nice click bait thread, OP.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    I don't really understand what's to be discussed here that hasn't already been discussed (to death) in any one of the already-existing threads on this subject. If BlizzCon is any indication, TBC is on the radar but they're waiting to see the long-term staying power of Classic before announcing additional expansions.
    Forget long term staying power. The initial interest alone that Classic generated made them MANY MANY MANY times over in profit over the (comparatively) small cost and small team required to turn Vanilla into Classic for us. That alone is financially viable. Even if every player who came back for Classic quit after a week, it would have been a roaring success.

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    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    If additional bursts in subscribers were a no-brainer, as you suggest, we would've heard about it at BlizzCon. We didn't.
    Your point 'we didn't hear it at Blizzcon' proves jack squat and you know it. That Blizzcon was literally what, 3 months post Classic launch? WAY too soon to be announcing TBC. If we hear about TBC-Classic, it'll be at 2020's Blizzcon. Again, this is basic economics. You still want to milk something for what it's worth.

    You can't just look at the lack of TBC announcements at Blizzcon mere months after Classic came out and use that as some kind of argument that it proves there won't be TBC. That's primary school levels of argument. I mean COME ON...

    And yes, additional bursts of subscribers are fantastic for Blizzard, because at the end of the day it's money, and a damn sight more money than it cost them to bring Vanilla back to us in the form of Classic. This is literally the core fundamental of how a business works. It's all about the money, dude.
    Last edited by Will; 2020-01-19 at 12:44 AM.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    If you studied business studies you wouldn't be saying you don't think they will ever happen. You'd instead be thinking they're quite likely to happen.
    What an amazingly ignorant and stupid post, jesus christ lol.

    Dude, Classic wasn't even going to happen until some random old Blizzard devs literally got a hold of Kotick and more or less pleaded with him that Classic would be a financial success. So much for "business studies", huh?

    TBC servers would almost assuredly be a success (like a slightly less successful version of Classic), but like I said, they may not have the ability to even implement it. Classic only exists today because they managed to find a single backup version of the game, and even then it took them months to get it working so they could release it. TBC-Classic might actually be an impossibility.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Slowpoke is a Gamer View Post
    Honestly the big loser in the "split the playerbase" argument would be retail. Because releasing more classic versions means there's going to be players who disliked Vanilla that might now like BC, or might now like Wrath, and decide to split time between Retail and those expansions.
    This 'split the playerbase' argument is blown way out of proportion. The game already has sharding technology. Less shards, same player capacity per shard? Unless you're on a dead realm, in which case other options exist like transfers or mergers.

    Furthermore, people who tout this 'split the playerbase' argument as a reason why they shouldn't do TBC also fail to realise that a whole lotta TBC players are not currently playing, nor have any interest in Classic. Those such people returning for TBC would actually add to the playerbase, counteracting the split.

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    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    What an amazingly ignorant and stupid post, jesus christ lol.

    Dude, Classic wasn't even going to happen until some random old Blizzard devs literally got a hold of Kotick and more or less pleaded with him that Classic would be a financial success. So much for "business studies", huh?

    TBC servers would almost assuredly be a success (like a slightly less successful version of Classic), but like I said, they may not have the ability to even implement it. Classic only exists today because they managed to find a single backup version of the game, and even then it took them months to get it working so they could release it. TBC-Classic might actually be an impossibility.
    You said it yourself.
    Classic only exists today because they managed to find a single backup version of the game
    Also, regarding what you said here:
    Classic wasn't even going to happen until some random old Blizzard devs literally got a hold of Kotick and more or less pleaded with him
    well I can only respond as follows: Do you think Blizzard own a crystal ball? It's widely accepted even Blizzard had no idea Classic would be even HALF as successful as it actually turned out to be. Now they KNOW how successful it is, so my argument is simple: In LIGHT of this knowledge, TBC is a no-brainer.

    You call my post ignorant and stupid, but you're literally making me face palm with your terrible, atrocious logic. From my perspective you're the one who has no bloody clue.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Caperfin View Post
    Why is the word "new" in the title?
    Probably for click-bait

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    You call my post ignorant and stupid, but you're literally making me face palm with your terrible, atrocious logic. From my perspective you're the one who has no bloody clue.
    My post literally says, verbatim "I don’t think TBC servers will ever happen, unless they actually have backups of the servers available and can just plant them into Classic."

    Like, how you even brought anything relating to the business side of things into it is anyone's guess. You're in your own little illiterate world.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    My post literally says, verbatim "I don’t think TBC servers will ever happen, unless they actually have backups of the servers available and can just plant them into Classic."
    Them planting the servers into Classic as-is is not very likely. More likely we'd see another client. They confirmed they have backups, rendering the 'unless' part moot. Sure, it took them months, but it was still with a small team at low-cost. They also confirmed that TBC is a possibility, yet you, Mr .'literate', claim it might be an impossibility.

