Page 55 of 72 FirstFirst ...
5
45
53
54
55
56
57
65
... LastLast
  1. #1081
    Mechagnome
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lighthalzen, the City-State of Prosperity
    Posts
    727
    Quote Originally Posted by Viikkis View Post
    Classic token? You mean when chinese WoW classic got WoW token? Or do you mean that players are able to pay for their classic subscription with retail gold? There is no way to (legally) buy gold in classic.
    yes, sorry i also count the chinese market in this. Because they can use the same system. But however, afaik it is also coming to eu

  2. #1082
    Quote Originally Posted by froschhure View Post
    yes, sorry i also count the chinese market in this. Because they can use the same system. But however, afaik it is also coming to eu
    No official news for it yet whatsoever. Only speculation and fear because of the chinese token. Chinese WoW has always been different than EU/NA so personally I'm not too worried about it.

  3. #1083
    Warchief taishar68's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Las Vegas, NV USA
    Posts
    2,000
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerox View Post
    Everything is made towards you buying tokens as a casual (majority).
    It is on the edge on pay2win.
    Really? I have never felt a lick of pressure to buy a token for anything. What do you feel is designed to make you buy tokens that makes you feel that "everything" is bent to that end?
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
    "We don't care if it's the last act of Henry the Fifth, we're leaving!"

  4. #1084
    In one week of casual play (Classic Dungeons) I have amassed 432k. Up from 122k.

    Its inflation.

  5. #1085
    The Lightbringer Azerox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Groningen
    Posts
    3,386
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    Really? I have never felt a lick of pressure to buy a token for anything. What do you feel is designed to make you buy tokens that makes you feel that "everything" is bent to that end?
    Me neighter because i have 15y xp, do all content and play few hours a day.
    The casual (you are not the casual i mean, they don't know about this forum) will buy to increase e-peen.
    It's the same with fortnite skins and such micotransactions.
    That is not dead which can eternal lie,
    and with strange Aeons even Death may die.

  6. #1086
    Immortal
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    7,957
    Quote Originally Posted by Alatie View Post
    I mean Limit got WF and did pay in gold where world second Method did do rmt
    As far as I know neither did any rmt:

    https://www.dexerto.com/world-of-war...e-for-1321520/

    This misperception possibly stems from the somewhat misleading headlines that quoted "Race to World First World of Warcraft raids cost $40,000 to prepare for", but if you actually read the article they state that (regarding buying tokens):

    "that’s not how Method makes its money. Months have past since the fourth raid, Azshara’s Eternal Palace, was released, giving the guild ample time to replay Mythic runs and sell their spoils on the auction house. Rather than spend money on gold, Method spent it on hosting their RWF event and raising money for the Save The Children foundation"

    In other words, that $40,000 price tag is the $$ value of the gold they spent, not actual $$.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Azerox View Post
    Everything is made towards you buying tokens as a casual (majority).
    It is on the edge on pay2win.
    Given the way in which tokens work, it's patently impossible for the majority to buy tokens. Therefore your assertion here is patently nonsensical.

  7. #1087
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Brazil
    Posts
    15,362
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    If I reach a personal goal I define it as a win for me, you can argue semantics all you like but thats my view on it.
    Right. Should I call the Guiness Book of Records because I just managed to win Super Mario Bros in less than a minute?

    After all, all I had to do was to set my "personal goal" to "kill the first goomba", and I win! Super Mario Bros win in less than a minute! Woo! I'll be famous! I'll be rich! All talk-shows will call me for an interview!

    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    Did you just learn people have different opinions on things?
    You can have the opinion that sticking your bare hand into a vat of molten metal won't burn your hand, but that doesn't mean sticking your bare hand into molten metal won't actually burn your hand.

    Please stop trying to redefine "pay to win" to "pay to win my own personal goals regardless of what the actual goals of the game are".
    I did a Necromancer thing. Check it out! All feedback welcome!
    I also did a Bard thing! Questions, comments and ideas, all welcome!

  8. #1088
    Immortal
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    7,957
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    You're arguing semantics now, it granted them the win so its a means to an end that was winning.
    Except it didn't. The people who won the WF race, as well the runners up, did so by spending gold, none of which was obtained via tokens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    In some aspects, the game absolutely is pay to win, I dont know why people wont accept this its like theyre trying to defend the game or something.
    I don't accept it because it's patently nonsense.

