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  1. #61
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    This just goes to show that generalizing exists in all versions of the game.

    Try to get rank 14: Yep..you have to be serious about Classic
    Racing for Mythic World first: Yep...you have to be serious about Retail

    Anecdotal evidence that you encounter don't mean everyone does it. So the answer probably should be "Who knows?"

  2. #62
    I play classic exclusively and even I don't understand classic players.

    The amount of players min/maxing and putting insane effort/time in Classic is just baffling me.
    Especially since it is not necessary at all for the current content (except for tanks since both threat and survival are a big deal).
    People are min/maxing so hard on Classic it is impossible to farm herbs/orbs in the open world and consumable/enchanting prices on AH are insane.
    I saw an old thread where a Black Lotus (for flasks) went for 6 gold 15 years ago. Now its 150 gold. One flask is 350g (3 flasks is epic mount basically).


    I am in one of the most casual guilds on the realm yet everyone spends like 200g to 500g on consumables every raid night, instantly enchants their gear with the best enchants (costs 100 gold easily) and comes to raids with full world buffs (Org buffs, DM buffs, Songflowers, Darkmoon Faire, Juju's and god knows what more they find). Heck there are so many people in Orgrimmar around 18:00 for the world buffs the whole zone lags out and crashes.

    Why do they do it?
    I don't even know. They don't even care about ranks, don't even check logs.

    I've been tempted a few times to try out retail again and go for a cutting edge N'zoth kill (was in a world 500 guild) since the mythic raids are better and more challenging. Though honestly threat control and holding back dps seems to be particularly hard and challenging for many players haha. Was especially tempted when we only did MC for 90min a week in Classic. But with BWL out now I had so much fun. Killing stuff and the small chances of getting really good loot to drop feels so much more rewarding than in retail. So I guess I will pass up a N'zoth kill and dedicate more time to Classic. Shame I don't have the time to commit to both.

  3. #63
    It's possible they do. I mean you really have to start by acknowledging that people that play classic decided to go back and do it. They really want to be there with no strings attached.

    A lot of what keeps me grinding retail has to do with attachment. Getting my character I played for a decade to the new cap. Getting it some gear. Adding to the mount and pet collections. Increasing and making new mogs. Seeing the new raid. Getting those base achievements with it. So its doing something to get something often not tied to having fun more or less. We fail the achieve we want people just bail. Only reason they were there. Boss 2 drop the item 3 people want and it dies without it dropping? Bye.

    With my classic player when I log in and do something it's because I really want to do it. We running scholo? Cool I want to be there and the others do too. If I don't want to be there I am not. Nothing outside of being there is teasing me into there aside from a social one that I can accept or deny if someone asks.

    So saying "they are more/less serious" is probably a bad way to say it. But saying they are doing it more for the actual reasons the content exists for rather than a side reason or side effect to doing the content is probably true. So that may result in people doing the actual content a more focused.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Celestraza View Post
    I play classic exclusively and even I don't understand classic players.

    The amount of players min/maxing and putting insane effort/time in Classic is just baffling me.
    Especially since it is not necessary at all for the current content (except for tanks since both threat and survival are a big deal).
    People are min/maxing so hard on Classic it is impossible to farm herbs/orbs in the open world and consumable/enchanting prices on AH are insane.
    I saw an old thread where a Black Lotus (for flasks) went for 6 gold 15 years ago. Now its 150 gold. One flask is 350g (3 flasks is epic mount basically).


    I am in one of the most casual guilds on the realm yet everyone spends like 200g to 500g on consumables every raid night, instantly enchants their gear with the best enchants (costs 100 gold easily) and comes to raids with full world buffs (Org buffs, DM buffs, Songflowers, Darkmoon Faire, Juju's and god knows what more they find). Heck there are so many people in Orgrimmar around 18:00 for the world buffs the whole zone lags out and crashes.

    Why do they do it?
    I don't even know. They don't even care about ranks, don't even check logs.

