Mega-Thread: Coronavirus Pandemic

[Krakan]

We maybe dooming people to their death for a vaccine that might not be effective. If the virus has sufficiently mutated to avoid the antibodies from the vaccine then those who are vaccinated may have a false sense of protection and may even encourage the spread of this new mutated form of the virus. The article said they took the gene that handles the spike protein from the new viruses and used it to modify a virus in the lab and tested that virus on 20 people who were vaccinated, with great success of course. To me that seems like they're trying to sweep this under the rug as much as possible. To make matters worse the UK government isn't giving everyone their second shot of the vaccine for what could be months. They're gambling that the first shot is enough. It's cheaper this way.

We're basically giving the virus selection pressure which could create a more dangerous version of the virus. Instead of waiting for enough vaccines to be made and giving everyone the vaccine all at once, instead we're trickling out this vaccine which may not be effective due to a mutation. This is how we have bacteria that are immune to all forms of antibiotics.

Just have the people at risk get the vaccine and advise them to follow quarantine procedures. It's the new seasonal flu at this point you can stomp your feet and pout and claim it's unfair but it's the reality of the situation. You can thank china and its " wet market" for this weirdly engineered virus if you want but it's time to move on.

The current weirdly annoying half measures taking precautions we know don't worry has become tedious and annoying. It's time to get on with life again.

[Forogil]

To me that seems like they're trying to sweep this under the rug as much as possible.

No, that is an indication they are doing science in the normal way.

To make matters worse the UK government isn't giving everyone their second shot of the vaccine for what could be months. They're gambling that the first shot is enough. It's cheaper this way.

There are various pros and cons for different ways of how to handle the different shots; when there is a severe shortage as at the moment.

We're basically giving the virus selection pressure which could create a more dangerous version of the virus. Instead of waiting for enough vaccines to be made and giving everyone the vaccine all at once, instead we're trickling out this vaccine which may not be effective due to a mutation. This is how we have bacteria that are immune to all forms of antibiotics.

Every time you try to kill something and is not 100% effective you also create an evolutionary pressure to become resistant to the same thing.

We also have normal viral drift for this disease - and it seems completely unlikely that everyone on earth will be vaccinated; and we don't know how long the vaccine will work anyway.

Antibiotic resistant bacteria is a bit different - one reason we got that is overuse of antibiotics; and another is that there is substantially more horizontal gene-transfer between different bacteria (so between bad bacteria and good gut-bacteria in humans and cows) than between different virus (although I would guess there's still substantially more than among plants and animals).

[Afrospinach]

A couple of months shut down might killing it off and into extinction. Nah got to get your hair, nails, and go bowling!!!!

It is a corona virus.

One of the features of this is it can infect animals quite easily hence having an animal reservoir. Covid-19 is here forever more than likely.

[Forogil]

One of the features of this is it can infect animals quite easily hence having an animal reservoir. Covid-19 is here forever more than likely.

Yes, and multiple animals - bats, minks, cats, ferrets, and possibly more; making it even more likely that we will get it again.

[Vash The Stampede]

Yes, and multiple animals - bats, minks, cats, ferrets, and possibly more; making it even more likely that we will get it again.

We may have to accept that this virus is now part of the norm and deal with it as best as we can. The vaccine may just slow it down and by summer the virus would be manageable like last summer. School and work from home should be a more permanent choice for those wanting to do it. Automating more of the industry would reduce human to human contact and thus reduce the transmission of the virus. A UBI should be put in place because unemployment is going to continue to be an issue. We also need to do something about the amount of people that are or are about to be homeless as a result of this crisis. Something more permanent and not just $600 and a delay to months of late rent payments. We can't assume that this virus will just go away now that we have a vaccine. We've had vaccines for influenza and it has never gone away. Even if America, Europe, Canada, and etc were to roll out a vaccine quickly, the virus will just mutate someplace else that doesn't have the vaccine, which can even be animals.

[Omega10]

We got a NYE/back to work/school surge coming in conjunction with the new variant.

Adapting to the pandemic should have happened months ago but it feels like society resets every month.

I try to not think about this. People are tired of the virus, but the virus is not tired of people.

[Edge-]

It's the new seasonal flu

According to whom? You keep repeating this, is this something doctors are actually saying or just something that sounds good to you in your head?

[PhaelixWW]

The article said they took the gene that handles the spike protein from the new viruses and used it to modify a virus in the lab and tested that virus on 20 people who were vaccinated, with great success of course. To me that seems like they're trying to sweep this under the rug as much as possible.

Wow. Your selective reading is truly astonishing.

I mean, I literally quoted to you the direct statements from the article that you, yourself linked.

Let's rewind:

I mean, from the article you linked:

In research posted online Thursday, scientists found that antibodies from people who had received the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine showed "no reduction in neutralization activity" against a version of the virus that carries the N501Y mutation, which they created in the lab.

In order to do this, researchers tested the virus against blood from 20 people who had received two doses of the vaccine as part of a clinical trial.

...

In a statement Friday, BioNTech said it and Pfizer "are encouraged by these early, in vitro study findings," but stressed that "further data are needed" to track the how effective the vaccine is at preventing disease caused by new variants.

So they tested it on people's blood in vitro, not in situ. Also, they never claimed that it "proved" anything yet.

