[TV] Disney+ Star Wars: Obi-Wan Kenobi

[s_bushido]

So if you don't think they wrote it going in as "we need a black woman for this", then do you think they wrote one thing, ended up casting a black woman, and then went "we gotta rewrite this for angry black girl, stat"?

The fuck are you even talking about. There's literally nothing about her character that has anything to do with her skin color. She could be blue, for all it matters.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

So if you don't think they wrote it going in as "we need a black woman for this", then do you think they wrote one thing, ended up casting a black woman, and then went "we gotta rewrite this for angry black girl, stat"?

Might just be a confluence of things here, rather than intent.

No I don't think any rewriting would be done post casting.

I think they wrote a generic Sith got a actor who did well in that role and it's just fan's who are coming to the "angry black girl" bit. If they had the exact same actor but had them covered up to be an alien so people didn't know they were black at a glance or if the actor was a white dude(might be different for a woman) and acted the same I think most people would just say she fit's the Sith mold.

[Biomega]

I think they wrote a generic Sith got a actor who did well in that role and it's just fan's who are coming to the "angry black girl" bit.

That makes sense, then.

Sith certainly tend to fall easily into stereotypes because they're extreme characters by nature. I guess it's just unfortunate things lined up the way they did. It's gonna fuel some crazy comments.

[RyanEX]

A minor thing that annoys the me to no end.

It is a minor spoiler.

The 3rd Sister calling Vader Anakin Skywalker. No, I do not like it at all. Vader at this point should be treating Anakin Skywalker as dead. There is no reason or way the 3rd Sister would know Vader is Anakin.

I was more shocked that she remained alive with the disrespect she kept showing the Grand Inquisitor. Should've force choked a bitch to remind her who was in charge.

[Ayirasi]

The only other role I saw Moses Ingram play was whatsherface in The Queen's Gambit, and I don't recall her being this terrible.

[PACOX]

That's the main complaint for me, too. It's just way too ham-fisted, stilted, and cringe. We all know Sith range from sadistic puppet master to outright psychotic maniac, but that doesn't mean you have to make them into a corny mockery when playing Sith.

Brooding on a rooftop, Batman-style? With the pose and the look and everything? Come on.

To characterize the Inquisitors aren't Sith. They are like underfed chihuahuas that the Sith exploit. Edgy nooks. The Sith see the Inquisitors as lowly wannabes with no self worth. Sith are weird themselves, Palpatine abuses Vader to make him stronger. Vader abusers the Inquisitors simply because he doesn't like them.

- - - Updated - - -

Outside of the surname of "Antilles", there are no other named surnames that are beyond just one family we see in movies.

It isn't surprising given the number of surnames that are confirmed, we can't determine how common any surname is.

And we know at least 2 unrelated Antilles. There is Wedge, Bail, and Raymus. Wedge is unrelated to Raymus. And we do not know if Bail is related to Raymus or Wedge in anyway. Bail doesn't appear to my knowledge, just mentioned in Episode I.

Outside of Antilles, I don't know if there is another surname that is repeated (at least in the movies).

The 'Skywalker' thing definitely came from an interview or something. Of course I can't find it, though.

[Biomega]

To characterize the Inquisitors aren't Sith. They are like underfed chihuahuas that the Sith exploit. Edgy nooks. The Sith see the Inquisitors as lowly wannabes with no self worth. Sith are weird themselves, Palpatine abuses Vader to make him stronger. Vader abusers the Inquisitors simply because he doesn't like them.

I mean, potato potato. Whether or not they're Sith in name, they're edgy dark-side force users that fall well within the established Sith character spectrum. Depending on what material you're looking at you have little whiny wannabe Sith just as you have the megalomaniac super powerful Sith lords. It doesn't really matter for the acting critique offered here.

[PACOX]

I mean, potato potato. Whether or not they're Sith in name, they're edgy dark-side force users that fall well within the established Sith character spectrum. Depending on what material you're looking at you have little whiny wannabe Sith just as you have the megalomaniac super powerful Sith lords. It doesn't really matter for the acting critique offered here.

Sith are supposed to be more confident and disciplined in their actions. They have their code, training, blah, blah. Inquisitors are mall cops in very expensive uniforms. Some marginally talented force-sensitives the Empire rounded up and tossed around until they had Stockholm Syndrome.