    I've been tempted a few times to try out retail again and go for a cutting edge N'zoth kill (was in a world 500 guild) since the mythic raids are better and more challenging. Though honestly threat control and holding back dps seems to be particularly hard and challenging for many players haha. Was especially tempted when we only did MC for 90min a week in Classic. But with BWL out now I had so much fun. Killing stuff and the small chances of getting really good loot to drop feels so much more rewarding than in retail. So I guess I will pass up a N'zoth kill and dedicate more time to Classic. Shame I don't have the time to commit to both.
    Black lotus are so much more now because they are on a fixed spawn and very limited. Total amount of players per realm is way higher than it was in vanilla. That's why they are so much higher.

    If you know how to farm gold, 100g is 1-2 hours worth. Not much of a time investment for a piece you will most likely use for months.

    I dont go all out with buffs but my guild usually has a DM north trib instance ID rdy to go before raid. And t's easy to check your server discord for the ony buff. Having those 2 sets of buffs are super easy, plus a mongoose pot.

    A lot of players like to do it to flex on meters and check logs. I personally do it because when the whole raod does it, things go smoother, which means faster, which means more time for other activities and keeps guild morale high.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Some context:

    I did a huge pause on MMORPG's and made a comeback today with Classic.
    My experience was...peculiar...and very funny

    Decided to do Warsong Gulch as a level 55

    1) Everyone on the BG was either Orc or Undead

    2) Both enemy and friendly players were extremely focused and with tactics
    NOTE: I used to do Battlegrounds all day in current WoW...and "this" was nothing like it.
    In current WoW, is a complete crap show of people doing whatever.
    In this level 59 bracket...omg...everyone was so coordinated. WTF am i witnessing (i thought)

    3) Enemy players with macros to cross-faction talk and be toxic/funny

    4) Free Action Potions....yes...i saw levels 59 using FAP's

    Was expecting Derpy Derp players walking around warsong gulch and fighting mid...got into a fight with trained soldiers and mass murderers.
    Does anyone feel Classic players take the game more seriously? From your different experiences?
    How can they take it more seriously? There's almost nothing to even do in Classic vs Retail. Sure what there is to do takes more time but there is way less of it.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    How can they take it more seriously? There's almost nothing to even do in Classic vs Retail. Sure what there is to do takes more time but there is way less of it.
    I personally am level 57 (after taking a break after launch) and i do Battlegrounds while i get rested XP...and most importantly...farm gold.

    I have no idea on how to make gold at my level efficiently BUT i found a trick to make quick 20 gold by having enchant at level 1 and spaming Razorfen Kraul 5 times.

    Apart fromt that...maybe i will raid in the future? But right now...just doing battlegrounds and buying items from the auction house.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    How can they take it more seriously? There's almost nothing to even do in Classic vs Retail. Sure what there is to do takes more time but there is way less of it.
    Leveling takes ~8 days played depending on your speed. Pvp if that's your thing. Professions (levelling it up, getting rare recipes, making stuff to sell). Farming gold for epic mount to make sure your shits enchanted and to afford consumables each week for pvp or raid. Getting pre raid BiS. Molten core. Onyxia. BWL. Then repeat with alts. All of these to make your character stronger. I prefer it over retail because retail just feels like a collection game. Gotta collect achieves and pets and transmogs.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Leveling takes ~8 days played depending on your speed. Pvp if that's your thing. Professions (levelling it up, getting rare recipes, making stuff to sell). Farming gold for epic mount to make sure your shits enchanted and to afford consumables each week for pvp or raid. Getting pre raid BiS. Molten core. Onyxia. BWL. Then repeat with alts. All of these to make your character stronger. I prefer it over retail because retail just feels like a collection game. Gotta collect achieves and pets and transmogs.
    Well you dont have to collect anything but you hit it right on the nose, it comes down to preference. But having done both and original Vanilla theres way more to end progression now then there has ever been before.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    I find the cross-faction talking more funny than toxic tbh
    But man...everyone was so....prepared and focused. I was not expecting it.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Rated BG's?
    That is a normal place to be competitive. This was a low level random BG.
    TBH a twink BG in Classic and RBG in retail are very much comparable in terms of competitiveness.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Leveling takes ~8 days played depending on your speed. Pvp if that's your thing. Professions (levelling it up, getting rare recipes, making stuff to sell). Farming gold for epic mount to make sure your shits enchanted and to afford consumables each week for pvp or raid. Getting pre raid BiS. Molten core. Onyxia. BWL. Then repeat with alts. All of these to make your character stronger. I prefer it over retail because retail just feels like a collection game. Gotta collect achieves and pets and transmogs.
    It's kinda funny that basically everything you listed there you like about Classic exists just the same in retail. There's just insane amount of other stuff on top of that, like the achievements and pets and transmogs.

