About blood magic and raising the dead.

[Piamonte]

How can blood magic be used to raise the dead?? In wowpedia it is described as a form of "tortured life magic" and in a book, when voljin examines the blood magic of the Mogu, he says "it stink of fel", which kinda makes sense because fel is essentially corrupted life magic which is close to the description of blood magic, so you could put blood magic near Disorder in the wow cosmology chart.

But then again, Hakkar is a blood god and he comes from the shadowlands, the death knights third spec is blood, so blood magic is also tied with death, in Nazmir trolls use it to resurrect the dead, so which is it?? because if you put blood magic near death everything is ok, but if you put it near life or near fel it doesnt make any sense for it to be able to resurrect the dead.

Any thoughts?.

[Aucald]

Seems to me that it kind of replicates the classic formula for undeath in WoW - use Necromancy/Shadow to pump essence back into a corpse and summon the soul imperfectly in union with the body, creating a cadaverous abomination of a formerly living person (whereas Life/Spirit/Nature magic would more perfectly reunite the body and soul in true resurrection). Substitute the Necromancy with Blood Magic and you get the same basic formula, though Blood Magic seems more like it tends to create non-sentient enslaved undead than free-willed or shackled undead a la Necromancy.

[Pandragon]

Blood Magic resurrection reanimates by putting blood back into the corpse with no soul. Necromancy reanimates by bringing the soul back and forcefully binding it to the body without the need for blood.

[Piamonte]

Blood Magic resurrection reanimates by putting blood back into the corpse with no soul. Necromancy reanimates by bringing the soul back and forcefully binding it to the body without the need for blood.

That kinda works, it would be like creating a constructs, a golem, but then again how can blood magic do this if it is a form of life magic.

[Pandragon]

That kinda works, it would be like creating a constructs, a golem, but then again how can blood magic do this if it is a form of life magic.

The body requires blood for everything to work, but doesnt necessarily need a soul. Blood Magic returns blood to the body and starts the heart pumping which lets the rest of the body start working again as well, or the magic itself starts the flow of blood whether or not the heart works. Without a soul it's basically a flesh golem. The mind works to listen and follow orders and what not but doesn't have its own personality.

[DarionM]

Even light can resurrect the undead, so why blood can't? Calia Menethil is a good example.

[Piamonte]

Even light can resurrect the undead, so why blood can't? Calia Menethil is a good example.

We dont know what calia is, is pointless to talk about her until blizzard gives more information.

[WraithKingOstarion]

a tad off-topic... but i really, really really hope we get some more lore/flavor/even a class(?) that deals with blood magic.

i know we have Blood dk's but i don't think they are great examples of using blood magic? it's mostly just using necromancy to manipulate life force right? seeing that there is an actual art of blood magic (with the use of anima -- not the shadowlands version of it) that we saw in throne of thunder with the mogu... there is hope?

[WraithKingOstarion]

Seems kinda simple, no? You manipulate the blood within a corpse, like how a puppeteer uses strings?

Or am I missing something?

right that is the gist of it.
there hasn't been any real lore elaboration or fleshing out of it as a force/magic school/art or anything.

--On Draenor, the Bleeding Hollow clan was fond of using blood in their spells, including a ritual to create dire orcs and another to summon the powerful Blood Moon. They cut their own flesh, and Shadow Hunter Denjai described their magic as being like voodoo but hurting even more.

--To survive the harsh desert lands of Tanaris the Sandfury trolls learned the secrets of blood magic - drinking blood allowed them to access the darkest voodoo powers. Several troll tribes including the Sandfury, Vilebranch and Gurubashi could deploy a class of warriors called the "Blood Drinkers", which wore heavy armor, used two-handed weapons and could leech blood from their enemies. Drakuru also had his own Blood Drinkers, which he used in Zul'Drak in the name of the Scourge. Hakkar the Soulflayer, the Loa of Blood, grows stronger with blood he consumes. Blood trolls worship the blood god G'huun and use blood magic. This magic corrupts the creatures around them and turns them into blood beasts. Lorewalker Cho claims the Zandalari use blood magic, though the Zandalari themselves forbid it. This may be because of the proximity of the blood trolls to Zuldazar, or perhaps because of the Zandalari's historical fight against Hakkar. It is referred to as the old ways, and the Zandalari have only given in to the allure since Zuldazar's wall to the north fell.

