Are Americans more likely to be pro-employer rather than pro-employees?

[Combatbutler]

Well, I support capitalism... that's why.

Unlike you, I support employers, employees, and consumers.

Indeed I see pure capitalism akin to cancer, so we will never come to an understanding.

[Machismo]

We are forced to do stuff we don't necessarily want all the time, for the benefit of society as a whole. That's why we have laws. So that the strong can't prey on the weak.

It's true that the rich have it much better in the U.S than in Europe, but it's also true that the poor and the uneducated have it vastly better in Europe compared to the U.S. Because we as a society have decided that it's better if even the weakest get to live lives with dignity.

Great, I oppose that bullshit, as well.

This is no different than feeling justified in taxing the shit out of the wealthy, or placing massive tariffs on goods. In the end, you want other people to suffer, and pay for the shit you want to be given to you.

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Indeed I see pure capitalism akin to cancer, so we will never come to an understanding.

No, we won't agree. I support capitalism and liberty, and you do not. I never expected to change your mind.

[Deathknightish]

Great, I oppose that bullshit, as well.

This is no different than feeling justified in taxing the shit out of the wealthy, or placing massive tariffs on goods. In the end, you want other people to suffer, and pay for the shit you want to be given to you.

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No, we won't agree. I support capitalism and liberty, and you do not. I never expected to change your mind.

"suffer". A rich person not getting 2k extra a month suffers much less than a poor person not getting 200 extra. The difference is that maybe the rich dude has to save up one extra month for that car, while the poor person maybe can't afford food that day. The rich person can look up his finances, how he's spending his money, while the poor person can't.

Also, EVERYBODY pays taxes, not just the rich. The difference is that the underclass can't afford to give away as much of their wealth as a rich person can. That's why they tax less.

[Machismo]

"suffer". A rich person not getting 2k extra a month suffers much less than a poor person not getting 200 extra. The difference is that maybe the rich dude has to save up one extra month for that car, while the poor person maybe can't afford food that day. The rich person can look up his finances, how he's spending his money, while the poor person can't.

Also, EVERYBODY pays taxes, not just the rich.

Yes, everybody does pay taxes... some people simply pay a lot less. Almost half the United States pays not federal income taxes. People want to shift that burden even more onto the shoulders of those earning more.

Socialism is inherently punitive. No thanks.

[Deathknightish]

Yes, everybody does pay taxes... some people simply pay a lot less. Almost half the United States pays not federal income taxes. People want to shift that burden even more onto the shoulders of those earning more.

Socialism is inherently punitive. No thanks.

Good thing we don't have any socialist country in western Europe, then. Closest we get are the social democratic countries in Scandinavia, where social democracy is still built on capitalism and free markets. Just not as ultracapitalist as the U.S.

[Machismo]

Good thing we don't have any socialist country in western Europe, then. Closest we get are the social democratic countries in Scandinavia, where social democracy is still built on capitalism. Just not as ultracapitalist as the U.S.

The United States isn't ultra-capitalist, not by a long shot.

Enjoy your socialism.

[Calfredd]

These EU socialists on this website make me laugh. They are too busy raising the min wage while 50% of their population is out of work.

Their economies will soon be under water.

And the real unemployment number for the US is 47%. /s

[Twdft]

We are forced to do stuff we don't necessarily want all the time, for the benefit of society as a whole. That's why we have laws. So that the strong can't prey on the weak.

This is the thing Machismo can not understand. It doesn't even compute for him, he has no clue what society means.

[JohnBrown1917]

The United States isn't ultra-capitalist, not by a long shot.

Enjoy your socialism.

Oh, the good ol' 'its not true capitalism!'.

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This is the thing Machismo can not understand. It doesn't even compute for him, he has no clue what society means.

He understands it, he is just okay with the majority living in terrible conditions if it means the few billionares can make some extra millions.

[Elegiac]

thebalance.com/us-economic-outlook-3305669

Unemployment rate at 3.5%. Move along your worthless European socialist.