  10. #70
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post
    This just goes to show that generalizing exists in all versions of the game.

    Try to get rank 14: Yep..you have to be serious about Classic
    Racing for Mythic World first: Yep...you have to be serious about Retail

    Anecdotal evidence that you encounter don't mean everyone does it. So the answer probably should be "Who knows?"
    Dont you dare enter these chambers and try to reason!
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Well you dont have to collect anything but you hit it right on the nose, it comes down to preference. But having done both and original Vanilla theres way more to end progression now then there has ever been before.
    Ya its preference imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurwi View Post
    It's kinda funny that basically everything you listed there you like about Classic exists just the same in retail. There's just insane amount of other stuff on top of that, like the achievements and pets and transmogs.
    Ya I know that but the things j listed about classic, i much prefer doing them the way they are presented in classic. In retail, other players might as well be AI. I can hit a button to queue, instantly get teleported to a dungeon that takes 15 to 20 mins. If ppl arent go go going as much as i like i can vote to kick them and they will probably be replaced. If the first boss doesnt drop what I need I'll just drop group.

    In classic I gotta find a group. We gotta travel there and probably kill the other faction on the way. The dungeons will take around an hour. People stay the whole time. You have time to talk and get to know them some and learn about who's on your server. You say ty for group and head out.

    I'm not saying ones better than the other. But classic feels more like an MMORPG and that's what got me into it.

    The "insane amount of stuff" added on top just feels like filler to me. No one knows what gear anyone is in just by looking because of transmog. Pets dont do anything. Achieves are part of why I dont like the game. Do something to have fun, not for the achieve

  12. #72
    Classic minmaxing feels cool
    Retail minmaxing feels dumb and tryhard-ish
    Shadowlands is real world
    The Maw is China
    The Jailer is China government
    Sylvanas is Blizz

  13. #73
    Immortal TJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iosdeveloper View Post
    Classic minmaxing feels cool
    Retail minmaxing feels dumb and tryhard-ish
    Dunno about retail nowadays, but when I played it, it didn't feel as tryhard as Classic does. Things such as DM/Ony buffs, way more consumables, people logging out to preserve said buffs make it feel more tryhard to me.

    Sucks if you play a Hunter, since a lot of buffs don't actually "buff" you!! -_-

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ya I know that but the things j listed about classic, i much prefer doing them the way they are presented in classic. In retail, other players might as well be AI. I can hit a button to queue, instantly get teleported to a dungeon that takes 15 to 20 mins. If ppl arent go go going as much as i like i can vote to kick them and they will probably be replaced. If the first boss doesnt drop what I need I'll just drop group.

    In classic I gotta find a group. We gotta travel there and probably kill the other faction on the way. The dungeons will take around an hour. People stay the whole time. You have time to talk and get to know them some and learn about who's on your server. You say ty for group and head out.

    I'm not saying ones better than the other. But classic feels more like an MMORPG and that's what got me into it.

    The "insane amount of stuff" added on top just feels like filler to me. No one knows what gear anyone is in just by looking because of transmog. Pets dont do anything. Achieves are part of why I dont like the game. Do something to have fun, not for the achieve
    The best part about classic...and i 100% am not bullshitting here like some people want to say, is that "players" feel 100% more "alive".

    What do i mean?
    People communicate a lot more than in retail.