Reva acts the same way they act in every story they are in.

You can't expect them to be something they are not m to be. Obviously viewers might elevate the Inquisitors if they have never seen them before, though.

[Biomega]

You can't expect them to be something they are not m to be. Obviously viewers might elevate the Inquisitors if they have never seen them before, though.

How does that matter for people complaining the acting is bad?

[PACOX]

How does that matter for people complaining the acting is bad?

Because most of the comments aren't about bad acting but how the character is written? The character is written in a way that Inquisitors have portrayed for a long time at this point.

[RyanEX]

I mean, potato potato. Whether or not they're Sith in name, they're edgy dark-side force users that fall well within the established Sith character spectrum. Depending on what material you're looking at you have little whiny wannabe Sith just as you have the megalomaniac super powerful Sith lords. It doesn't really matter for the acting critique offered here.

I feel Inquisitors were a way to get around the "only ever two" rule of the Sith. Since they clearly have Dark side powers but are not recognized as full fledged Sith. Or maybe so Palps can constantly keep Vader on his toes thinking that one them might be used to replace him. Which is what made this Inquisitor so eye rollingly unbearable.

You expect Sith to plot against one another, but they still play the roll of obedient underling. Openly sassing your superior got you the wrong end of a lightsaber.

[Biomega]

Because most of the comments aren't about bad acting but how the character is written? The character is written in a way that Inquisitors have portrayed for a long time at this point.

That's a separate critique. Bad writing is one thing; bad acting is another. The two are related for sure, and it's sometimes hard to tell them apart - but it's totally legitimate to criticize just someone's acting.

I feel Inquisitors were a way to get around the "only ever two" rule of the Sith.

Possibly. The Rule of Two is high up on the list of stupidest world-building ideas of all time. It hobbles so much story development for basically no reason.

Funnily enough, when I first saw the movie and heard the quote I thought it was more about "there's always an apprentice behind a master (and vice versa), so don't think that just cause you defeated one you're done" than "there's only ever two Sith in the entire universe, period". Which seemed incredibly dumb to me. Because it is.

[Adamas102]

She probably blames Obi for the slaughter that happened at the temple because he’s the one that trained/raised Anakin.

I can see this making sense if capturing Kenobi is actually part of a plan to get close enough to Vader to make an attempt on his life (if she blames Kenobi for the attack on the temple she should blame Anakin/Vader even more).

[Very Tired]

Because most of the comments aren't about bad acting but how the character is written? The character is written in a way that Inquisitors have portrayed for a long time at this point.

I have no problem with the writing and lines that are being said, just the mannerisms and delivery in how they are being said. The biggest complaint I'm mostly seeing from Reddit is she looks like she's trying to be threatening and badass, but with her said delivery it just comes across as part cringe.

Another example in the second episode chase sequence, they show her doing a completely unnecessary backflip jump. That one isn't on the actress though, just the horrible directors.

[Polyxo]

Watched the first two episodes. The first chase with Leia was silly. The second one wasn't so bad, it was prolonged because Obi Wan was plausibly trying to not draw a lot of attention and walk along inconspicuously. Space Tokyo or wherever they were was a really cool place. The actress playing Leia is great, and she reminds me a lot of Matilda/90s Miracle on 34th Street girl. I don't mind the inquisitor girl as much as other people do. She seems like she's driven by some thing that we haven't seen yet that will make her aggression make more sense. I also hope they deal more with Obi Wan's PTSD and survivor's guilt.

[Elim Garak]

You think that if she wasn't black if they had gotten a white guy or an alien they would drop the short tempered glory hungry architype? Because that's all her being the "angry black woman" stereotype comes down to, there is nothing unique with her portrayal it's something any other actor could do and something you see all the time in old republic media.

If she wasn't black no one would've saw the angry black woman stereotype, yes. That's why writing and casting should consult each other. If they care about that sorta thing. But they probably couldn't just say "don't cast black women for this role" - that would've been racist somehow.

And we have three other inquisitors on scene, including an alien female. They don't act like her even though they are as Sith as she is. In fact I personally liked that alien female inquisitor more. Probably because she didn't had many lines and I just judged her demeanor.

