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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Nullp0inter View Post
    I like the specs as they are now, maybe just Unholy feels a bit weird. Never understood why people feel the need for 3 dps-tank specs that will be a nightmare to balance and will probably result in DKs being the worst tanks of all.
    It's not about "feeling a need", that's how DKs were shipped and that's how a lot of us fell in love with the class. And to your last point, it would be a hundred times easier to balance now with the way the talents are set up, with tank and DPS passives already built in.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    It's not about "feeling a need", that's how DKs were shipped and that's how a lot of us fell in love with the class. And to your last point, it would be a hundred times easier to balance now with the way the talents are set up, with tank and DPS passives already built in.
    I know, I made my DK on day 1 of Wotlk. I remember very well how it was and the pendulum swings that the class had. Even then there was a cookie cutter spec every patch for every role. I still think my point stands. It's inevitable that out of 3 tanking specs, one will be better and be used in 99% of the time, making the other two obsolete and for meme fun. Also, I don't believe Blizzard will invest in another big class redesign a-la-warlocks. I agree it could work, sure, just I don't trust Blizzard to do it properly and will probably result in the class being nigh unplayable for an expansion.
    Last edited by Nullp0inter; 2020-03-20 at 07:40 AM.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    ... and that's how a lot of us fell in love with the class...
    Respect, brother!

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Did people just feel craft in WoTLK? Frost was easily the worst spec for tanking, and the only boss it was really good for was Hodir because of the magic damage amplification. It's amazing to me that people remember an entirely differrnt game than me.

    UH was by and large the premier tank spec in WoTLK with Blood jumping in towards the end. I think people just automatically assumed frost was the tank spec because of what each presence did, not what each tree actually had. Unbreakable armor sucked BTW.

    Frost has always been the worst designed spec for DKs and the fact they double downed and made it the dual wield spec only further cements that point (imo).

    But yeah, frost was a shit tier tank spec in WoTLK, the worst one we could actually run. People must have been confused because of the presence.
    Do you understand the original poster is talking about class fantasy?
    And you are talking about in-game class performance during WOLTK?

    And you are calling people confused?

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    - Blood: The "new" Death Knight

    While Frost and Undead serve as solid callbacks to Arthas and the WC2 era Death Knight, respectively, I would use the opportunity to reinvent Blood spec a bit.

    It would be the more pure *Melee* DPS-spec. I would throw a spin on things by perhaps coupling their ability to drain blood (health) with abilities to also *expend* it. I would go entirely Dracula/Vlad the Impaler for inspiration for the spec, depicting Blood DK's as mighty, bloodthirsty warriors, but also with a dark, supernatural/vampiric quality.

    I feel like not only would that be wholly unique, but also mesh quite nicely with one of the new zones and covenants in Shadowlands, which seems *very* inspired by Dracula's castle.
    I love this idea so much. Too bad they would never do it.

    You should probably post your ideas on their official forums anyway though, just in case.
    Last edited by Sithalos; 2020-03-30 at 04:03 AM.
    Scheduled weekly maintenance caught me by surprise.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Sithalos View Post
    I love this idea so much. Too bad they would never do it.

    You should probably post your ideas on their official forums anyway though, just in case.
    I actually did!

    https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...changed/450040

    Unfortunately, my subscription has expired, and I don't feel very compelled to use any of my remaining tokens to re-up the subscription, solely to keep posting on the official forums. If any of yall are, though, feel free to chime-in on that post and keep the dream alive!

  7. #67
    It's your dream. Just let us pick what spec we want for tank and for DPS and everybody's happy.

  8. #68
    Over 9000! Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    I played a DK pretty much since they were first available in the Wrath Beta. But to be perfectly frank, I think that while they have had their ups and downs, I think the fantasy of each Spec has been fundamentally misunderstood, and could be far better worked.

    *snipped to reduce scrolling*
    I usually roll my eyes at fan redesigns (because generally they are terrible) but I'd be on board with pretty much all of this.
    My greatest fear is that one day, my MMO-Champion ignore list will run out of space.

  9. #69
    Fantasy or not since beginning DK didn't have too many skills in any spec. Now they have even less... i feel like playing MOBA class not MMO.

  10. #70
    Why not have UH with a 2hander and a shield ? A la Dark Angel Terminator command squad from W40K ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoopie
    this change is to help players like you..... you know..night elf with tyrannical beheader...

    Azharok - Dalaran EU

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    I played a DK pretty much since they were first available in the Wrath Beta. But to be perfectly frank, I think that while they have had their ups and downs, I think the fantasy of each Spec has been fundamentally misunderstood, and could be far better worked.

    Here's how I would redefine these three specs:

    - Frost: The "Arthas" spec, Tank

    I don't give a shit if "most of his skills were Unholy", when you *think* about Arthas, you're thinking about Frostmourne and the Frozen Throne. I would dive fully into that fantasy, with Frost wielding a single 2hander, a juggernaut that is meant more for *taking* punishment than necessarily doling it out.