    Pay-to-win means you either pay or you don't win. The implications of that are that competitive players are essentially forced to play. This is in no way true of WoW and it never has been.

  9. #1089
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    Just look at my picture, a mount that sold for 3k gold is now in BFA sold for 500k. Is that the best direction for the game to take?
    do you understand meaning of gold sink?
    the mount is there so if you haveheaps of gold you can buy mount, which is not unique model so its not only obtainable for a crapload of gold, if you dont have the gold or dont want to spend it just dont buy it...
    i didnt, even though i have milions, bcs its ugly reskin of another 5+ mounts i have...

  10. #1090
    Immortal
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    7,957
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    If I reach a personal goal I define it as a win for me, you can argue semantics all you like but thats my view on it.
    Except you're the one arguing semantics here. The definition of pay-to-win is not really about how you define the term win. It's about whether you are required to pay in order to do so.

    And honestly, there's no real debate here because regardless of what you want to argue qualifies as winning, tokens don't achieve those outcomes for you. They give you a small to moderate amount of gold. And gold is a commodity that is easily obtained in-game for a minimal amount of effort. Buying tokens in order to acquire gold is not something that anyone does because they have no other feasible options. It's done because they simply can't be arsed to put in the minimal amount of time and effort to obtain it via the regular means.
    Last edited by Raelbo; 2020-10-12 at 04:07 PM.

  11. #1091
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    As far as I know neither did any rmt:



    This misperception possibly stems from the somewhat misleading headlines that quoted "Race to World First World of Warcraft raids cost $40,000 to prepare for", but if you actually read the article they state that (regarding buying tokens):

    "that’s not how Method makes its money. Months have past since the fourth raid, Azshara’s Eternal Palace, was released, giving the guild ample time to replay Mythic runs and sell their spoils on the auction house. Rather than spend money on gold, Method spent it on hosting their RWF event and raising money for the Save The Children foundation"

    In other words, that $40,000 price tag is the $$ value of the gold they spent, not actual $$.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Given the way in which tokens work, it's patently impossible for the majority to buy tokens. Therefore your assertion here is patently nonsensical.
    I can't post a link due to not really posting but if you google scribe admits rmt ny'alotha you get a Icy-veins link where you see the story and also a link to the tweet of Scripe where he said it.
    Scripe did admit to it after Gallywix went up in flames and a Gallywix council member went on a leaking spree shit came to light the rate was 50 euro to 1mil they did pay 128,473,245 gold so 128x50=6400$ + ofc the advertisment they get from Method saying they got it from them.

  12. #1092
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Right. Should I call the Guiness Book of Records because I just managed to win Super Mario Bros in less than a minute?

    After all, all I had to do was to set my "personal goal" to "kill the first goomba", and I win! Super Mario Bros win in less than a minute! Woo! I'll be famous! I'll be rich! All talk-shows will call me for an interview!


    You can have the opinion that sticking your bare hand into a vat of molten metal won't burn your hand, but that doesn't mean sticking your bare hand into molten metal won't actually burn your hand.

    Please stop trying to redefine "pay to win" to "pay to win my own personal goals regardless of what the actual goals of the game are".
    Sorry but you dont get to dictate definitions any more than anybody else, its completely subjective.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    Except it didn't. The people who won the WF race, as well the runners up, did so by spending gold, none of which was obtained via tokens.



    I don't accept it because it's patently nonsense.

    Pay-to-win means you either pay or you don't win. The implications of that are that competitive players are essentially forced to play. This is in no way true of WoW and it never has been.
    And winning means whatever you want it to be, different people different goals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    do you understand meaning of gold sink?
    I do, and they are getting more stupid by the expansions.

    What is Shadowlands goldsinks going to cost, baseline 5 million gold?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    Except you're the one arguing semantics here. The definition of pay-to-win is not really about how you define the term win. It's about whether you are required to pay in order to do so.

    And honestly, there's no real debate here because regardless of what you want to argue qualifies as winning, tokens don't achieve those outcomes for you. They give you a small to moderate amount of gold. And gold is a commodity that is easily obtained in-game for a minimal amount of effort. Buying tokens in order to acquire gold is not something that anyone does because they have no other feasible options. It's done because they simply can't be arsed to put in the minimal amount of time and effort to obtain it via the regular means.
    Its an echo-chamber by now, just agree to disagree with the whole pay 2 win since nobody is "right".