    I guess i need now to explain why...oh man...now i have to type a lot.

    Its basically because of server community/ server economy and how the game is designed to NOT be streamlined.
    Example, Warsong Gulch needs communication and team work, otherwise the games take HOURS! Yes, hours.
    The chat in Warsong Gulches is insane teamwork.

    You meet the same people and have an economy with the same people with professions and farming spots.

    You can ask for the help of a random warlock you meet in the world for a quick teleport of a team member.

    Just...game design at its best. Very oldschool stuff.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Some context:

    I did a huge pause on MMORPG's and made a comeback today with Classic.
    My experience was...peculiar...and very funny

    Decided to do Warsong Gulch as a level 55

    1) Everyone on the BG was either Orc or Undead

    2) Both enemy and friendly players were extremely focused and with tactics
    NOTE: I used to do Battlegrounds all day in current WoW...and "this" was nothing like it.
    In current WoW, is a complete crap show of people doing whatever.
    In this level 59 bracket...omg...everyone was so coordinated. WTF am i witnessing (i thought)

    3) Enemy players with macros to cross-faction talk and be toxic/funny

    4) Free Action Potions....yes...i saw levels 59 using FAP's

    Was expecting Derpy Derp players walking around warsong gulch and fighting mid...got into a fight with trained soldiers and mass murderers.
    Does anyone feel Classic players take the game more seriously? From your different experiences?
    In current WoW, the competitive players tend to play the competive modes (RBGs/Arenas). That doesn't exist in classic, so random BGs have more of those highly competitive players. Also, people not looking to play uber competitively and just jerk around a bit tend to flock to AV where their underperformance is less noticeable among the 40 man group.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    I don't get these tryhards on Classic either, tbh.

    1) It's just a nice distraction from Retail, the real game.
    2) It's difficulty is at LFR level, you can clear most of the raids in a full group of green geared people
    3) It's just meant to be chilled and taken as a casual experience, even the DPS rotations are 1-2 button spams allowing you to chit chat while casually on Discord while clearing every raidtear.
    MC I'd put at LFR level. Especially since you can power through it with any dps doing 0 mechanics. You also barely need to coordinate and setup is largely irrelevant. Trash mobs are also irrelevant.

    I'd put BWL at heroic raid level though. Even though the tanking in BWL seems a lot rougher than most fights on mythic retail since you have to improvise a bit with having to deal with constant taunt resists and threat issues. BWL is quite a step up from MC in every regard. And unlike LFR you don't get determination stacks to power through encounters but even if you do cheese BWL a bit by bringing 20 warriors/rogues you still need to handle some mechanics which imho are as punishable as heroic level mechanics on retail. Meaning it won't kill you instantly or wipe the raid instantly if you fail but it really hurts.

    I am actually wondering at the difficulty levels of AQ and Naxx compared to BWL.

  17. #77
    It's almost like people take the game more serious when their progression is actually based on their skill and commitment rather than handed out gear and RNG piled on top of RNG.

  18. #78
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    1) It's just a nice distraction from Retail, the real game.
    I mean, maybe.. but when I get bored of Classic, I personally dont play retail. Im sure Im not the only one.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    Dunno about retail nowadays, but when I played it, it didn't feel as tryhard as Classic does. Things such as DM/Ony buffs, way more consumables, people logging out to preserve said buffs make it feel more tryhard to me.

    Sucks if you play a Hunter, since a lot of buffs don't actually "buff" you!! -_-
    Imagine handing in dragonslayer buff to kill rag when you can practically afk and kill him anyway
    Imagine farming in felwood for hours for a boss with 2 mechanics

  20. #80
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kehego View Post
    Imagine handing in dragonslayer buff to kill rag when you can practically afk and kill him anyway
    Imagine farming in felwood for hours for a boss with 2 mechanics
    Imagine spending hours on an outside website simming your gear, every time you get a new piece it's the same, just different. At least one of the examples has you engaging in the actual game.
    Last edited by Eugenik; 2020-02-22 at 05:40 PM.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

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