Mega-Thread: Coronavirus Pandemic

[Gorsameth]

800 people alone died in Italy yesterday and they've been in a tight quarantine for more than a week. Can you even imagine what would happen if a quarantine wasn't done?

The point of the quarantine isn't to eradicate the virus. It's to make sure that thousands upon thousands of people if not even millions of people flood the hospitals in need of intensive care.

I have no words to describe people like you, it's honestly embarrassing that you managed to dis-inform yourself by reading a valid piece of information.

Editing doesn't help. If you have any shame you should be deleting all the garbage posts.

What would have happened in Italy without a quarantine? The same thing because incubation times means that you won't see the effect of any measures taken right away.

The quarantine should stop it from growing worse and worse some time in the future, but has had little effect on what has happened sofar. Which is why countries take measures before things truly go bad. Because you need to account for incubation lag time.

[Shadowferal]

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/ar...onavirus-cases China Scrambles to Curb Rise in Imported Coronavirus Cases, Wuhan Eases Lockdown

[Acidbaron]

What have happened in Italy without a quarantine? The same thing because incubation times means that you won't see the effect of any measures taken right away.

The quarantine should stop it from growing worse and worse some time in the future, but has had little effect on what has happened sofar. Which is why countries take measures before things truly go bad. Because you need to account for incubation lag time.

It has actually been said if Italy had it in effect sooner and people followed it up better (what is still not the case now). This could have been prevented, Italy is the reason we are all not fucking around.

[Inuyaki]

Because they are still getting new cases.
The reason why you don't understand simple English is it conflicts with what you posted and like so many you only want to see agreement.

Okay, trolling it is indeed, I see...

You post something completely irrelevant. You actually SUPPORT my argument. But I guess you didn't realize that
If China gets cases from outside, that even means less of the new cases are from local transmissions, so the lockdown seems to work even better than I initially thought

[Shadowferal]

Okay, trolling it is indeed, I see... t

And my link above says China is still getting new cases which contradicts your claim. So moving along...

[Inuyaki]

And my link above says China is still getting new cases which contradicts your claim. So moving along...

Okay, someone here help me out with his thought process...

Me: In China the lockdown massively reduced the number of new cases
Him: In China the lockdown didn't work
Me: But the number of new cases decreased by a lot over the last few weeks, barely any new cases
Him: But China got new cases by getting people back into the country

[Benggaul]

Yeah we had to put big ass containers on border roads to stop you guys from entering, some people are still doing so on bikes though...

Hey now, I'm not a native Nederlander. I actually listen to rules.

[noremorze]

Good thing, they adjusted the text on the liveblog. It now says a lockdown is not enough. Should have done that from the start before making me look like a complete idiot.

For anyone who can read Dutch it changed from:
WHO: lockdown helpt niet
Het heeft geen zin om een lockdown in te stellen, stelt de Wereldgezondheidsorganisatie (WHO). Crisisexpert Mike Ryan van de WHO zegt tegen de BBC dat het belangrijk is om maatregelen op het gebied van de volksgezondheid te nemen om te voorkomen dat er later een nieuwe piek van besmettingen ontstaat.

"We moeten ons richten op het opsporen van mensen die ziek zijn en ze isoleren. Daarna moeten we achterhalen met wie ze in contact hebben gestaan en ook die mensen isoleren", zegt Ryan. "Het nadeel van lockdowns is dat het gevaar bestaat dat het virus meteen weer opduikt als de strenge gebiedsverboden worden opgeheven."

into:

WHO: lockdown is niet genoeg
Een lockdown instellen is niet genoeg om het coronavirus tegen te gaan, stelt de Wereldgezondheidsorganisatie (WHO). Crisisexpert Mike Ryan van de WHO zegt tegen de BBC dat het belangrijk is om maatregelen op het gebied van de volksgezondheid te nemen om te voorkomen dat er later een nieuwe piek van besmettingen ontstaat.

"We moeten ons richten op het opsporen van mensen die ziek zijn en ze isoleren. Daarna moeten we achterhalen met wie ze in contact hebben gestaan en ook die mensen isoleren", zegt Ryan. "Het nadeel van lockdowns is dat het gevaar bestaat dat het virus meteen weer opduikt als de strenge gebiedsverboden worden opgeheven."