[Kyphael]

Just finished Part II and love the series so far, everything about it. The opening re-capping Episodes I-III, all the way to the little firecracker playing Leia. Great casting there. I was confused as hell Obi-Wan didn't know Vader/Anakin survived, though. I mean, I know hiding on Tatooine means he likely has no way to keep up with what's going on, and Anakin's fate/Vader's identity isn't likely common knowledge, and him not using the force likely means he can't sense Vader, so if he didn't know after 10 years, odds are Yoda doesn't know, which means Yoda will most likely find out in this series because by the time Empire Strikes Back rolls around, Yoda does know Vader/Anakin is alive and is training Luke to stop him.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

If she wasn't black no one would've saw the angry black woman stereotype, yes. That's why writing and casting should consult each other. If they care about that sorta thing. But they probably couldn't just say "don't cast black women for this role" - that would've been racist somehow.

And we have three other inquisitors on scene, including an alien female. They don't act like her even though they are as Sith as she is. In fact I personally liked that alien female inquisitor more. Probably because she didn't had many lines and I just judged her demeanor.

Yes people wouldn’t see the stereotype but nothing about the character would have to be changed for her to still perfectly fit the Sith mold, so the question is should actors be excluded solely because of there race/sex even if they play the intended roll well just so some fans won’t stereotype them.

And ya the other inquisitors don’t act the same but the Sith aren’t nearly as one note that you’d expect them all to be the same. Even in the smaller Disney canon there is quite a bit of variation on Sith and while the 3rd sister might be closer to some old EU Sith then current canon Sith she’s not at all out of place.

[DingDongKing]

Just finished Part II and love the series so far, everything about it. The opening re-capping Episodes I-III, all the way to the little firecracker playing Leia. Great casting there. I was confused as hell Obi-Wan didn't know Vader/Anakin survived, though. I mean, I know hiding on Tatooine means he likely has no way to keep up with what's going on, and Anakin's fate/Vader's identity isn't likely common knowledge, and him not using the force likely means he can't sense Vader, so if he didn't know after 10 years, odds are Yoda doesn't know, which means Yoda will most likely find out in this series because by the time Empire Strikes Back rolls around, Yoda does know Vader/Anakin is alive and is training Luke to stop him.

I think it’s more not hearing information. Because I’m sure if he hears the name Darth Vader, he will know it’s Anakin. What’s mental about this series, like the prequels, is that there’s still disbelief even for me that Anakin Skywalker became Darth Vader. All the issues with the prequels aside, that turn is still the highlight for me. As a viewer I wanted to know what could’ve been done to stop it, and that’s a great place to be in.

[Otaka]

The Rule of Two is high up on the list of stupidest world-building ideas of all time. It hobbles so much story development for basically no reason.

Funnily enough, when I first saw the movie and heard the quote I thought it was more about "there's always an apprentice behind a master (and vice versa), so don't think that just cause you defeated one you're done" than "there's only ever two Sith in the entire universe, period". Which seemed incredibly dumb to me. Because it is.

I disagree, also you seem to think rule of two is a writing rule rather than in-universe rule. Which it isnt.
You also forget that a sith lord is merely a title, one can be just as powerful even if they dont get recognized formally by the active lords. Its just not very likely since the sith pass their training onto their apprentices and are thus powerful.

If you know anything about sith-history then you would know having hundreds of them around only leads to anarchy and nothing gets done, a sith order the size of jedi order would only destroy itself from the inside out...

Besides the rule of two provides good plotlines you wouldnt have otherwise... what if someone breaks it? its been broken several times in the lore and that always leads to interesting situations and adventures.
Also sith under the rule have been way more effective than without, see what palpatine managed to do.

Starting a sith academy or an empire would actually be the stupidest idea considering how numerous the jedi are... it wouldve been dismantled very quickly.

The quote you heard was told by a jedi... dont you remember what the jedi were described by others? pragmatic.
So it would be wise not to take in-lore dialogue as a stated fact, its spoken by a character after all... and characters in stories dont know what we know nor will they decide the truth, they are only there to serve a story, the writers decide what happens and whats true or not... thats how we get unexpected plot twists.