--The modern death knights can also specialize in manipulating blood, giving them the ability to carve into their enemies, sustaining themselves with deadly sanguine strikes, while using the bloody, shattered remains of the dead to fortify their own defenses.

--The mogu were able flesh-shapers. They used a vital substance called Anima to empower their Blood golems.

--In Alterac Valley, Lokholar the Ice Lord was summoned through a blood ritual.

--Astalor Bloodsworn used blood magic to empower Blood Golems in Talador during the war in Draenor.

^that was taken from the "blood magic" page on wowpedia under the Users portion. it seems to be pretty all over the place in terms of how and why of practicing this vague art.

[The5thVegetable]

In regards to the nature of blood magic itself, I have a theory about that. If you look at dark shamanism, it's unique in that it's been described as being possible in different ways- you can bend the elements to your will using various forces, most notably Death and Void/Shadow magic. It might be the same with blood magic, with it being a form of life magic created through the interaction with another force- in this case, seemingly death or fel magic, though I wouldn't be surprised if it can be done through arcane magic as well (which I at least would assume is how the Mogu do it).

But in regards to the actual question- I agree with the idea of "flesh golems" that some people have mentioned. There's also Vampires/Darkfallen which obviously involve blood magic, but that looks to be specifically a combination of blood and death magic, so it's probably just necromancy in their case.

[Canirus]

Any thoughts?.

This is a silly fantasy game made up by people with little talent and no commitment to consistency, so nothing matters.

Do something that matters instead.

[Piamonte]

right that is the gist of it.
there hasn't been any real lore elaboration or fleshing out of it as a force/magic school/art or anything.



^that was taken from the "blood magic" page on wowpedia under the Users portion. it seems to be pretty all over the place in terms of how and why of practicing this vague art.

yeah it can be use for a lotof stuff, it seems related to both life and death magic and even fel,yet it doesnt appear in Chronicles or any other outside game source and we only know it through the users of blood magic we encounter in the game, is really weird and now with the Anima frm shadowlands its even weirder.

- - - Updated - - -

This is a silly fantasy game made up by people with little talent and no commitment to consistency, so nothing matters.

Do something that matters instead.

pls just go away, if you dont want to talk about lore you have no business in these forums.

[Lyssander]

I think that blood magic is somewhere in the middle of the whole life/death thing. Also, most schools of magic have some way of animating corpses anyway, it's not unique.

[Soon-TM]

Blood magic looks like it could be a corrupted version of life magic, akin to the corrupted druidic magic we can see in Val'sharah.

[Piamonte]

Blood magic looks like it could be a corrupted version of life magic, akin to the corrupted druidic magic we can see in Val'sharah.

What we see in valsharah is the night are, i dont think it holds any relation with blood magic.

[DarionM]

We dont know what calia is, is pointless to talk about her until blizzard gives more information.

If you don't know, what calia is, it doesn't mean that she is not an undead.

[Piamonte]

If you don't know, what calia is, it doesn't mean that she is not an undead.

she contradicts both chronicles and a dev Q&A, she cant be an undead considering the established lore, so yes, we need more information.

[Lyssander]

she contradicts both chronicles and a dev Q&A, she cant be an undead considering the established lore, so yes, we need more information.

What about her contradicts chronicles?

[Aucald]

she contradicts both chronicles and a dev Q&A, she cant be an undead considering the established lore, so yes, we need more information.

Calia doesn't really contradict anything - she's a new form of undead created in a new way is all. We've seen Void undead and Arcane undead now as well, in addition to the standard formula, so precedent strongly implies there are other means of creating undead beings.

[Piamonte]

Calia doesn't really contradict anything - she's a new form of undead created in a new way is all. We've seen Void undead and Arcane undead now as well, in addition to the standard formula, so precedent strongly implies there are other means of creating undead beings.

we havent seen void undead nor arcane undead, those are people using death magic or people creating golems.