    Not only does it better fit the "fantasy" of a Frost Death Knight (a slow-moving, hulking behemoth of a man), but I think by tying its identity directly to Arthas (much as Havoc DH's are to Illidan), it would inspire more players to take up the mantle of Tanking, which is always helpful in MMO's.

    - Unholy: The Necromancer, WC2-style Death Knight

    In a more startling shift, I would change Unholy to be more of a traditional "Necromancer". Not *totally* traditional, mind you; just *more so*. During Legion, the Unholy artifact, Apocalypse, did an absolutely *incredible* job of capturing the fantasy of being a melee-oriented Necromancer, where your attacks had you summoning a constant barrage of one-off undead for sometimes a single attack.

    That was a really cool fantasy anyways, and this could bridge the gap a little more with the WC2-era Death Knight, who was also quite cool in his own right. If you had to put a specific name to it, I suppose Teron Gorefiend is about the only well-known WC2 Death Knight.

    Also, by being a bit more "ranged" focused, it paves the way for a more unique interpretation of...

    - Blood: The "new" Death Knight

    While Frost and Undead serve as solid callbacks to Arthas and the WC2 era Death Knight, respectively, I would use the opportunity to reinvent Blood spec a bit.

    It would be the more pure *Melee* DPS-spec. I would throw a spin on things by perhaps coupling their ability to drain blood (health) with abilities to also *expend* it. I would go entirely Dracula/Vlad the Impaler for inspiration for the spec, depicting Blood DK's as mighty, bloodthirsty warriors, but also with a dark, supernatural/vampiric quality.

    I feel like not only would that be wholly unique, but also mesh quite nicely with one of the new zones and covenants in Shadowlands, which seems *very* inspired by Dracula's castle.

    To give the spec a bit more defined "personality", I'd say you'd want Blood spec represented by either some kind of bloodthirsty Orc (perhaps re-defining Nazgrim as a Blood DK?), or maybe a Blood Elf or one of the San'layn.

    - In conclusion...

    I think these specs would feel far more distinctive and iconic that the current ones we have. Sure, the current specs "work", but honestly I don't think any one spec is particularly exciting. Doubly-so when Frost is now DW-only.

    Speaking of which, now that we have *so* many dual-wielding classes in the game, I would legitimately propose removing dual-wielding entirely. I simply don't think it fits the Death Knight class. As for the Legion artifact, just retcon it to a singular "Blade of the Fallen Prince", and increase the size of the 1hander models to be suitable for 2handers.
    Ah yes, just what I wanted, another rework to make a spec I play entirely impossible to play the way I want it.

    First Ranged Surv, then Frost DK.

    Your explanation for your specs makes sense, I guess.

    But our player DK isn't a WC2 era DK.

    We're veterans of the third war, raised as the "second generation" DKs, distinct from the first generation like Teron Gorefiend.

    Additionally, Frost is indeed Arthas inspired. So we should go back to 2h DPS, not Tanking.

    There's a spec for DK that revolves around draining one's health (HP), and you're saying that shouldn't be the tank?

    If we could go back to role-agnostic DK specs, then fine. But don't reshuffle around what already exists.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azharok View Post
    Why not have UH with a 2hander and a shield ? A la Dark Angel Terminator command squad from W40K ?
    DKs have never had any association with shields, and no offense but 'they do it in W40k' isn't really a valid argument to start one.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by jzhbee View Post
    Additionally, Frost is indeed Arthas inspired. So we should go back to 2h DPS, not Tanking.
    Agree to disagree. 2H Frost tanking was crazy-fun in Wrath. Its the only spec/role combo I've ever enjoyed as much as prot warrior/BM hunter.
    My greatest fear is that one day, my MMO-Champion ignore list will run out of space.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Nurvus View Post
    Hunter:

    New - Beastiality -
    You do not want that as a spec name.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    DKs have never had any association with shields, and no offense but 'they do it in W40k' isn't really a valid argument to start one.
    Just go look at the Deathwing terminators before saying no :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoopie
    this change is to help players like you..... you know..night elf with tyrannical beheader...

    Azharok - Dalaran EU

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azharok View Post
    Just go look at the Deathwing terminators before saying no :P
    Oh, I know what they are, and they're undoubtedly very neat. But that doesn't automatically make it a good fit for what has always been a shield-less class in a completely different IP/universe etc - not IMO, anyway.

    That isn't to say 'I'm right, you're wrong!' - just that I personally don't think shields fit them at all. We already have 2 shield-based plate tanks, so I feel like giving that to DKs kinda homogenizes them a bit.
    Last edited by Mirishka; 2020-04-02 at 03:08 AM.
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  16. #76
    I was thinking a shield wielding DPS tbh. Not for tanking.
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoopie
    this change is to help players like you..... you know..night elf with tyrannical beheader...

    Azharok - Dalaran EU

  17. #77
    The Lightbringer Nurvus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    You do not want that as a spec name.
    Or do I? (:
    Why did you create a new thread? Use the search function and post in existing threads!
    Why did you necro a thread?

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