[beanman12345]

Okay, someone here help me out with his thought process...

Me: In China the lockdown massively reduced the number of new cases
Him: In China the lockdown didn't work
Me: But the number of new cases decreased by a lot over the last few weeks, barely any new cases
Him: But China got new cases by getting people back into the country

Dude needs an intro to logic class.

[tikcol]

What would have happened in Italy without a quarantine? The same thing because incubation times means that you won't see the effect of any measures taken right away.

How dense do you have to be really to think just because there's an incubation period that a quarantine isn't helping in giving hospitals more breathing room?

At the time of the decree, over 5,800 cases of coronavirus had been confirmed in Italy, with 233 dead. Lockdown started in the 8th of March, more than 2 weeks ago. How many cases do you think you would have right now if they didn't go to lockdown?

What would have happened in Italy without a quarantine? The same thing

Not even close. You would have hundreds of thousands of confirmed infections without any kind of quarantine and the hospitals wouldn't be on the verge of collapse. They would be 50% hospital, 50% morgue.

[Inuyaki]

@Acidbaron
NRW (the German state) announced a few minutes ago some new rules.
* Not more than 2 people (in accordance with the general country wide plans)
* Restaurants, hairdressers, etc completely closed.
* You only are allowed to leave the house for important reasons (work, medical reasons, groceries)

Fines go up to 25000€
That is a lot O_O

[Acidbaron]

@Acidbaron
NRW (the German state) announced a few minutes ago some new rules.
* Not more than 2 people (in accordance with the general country wide plans)
* Restaurants, hairdressers, etc completely closed.
* You only are allowed to leave the house for important reasons (work, medical reasons, groceries)

Fines go up to 25000€
That is a lot O_O

Same as here then, fine here is lower 4K but can also be in addition to 3 months of jail. That amount appears to be closer to what i heard in other nations.

It's a damn shame every country is jumping to the exact same hoops just days apart.

[Puupi]

@Acidbaron
NRW (the German state) announced a few minutes ago some new rules.
* Not more than 2 people (in accordance with the general country wide plans)
* Restaurants, hairdressers, etc completely closed.
* You only are allowed to leave the house for important reasons (work, medical reasons, groceries)

Fines go up to 25000€
That is a lot O_O

I hope Finland does that as well asap.

Also we should close the outgoing traffic from Uusimaa (the Helsinki region province).

[Tuor]

Same as here then, fine here is lower 4K but can also be in addition to 3 months of jail. That amount appears to be closer to what i heard in other nations.

It's a damn shame every country is jumping to the exact same hoops just days apart.

Here in Portugal all of those that have been ordered a mandatory quarantene and get out of their homes can get 1 year jail time (convertible in 120 days fine) and police has orders to use peper sprays and taser weapons to stop them a sent them back to their quarantene isolation.

[Gaidax]

You can fuck off with that bullshit, because that's not even close to what I said or meant. People should take this more seriously and people should listen and act on all the advice of social distancing, I keep posting that same advice on my FB every fucking day. And I'm even advocating for even more measures because people still don't listen.

The point I was trying to make, and seems I have failed, was that this is the exact same thing our Goverment was saying. There were right wing populist parties screaming to go into a 14 day lockdown, which alone doesn't solve anything. The moment you lift it, it will most likely start again. I will admit that my opening sentence is wrong after having read that article. Nowhere does he say that it doesn't work, but he also doesn't say that it's needed. I blame my newschannel for that though, this is literally what they posted (translated):


WHO: lockdown does not help
It makes no sense to set a lockdown, says the World Health Organization (WHO). WHO crisis expert Mike Ryan tells the BBC that it is important to take public health measures to avoid a new spike of infections later on.

Of course it bloody helps.

What you do with lockdown is giving your healthcare system time to process the incoming cases. When Coronavirus patients get appropriate medical care, they are making it, despite there not being an actual effective cure yet. On the other hand if you overwhelm healthcare system - you get same shit that is going in Italy, where they simply are forced to decide 60+ to let go, because they can't treat everyone.

What a character...

[Inuyaki]

Same as here then, fine here is lower 4K but can also be in addition to 3 months of jail. That amount appears to be closer to what i heard in other nations.

