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  1. #81
    There has always been BOE stuff available, but I think that's a disingenuous argument if you're going to ignore relative strength. Is it "pay to win" or is it pay to "WIN!"? There is also the point that in the past you stood a real chance of getting banned for buying gold, I know folks who did. Nowadays Blizzard make money from that so it's completely part of the system, where in the past it was completely against the rules.

    If the reality is like buying Warglaives from the AH (which it is) it can't be compared to Lionheart Helmet.
    Last edited by Bigbazz; 2020-02-24 at 10:03 PM.
    I7 6700K : 16GB DDR4 3000 : GTX1070 : Firestudio : Naga : G27

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    You would have a valid point if the logs and rankings didn't speak for otherwise. Took a random samplings of a few bosses (ST, AoE, Cleave) and their top 10 rankings and a lot of them corruptions weren't even a factor, a few didn't appear to have any corruption damage AT ALL.

    The ones that have a lot of corruption damage are outliers, not the norm
    You need to look again.

    Some corruptions go under the radar - mainly stat corruptions which are ridiculous. Expedient on Destros or Masterful on Mages - night and day.

    Take every Destruction Warlock top 10 slice and it's all stacked Expedient or at least couple of those.

    Same with Fire Mages - it's literally Masterful or go home right there.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Clozer View Post
    Good players stay good players - if they buy power for real money or not. I thought we cleared that already......

    You are literially like "here one player who didnt spend couple millions on boe and is good, therefore buying power for real money is not buying power for real money." Are you intentionally trolling at this point?
    Because you're not buying it for real money. You're buying it for gold, which is easily (more easily imo) obtainable in game. If you could earn "Real money crystals" in "p2w" game at the same rate you can earn gold in wow, I wouldn't call it p2w either.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    I see 475ilvl items with socket and good corruption for like 2-3 million on the AH. So now ppl buy wow tokens for real life money and then buy this items...

    Is this good gameplay or not? Pay to win?

    Blizzard probly happy about it as they earn more $$$
    blizzard isnt selling the armor,by this logic wow has been p2w since day 1 because you could always buy boe's or just buy boosts

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    You need to look again.

    Some corruptions go under the radar - mainly stat corruptions which are ridiculous. Expedient on Destros or Masterful on Mages - night and day.

    Take every Destruction Warlock top 10 slice and it's all stacked Expedient or at least couple of those.

    Same with Fire Mages - it's literally Masterful or go home right there.
    Well then maybe just quit i guess, because i find corruption insanely fun and hope they have a system still in SL that is similar.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    BoEs typically weren't 15%+ damage increases though.

    I wouldn't exactly call it "P2W", but it's certainly closer to that than it's ever been before. Preach/Bay had an entire discussion on this after the world first race, with multiple guilds spending 100m+ gold on corruption BoEs.
    you can buy a boost today naked and get all items from mythic raids,thats more than a 15% damage increase for less gold than a coruption item on ah,so i guess p2w since day 1

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    That's an outlier, there's a couple in there for now, but they'll be pushed out.
    So we just gotta wait until someone with better corruption and equivalent skill shows up, yes?

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    So we just gotta wait until someone with better corruption and equivalent skill shows up, yes?
    We've had, what 4 weeks of mythic? There's still a lot of gear to get.

  9. #89
    since the introduction of tokens.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Well then maybe just quit i guess, because i find corruption insanely fun and hope they have a system still in SL that is similar.
    the problem with corruption is the INSANE rng,not only do you have 53 combinations( titanforge was a joke by comparison,blizz rly listened LOL),but you also have huge swings in dps,same person same setup can have wild dps swings every pull,30-40% one pull vs another just from coruption luck or bad luck,and not having any good coruption = you are useless,raids are tuned around coruption

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Because you're not buying it for real money. You're buying it for gold, which is easily (more easily imo) obtainable in game. If you could earn "Real money crystals" in "p2w" game at the same rate you can earn gold in wow, I wouldn't call it p2w either.
    You can buy power for real money. Fact. You can also buy power for gold. Good another fact. What's the point?

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    I see 475ilvl items with socket and good corruption for like 2-3 million on the AH. So now ppl buy wow tokens for real life money and then buy this items...

    Is this good gameplay or not? Pay to win?

    Blizzard probly happy about it as they earn more $$$
    This has been the case since Vanilla, so if it wasn't "Pay to Win" then, it's not now.

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    We've had, what 4 weeks of mythic? There's still a lot of gear to get.
    ...or you just buy the *right* corruption pieces off the Auction house right off the bat.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    blizzard isnt selling the armor,by this logic wow has been p2w since day 1 because you could always buy boe's or just buy boosts
    But never or atleast very few times..... have ONE boe been so good. 1 item adds like like 20% of your total damage inside mythics? Thats balanced i guess and very good gameplay?

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    But never or atleast very few times..... have ONE boe been so good. 1 item adds like like 20% of your total damage inside mythics? Thats balanced i guess and very good gameplay?
    you can buy a full mythic run for less gold and end up with far more power than from one ah coruption

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    ...or you just buy the *right* corruption pieces off the Auction house right off the bat.
    Or just play the game and end up with better than you could buy. You can only buy a couple of slots at 475 (2 maybe?) you can get every slot by just playing the game.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowsgrace View Post
    This has been the case since Vanilla, so if it wasn't "Pay to Win" then, it's not now.
    BOE have never been this powerfull that it adds 20% of your total dps or more. Like 1 boe. Could add that. Tell me when? it havent ALWAYS been like that anyway. 100% sure.

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Rank 1 world (in every class, not just mage) mage currently on Ra'den, not a single point of corruption damage https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=16
    He has corruption...

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/ch...zak/pepegamage

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Clozer View Post
    You can buy power for real money. Fact. You can also buy power for gold. Good another fact. What's the point?
    Say you decide you want a sweet perfectly corrupted mythic BoE. You don't have enough gold though, so you decide to go buy tokens so you do. Your tokens sell instantly and you finally have enough gold. You whisper the guy in trade, but he sold it. You go to the AH to buy one, but there's not one there anymore either. There's no item to fill your needs currently available. Now you have to wait. You don't see one for 2-4 weeks. You're now sitting on your hands waiting for that power you were supposed to have paid for. One finally shows up, but it gets bought before you can make a run for it.

    Can you see the other side of the argument? If WoW was TRUE P2W, then you would be buying stuff from blizz that either A.) Gave you power from the point your CC was processed, or B.) Gave you a special currency that was used exclusively in a store, ran by Blizz, that sold those direct power gains. Instead, any attempt to P2W is realistically at the whims of other players, and the player driven/controlled market.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    Was referring to player damage in general which is absolutely reduced, significantly so, in PvP. Complaining about corruption in arena is pointless, as it relates to this topic, as the issue there is corruption itself. If the ONLY source of corruption effects was BOEs then yeah you'd be a lot closer to having a point. But they aren't, so you don't.

    And we can argue costs and amount and %'s or whatever until we're blue in the face. The game isn't pay to win, and the OP doesn't even seem to get what 'pay to win' actually means as it relates to games.

    By the OP's obtuse definition of P2W (pwning teh meturz omgggg!!!111) I've been 'winning' WoW most of the time I've been playing it.
    Except people can get far better corruption for arena by dropping real life money. That's the entire point.

    You seem to not get what pay to win means.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    In p2w games you buy things you can't reasonably get without paying, directly, from the game developer. Buying gold to buy an upgrade isn't p2w.
    Why? You're giving money directly to the developer.

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