- - - Updated - - -

Just have the people at risk get the vaccine and advise them to follow quarantine procedures. It's the new seasonal flu at this point you can stomp your feet and pout and claim it's unfair but it's the reality of the situation. You can thank china and its " wet market" for this weirdly engineered virus if you want but it's time to move on.

The current weirdly annoying half measures taking precautions we know don't worry has become tedious and annoying. It's time to get on with life again.

More science denial and conspiracy theories. Your bad takes continue to be boringly unoriginal.

[Krakan]

According to whom? You keep repeating this, is this something doctors are actually saying or just something that sounds good to you in your head?

I'm repeating it because it keeps being shown to true as each new desperate attempt to turn back the clock to when we had a chance of containing this failed.

We are in essence simply praying for devine intervention at this point it's time to approach this in a mature and reasonable manner. It isnt going away if your in a at risk group take the precautions you can and then go about your life.

[PhaelixWW]

I'm repeating it because it keeps being shown to true as each new desperate attempt to turn back the clock to when we had a chance of containing this failed.

We are in essence simply praying for devine intervention at this point it's time to approach this in a mature and reasonable manner. It isnt going away if your in a at risk group take the precautions you can and then go about your life.

Repeating a thing over and over again does not make it true.

Are you aware of the definition of insanity?

[Edge-]

I'm repeating it because it keeps being shown to true as each new desperate attempt to turn back the clock to when we had a chance of containing this failed.

So in the opinion of Kraken, of MMO-Champion, random internet poster.

Gotcha.

We are in essence simply praying for devine intervention at this point it's time to approach this in a mature and reasonable manner. It isnt going away if your in a at risk group take the precautions you can and then go about your life.

You say "praying for divine intervention", I say, "being greatful for the amazing, incredible work of doctors and researchers who created a vaccine in record time and continue to study the virus for better ways to treat patients and prevent its spread."

You say potayto, I say potahto, I guess.

This is being approached in a mature and reasonable manner, you're just here doomsaying left and right based off of some odd feeling in your gut or something.

[Vash The Stampede]

Wow. Your selective reading is truly astonishing.

I mean, I literally quoted to you the direct statements from the article that you, yourself linked.

Let's rewind:


- - - Updated - - -


More science denial and conspiracy theories. Your bad takes continue to be boringly unoriginal.

There's a reason why I avoid your comment the first time, because it's stupid. They will always say something so they aren't liable or held to their word. There's always a need for further data. They should get a clinical trial of more than 20 people and actually use the virus and not something they modified before saying anything, because this just sounds like PR damage control.

[Edge-]

because this just sounds like PR damage control.

As a PR person who has had to do damage control, this ain't fuckin it. This is pretty standard shit.

[PhaelixWW]

There's a reason why I avoid your comment the first time, because it's stupid. They will always say something so they aren't liable or held to their word. There's always a need for further data. They should get a clinical trial of more than 20 people and actually use the virus and not something they modified before saying anything, because this just sounds like PR damage control.

Your lack of understanding of the scientific process is embarrassing.

And what kind of argument is "sure, they said they'd continue, but we should absolutely not believe them!"

[Krakan]

As a PR person who has had to do damage control, this ain't fuckin it. This is pretty standard shit.

A rushed questionable vaccine with full liability written off isnt standard...

[Edge-]

A rushed questionable vaccine with full liability written off isnt standard...

Man, can you just stop dancing around the topic and just come out and say it?

Do you believe in science and the work of the doctors and researchers or not? Stop playing coy and just come out with it.

[PhaelixWW]

A rushed questionable vaccine with full liability written off isnt standard...

None of that statement was really very true.

[Forogil]

There's a reason why I avoid your comment the first time, because it's stupid. They will always say something so they aren't liable or held to their word. There's always a need for further data. They should get a clinical trial of more than 20 people and actually use the virus and not something they modified before saying anything, because this just sounds like PR damage control.

It seems you missed the point of it:

It seems they modified the original virus to get the new variant (well, almost - they didn't get all changes; but there are anyway multiple variants of the new variant) - which seems like a clever way of testing the relevant thing with available resources; as I don't think it's easy to manufacture a virus for testing that easily and using swabs from people seems unreliable - and possibly not easily available in Texas.

[Zan15]

A rushed questionable vaccine with full liability written off isnt standard...

A rushed - Wrong - An Expedited vaccine given priority in the entire pipeline is not "being rushed"

questionable vaccine- Wrong - Questionable by those whom do not understand it? What is questionable about it?

with full liability written off - Wrong - There is a process for compensation when there is liability.

[Vash The Stampede]

Man, can you just stop dancing around the topic and just come out and say it?

Do you believe in science and the work of the doctors and researchers or not? Stop playing coy and just come out with it.

Faith isn't science. One thing you miss understand here is that capitalism has a very different kind of science. One that sides with profits. Lead was used in products and was said to be safe until other scientists stepped in. Until more testing is done, we can't assume that the vaccine is safe and effective. Nothing wrong with a bit of skepticism.

As a PR person who has had to do damage control, this ain't fuckin it. This is pretty standard shit.

As someone who's seen bad PR control from others, this looks like it to me. Why say anything about testing it on 20 people? Why not do a proper clinical trial with a much larger group? Either this vaccine is so untested that 20 people is all they have, which is a concern either way, or they used a smell test group to make it look promising.