Seems they really want to scare people. That 25k is for small offences it seems. He said they will prosecute for serious offences. No idea where they draw the line.
We will see how that works out. NRW is pretty big after all (bigger than the Netherlands for example) with a lot of big cities. And also in general a lot of idiots. So I guess the scare tactic is necessary.


PS also btw 25 billion in help for companies and people. Surprising, our government is pretty stingy normally

Edit
for reference for US people. NRW has 18 million people, so only 4 states are bigger (California, Texas and Florida and New York by only a bit)
I guess, this will come to you in a few days, too.

[Gorsameth]

How dense do you have to be really to think just because there's an incubation period that a quarantine isn't helping in giving hospitals more breathing room?

At the time of the decree, over 5,800 cases of coronavirus had been confirmed in Italy, with 233 dead. Lockdown started in the 8th of March, more than 2 weeks ago. How many cases do you think you would have right now if they didn't go to lockdown?



Not even close. You would have hundreds of thousands of confirmed infections without any kind of quarantine and the hospitals wouldn't be on the verge of collapse. They would be 50% hospital, 50% morgue.

If Italy's curve has not started flattening then the effect of the quarantine hasn't kicked in yet or it has no effect.

Ofcourse the quarantine is going to have an effect in the future by flattening the curve, and its good that Italy did it eventually. But sofar the numbers haven't shown an effect yet.

[noremorze]

Of course it bloody helps.

What you do with lockdown is giving your healthcare system time to process the incoming cases. When Coronavirus patients get appropriate medical care, they are making it, despite there not being an actual effective cure yet. On the other hand if you overwhelm healthcare system - you get same shit that is going in Italy, where they simply are forced to decide 60+ to let go, because they can't treat everyone.

What a character...

How many times do I have to repeat myself, I was wrong after having read that article about that a lockdown doesn't work. It literally was on our newschannel that "WHO: lockdown does not help
It makes no sense to set a lockdown, says the World Health Organization (WHO)."

That's where my initial post came from. One would assume that the number 1 newsstation get their translation right. After having read the article, for the 100th time, what was posted at first on the newschannel was wrong and once more, I was wrong.

At least I have the decency to admit I was wrong about something.

[Acidbaron]

Seems they really want to scare people. That 25k is for small offences it seems. He said they will prosecute for serious offences. No idea where they draw the line.
We will see how that works out. NRW is pretty big after all (bigger than the Netherlands for example) with a lot of big cities. And also in general a lot of idiots. So I guess the scare tactic is necessary.


PS also btw 25 billion in help for companies and people. Surprising, our government is pretty stingy normally

They have to scare people as everything else failed, people won't listen otherwise. Hitting people financially always works and it has to be high because those who have a lot should also be deterred from leading by example.

Governments are calculating how much it would cost them if they let these companies go under and having to support the unemployed while helping rebuild those industries. It is easier to recover debt if everything can start again as close to how the situation was before, this also also creates stability and trust to investors that European nations need to grow.

It simply makes sense, nobody wants to end up in a depression. These are acceptable debts being created. For how long they will all do this i don't know but at least till early may they are going to help people.

- - - Updated - - -

If Italy's curve has not started flattening then the effect of the quarantine hasn't kicked in yet or it has no effect.

Ofcourse the quarantine is going to have an effect in the future by flattening the curve, and its good that Italy did it eventually. But sofar the numbers haven't shown an effect yet.

Optimists have said it would take at least two weeks to see any impact, take note that there are still reports coming out of Italy from people not following these measures and going about as usual. It only works if as good as everyone complies.

Personally i can't believe they are still making the same mistake as they did weeks ago. But could also be out of necessity, although people going out for football (training has been restarted for some first division clubs...) and walks in groups are not part of that.

[Benggaul]

How many times do I have to repeat myself, I was wrong after having read that article about that a lockdown doesn't work. It literally was on our newschannel that "WHO: lockdown does not help
It makes no sense to set a lockdown, says the World Health Organization (WHO)."

That's where my initial post came from. After having read the article, for the 100th time, what was posted at first on the newschannel was wrong and once more, I was wrong.

At least I have the decency to admit I was wrong about something, so take your pathetic insults somewhere else.

As I've discovered myself recently, this thread moves very fast and it's likely they haven't caught up on the several pages worth of posts after you posted that, so just take the hit and know that they'll see the correction later and likely apologize. Or not. It's just a game forum.