Unemployment doesn't matter when people are working multiple jobs to survive, QED.

[XDurionX]

Unemployment doesn't matter when people are working multiple jobs to survive, QED.

Why do you even answer this sock puppet account? Just report and move on.

[Machismo]

Oh, the good ol' 'its not true capitalism!'.

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He understands it, he is just okay with the majority living in terrible conditions if it means the few billionares can make some extra millions.

It's not, they've been pushing more socialistic for decades.

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This is the thing Machismo can not understand. It doesn't even compute for him, he has no clue what society means.

I understand it just fine, I simply oppose many aspects of it. Socialism to me is not the problem, it's the use of force to enact it which I take umbrage with. I think voluntary socialism would be great for those who wish to partake.

[XDurionX]

It's not, they've been pushing more socialistic for decades.

[Machismo]

This here is the problem, thinking that taxing the shit out of other people is acceptable. 40% is too much, as is 20%.

Most Americans have no clue how much they actually pay in taxes. At best, they tend to keep track of their state and federal income taxes. They don't think of gas taxes, property taxes, local taxes, sales tax, and all the little taxes that go into production, rental agreements, lease agreements, hotel taxes, tickets for venues, and all the others.

So, the average American would need to pay well over $12k per year, just for the federal government. That means a family of five, would be pushing more than $60k to keep up with out federal spending. How much is your household paying per year, just for federal income taxes?

[Elegiac]

This here is the problem, thinking that taxing the shit out of other people is acceptable. 40% is too much, as is 20%.

Most Americans have no clue how much they actually pay in taxes. At best, they tend to keep track of their state and federal income taxes. They don't think of gas taxes, property taxes, local taxes, sales tax, and all the little taxes that go into production, rental agreements, lease agreements, hotel taxes, tickets for venues, and all the others.

So, the average American would need to pay well over $12k per year, just for the federal government. That means a family of five, would be pushing more than $60k to keep up with out federal spending. How much is your household paying per year, just for federal income taxes?

Wow that's some bullshit napkin math.

Thank god we have progressive taxation structures to ensure people don't pay more than they can afford in taxes.

[Machismo]

Wow that's some bullshit napkin math.

Thank god we have progressive taxation structures to ensure people don't pay more than they can afford in taxes.

What is the federal budget this year? How many people in the United States?

Higher taxes are great, so long as someone else is paying for them. Man, you guys love spending other people's money.

[Elegiac]

What is the federal budget this year? How many people in the United States?

Higher taxes are great, so long as someone else is paying for them. Man, you guys love spending other people's money.

Amusing you call it "other people's money" when the stagnation of wages versus productivity gains mean it is, in fact, very much the public's money.

"Taxation is theft" is the flat earth of political science and we won't be entertaining it as serious, thanks.

[Machismo]

How much tax are you paying? (I suspect it isn't very much).

I file jointly with my wife, and we paid about $45k in federal withholding, and another $37k for my business. That's not including all the Social Security and Medicare deductions for us, as well as my employees.

Now, your turn.

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Amusing you call it "other people's money" when the stagnation of wages versus productivity gains mean it is, in fact, very much the public's money.

"Taxation is theft" is the flat earth of political science and we won't be entertaining it as serious, thanks.

Nope, it's someone else's money. The bottom line is that you people have no problem taking other people's money, but the vast majority of you are not putting in the same.

[JohnBrown1917]

Taxes are socialism and the more you tax the more socialister it is.

[Elegiac]

Nope, it's someone else's money. The bottom line is that you people have no problem taking other people's money, but the vast majority of you are not putting in the same.

Uh huh. Sure.

"The vast majority of us" don't derive as much benefit from society existing as the well off. You as a business owner take a much higher toll on things like utilities and road infrastructure, for example. To say nothing of the cost of subsidising everyone's low wages through public assistance.

Being wealthy is a privilege. Living is a right.