    It's ironic you accusing me of being in an illiterate world when your previous reply to me showed you completely failed to understand what I was saying and came back at me with some absolute nonsense. Pot calling the kettle black, much? Let's look at your stupidity shall we?

    -- You called my argument ignorant (I argued that TBC is super likely in the light of Classic' success) and replied that they weren't even going to make Classic until some old Blizzard dev nagged them. This in itself is incredibly stupid given that Blizzard couldn't have foresaw Classic' success, but now they know it's a hot thing, TBC is super likely. I mean just how daft does one have to be, to actually try and use a lack of knowledge from the past to argue why something wouldn't be obvious today, with that knowledge now acquired?

    --You then question why I brought anything related to the business side of things into the discussion, despite the fact your reply to me literally 5 minutes ago was in discussion of the business side of things. Our initial dialogue was directly related to the business side of things, yet you're now claiming it wasn't?
    Last edited by Will; 2020-01-19 at 01:09 AM.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    Them planting the servers into Classic as-is is not very likely. More likely we'd see another client. They confirmed they have backups, rendering the 'unless' part moot. Sure, it took them months, but it was still with a small team at low-cost. They also confirmed that TBC is a possibility, yet you, Mr .'literate', claim it might be an impossibility.
    I didn't make any definitive claims. I literally just said I didn't think they'd do it unless they had backups (since Classic itself was only saved on the stroke of luck that they found a working backup of the client). If they already have the ability to do TBC-Classic, then we'll just have to wait and see what they do.

    That's as far as this goes. I'm sorry you're so upset, but that's the way it is.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    I didn't make any definitive claims. I literally just said I didn't think they'd do it unless they had backups (since Classic itself was only saved on the stroke of luck that they found a working backup of the client). If they already have the ability to do TBC-Classic, then we'll just have to wait and see what they do.

    That's as far as this goes. I'm sorry you're so upset, but that's the way it is.
    You didn't make definitive claims, hence why I said might. You insult me repeatedly, call me ignorant and in my own little world, yet you're apparently just as illiterate.

    Sorry, I agree, I've had enough of you too. You're a real charmer. I'm also sorry you're so upset from my first quote. I don't know why you got so defensive so quick but whatever

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by TOM_RUS View Post
    Won't happen. Classic already dead.
    lol classic is dead, funniest joke ive heard this week

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    You didn't make definitive claims, hence why I said might. You insult me repeatedly, call me ignorant and in my own little world, yet you're apparently just as illiterate.

    Sorry, I agree, I've had enough of you too. You're a real charmer. I'm also sorry you're so upset from my first quote. I don't know why you got so defensive so quick but whatever
    You literally began responding to me by calling into question my knowledge of business, despite that having literally nothing to do with anything that I said and then acted passive aggressive from there-on out, trying to claim I made an argument I never made, and you're the one whining about how I was insulting? I don't think I ever want to read your posts again. Blocked.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    Your point 'we didn't hear it at Blizzcon' proves jack squat and you know it. That Blizzcon was literally what, 3 months post Classic launch? WAY too soon to be announcing TBC. If we hear about TBC-Classic, it'll be at 2020's Blizzcon. Again, this is basic economics. You still want to milk something for what it's worth.

    You can't just look at the lack of TBC announcements at Blizzcon mere months after Classic came out and use that as some kind of argument that it proves there won't be TBC. That's primary school levels of argument. I mean COME ON...

    And yes, additional bursts of subscribers are fantastic for Blizzard, because at the end of the day it's money, and a damn sight more money than it cost them to bring Vanilla back to us in the form of Classic. This is literally the core fundamental of how a business works. It's all about the money, dude.
    You're completely misconstruing what I'm saying. You and I have both agreed in other threads that we'd like to see TBC servers. I'm not saying that TBC won't ever happen and I would definitely play on a TBC Legacy realm if it did happen as that's when I first began playing WoW. All I'm saying is that expectations should be tempered because if TBC were as seemingly obvious as many TBC fans would like to believe we likely would have already had an announcement. (Classic's own announcement was ~2 years before it was launched, so if 2021 is the target for TBC Legacy realms then it would stand to reason BlizzCon 2019 would be the perfect time to begin the hype train.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tumile View Post
    not even gonna bother arguing this with you, go look it up yourself, you don't even understand the basics of what I've told you. the profits are segregated.
    Are you even going to bother reading what I wrote? I actually agreed with you, I just think you're jumping the gun a bit with the conclusion that profits in 2019 are identical to profits from subscriptions in 2010 due only to value added services.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by therealstegblob View Post
    TBC servers would almost assuredly be a success (like a slightly less successful version of Classic), but like I said, they may not have the ability to even implement it. Classic only exists today because they managed to find a single backup version of the game, and even then it took them months to get it working so they could release it. TBC-Classic might actually be an impossibility.
    If they lacked the ability to implement TBC, why would they have said, in the AMA right before Classic launch, that moving to TBC would be easy, now that the Classic client foundations exist?

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