Does anyone else feel this tier was just....

[Lucetia]

W-H-O-A

People are arguing that P2W is not really pay-to-win, BECAUSE all others are doing it?
Hell, have any of you played a mobile P2W game? There are usually a handful of people SINKING all their money into the game to be 1st on some ladder.

Typically "pay to win" means you spend cash to purchase in game advantages. Buying the BoE gear for gold doesn't exactly qualify as this and even then they borrowed gold from other guilds to buy the BoE's so they didn't spend cash. You could argue well gold token for cash is in-game, but its highly unlikely they used those since they said they were in debt to others (ie guilds/donors).

What you are arguing about is gear being bought and that's like saying they shouldn't be able to use consumables, enchants, gear, etc because it's "p2w"

[Alphatorg]

Dang! You're right. I forgot that wasn't allowed in conversations like this.



Because you are looking at it from the wrong perspective. Let's assume corruption didn't exist to make the comparison exist and go to previous Titanforging. You are just looking and go "I could get full 485 gear from WQ and call it a day". Which you see a problem, but that isn't the case. WQ have a chance to be upgrades, but doesn't mean it is. The amount of people who get high titanforges from world quests, dungeons, etc are pretty slim. Except we see others get it and consider it the norm. If you want high level gear guaranteed then raiding accomplishes that. You get a specific item level no matter what. So if you want 485's you know you will need to raid Mythic and if something drops then it's at that level. Doing a world quest you get a specific ilvl of 410-420, but it has a chance of going higher. Doesn't mean it is guaranteed and you don't do the quest because "it'll titanforge to a 485 or whatever".

You do it for a chance, but there is no guarantee. This is what made the system great. It gave you an incentive to go out and do the world quest that you would otherwise ignore. If you get an upgrade then great, maybe it's a replacement since you would have to roll many times for it to go from 420-485. Same concept if a heroic raider goes and helps out friends in LFR. You don't go in there looking for upgrades, but if you get one through titanforging than it is good and you feel like you were rewarded.

The whole point is people go "OMG you can get the same ilvl as I do from raiding for doing world quests unfair!!!&^*!@" When in reality the chance is slim and incentives to help keep older content alive and give you more options than just logging on raiding and being done.

There's a reason you wouldn't do WQs without incentives. It's because you've already done each of them hundreds of times, because they pose no challenge, because they are just brainless busy work. Mythic raiders are already heavily committed to the game, they have their guilds and their enjoyment of raids (more often than not also M+ or arena) tying them to WoW. Forcing them to do chore quests that really are beneath any person with more than two brain cells does nothing but burn them out eventually. I've lost count on how many people who greatly enjoyed raiding I've seen quit since Legion, because they were forced by Blizzard's design to play every evening after work.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

This is how the whole race has been for years now. Its just a lot more exposed now. Guilds willing to take advantage of systems that certainly can have real world money costs tied to them often will use and abuse the systems for advantages. I mean I doubt when Blizzard first came up with the idea of realm xfers the idea was guilds going around EVERY server in a region buying ALL the BoEs you possibly could dozens of times over. Hell on my medium pop server prices spike because people know Limit people will be AH probing the whole NA market. That seems a little nuts if you ask me.

[Daymanmb]

Typically "pay to win" means you spend cash to purchase in game advantages. Buying the BoE gear for gold doesn't exactly qualify as this and even then they borrowed gold from other guilds to buy the BoE's so they didn't spend cash. You could argue well gold token for cash is in-game, but its highly unlikely they used those since they said they were in debt to others (ie guilds/donors).

What you are arguing about is gear being bought and that's like saying they shouldn't be able to use consumables, enchants, gear, etc because it's "p2w"

You dont think anyone spent any real money on tokens for the corrupted boes, or you dont think Method did specifically?

[Penegal]

Are people serious? WF guilds have been buying BoE items since the dawn of time. Just because they got obscenely expensive now means jack shit. They used to buy TF, socketed gear in the previous patches, no one batted an eye simply because they couldn't ask such a big price because of the difference in DPS. All corruption did was make some a much bigger upgrade than others, regardless of iLvl.