  13. #1093
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Brazil
    Posts
    15,362
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    Sorry but you dont get to dictate definitions any more than anybody else, its completely subjective.
    Except I'm using the actual definition of the term, while you are redefining it to suit your narrative. "Pay to win" does not mean "pay to win my own personal, arbitrary goals regardless of what the actual goals established by the game I'm playing are".

    And winning means whatever you want it to be, different people different goals.
    No. "Pay to Win" specifically refers to "winning" the goals established by the game.
    I did a Necromancer thing. Check it out! All feedback welcome!
    I also did a Bard thing! Questions, comments and ideas, all welcome!

  14. #1094
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Except I'm using the actual definition of the term, while you are redefining it to suit your narrative. "Pay to win" does not mean "pay to win my own personal, arbitrary goals regardless of what the actual goals established by the game I'm playing are".


    No. "Pay to Win" specifically refers to "winning" the goals established by the game.
    Your own definition means that, I understand as much.

    As I said, agree to disagree.

  15. #1095
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    Your own definition means that, I understand as much.

    As I said, agree to disagree.
    No, that's the common definition. The one you might find in a dictionary, if you know what that is.

    Just because you like to redefine reality to suit your delusions does not mean that everybody does that.
    Last edited by ymirsson; 2020-10-12 at 06:10 PM.
    A witty saying proves nothing.
    -Voltaire
    winning
    plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

  16. #1096
    Quote Originally Posted by muten roshi View Post
    gold sink to counteract inflation
    Shhhh you’re supposed to say “greedy blizz sucks”

    Stop using logic

  17. #1097
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    What is Shadowlands goldsinks going to cost, baseline 5 million gold?
    single mount (recolor at that) in HUNDREDS of mounts, so even if it was goldcap, who cares?!
    people who have that amount of gold to sink will buy it people who dont want to sink that kind of gold or dont have it wont, and unless its actualy unique model people want to use it will affect NOBODY, just collectors wiling to waste gold will have mount count one up...

  18. #1098
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    I see 475ilvl items with socket and good corruption for like 2-3 million on the AH. So now ppl buy wow tokens for real life money and then buy this items...

    Is this good gameplay or not? Pay to win?

    Blizzard probly happy about it as they earn more $$$




    EDIT: What i mean by p2w is win the damage meter. More dps make dungeon/raid/pvp easyer. One with buyed BIS for real life money VS one with no corrupt or a bad one. Who would you put your money on? Who would you like to have in your raid/dungeon/arena. Also my english are pretty bad so sorry for not explaining so all understand. I did my best, sorry.


    VERY funny thing is that i asked both if its good gameplay and if its P2W. None/few answer if its good gameplay. All get stuck if its P2W instead. Ppl are funny

    Apparently Preach Gaming have a video about it.
    Using your values here, 3M / 150k (estimated high token cost) = 20x15 (15$ per token) = $300

    If someone wants to spend $300 on 1 item, I say have at it p2w. They are just fueling the devs with cash to create future content for me. With a cost that high, few will be purchasing those items. Whales sure few and far between could afford that for each slot that has a BoE. 90% (obviously I am taking an educated guess, no stats to prove this value) of the player base barely want to spend the $15 a month for the ability to play the game, let alone purchase a single item for $300. I would say more than 90% honestly but for the lack of data, I will guestimate a lower percentage.

  19. #1099
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Brazil
    Posts
    15,362
    Quote Originally Posted by Vidhjerta View Post
    Your own definition means that, I understand as much.
    I'm sorry, but you're acting very obtuse here. You are attempting to redefine "pay to win" to mean "winning" your own arbitrary goals, rather than "winning" the goals the game have established. That's like saying you can "win" at Super Mario Bros because you decided that to "win" the game, all you have to do is kill the first goomba that shows up. Or saying you can "win" a marathon by establishing your own arbitrary goal that to "win" you just need to be the first to break 50 meters so you go for a full sprint instead of jogging to be the first to reach the 50 meters mark.

    As I said, agree to disagree.
    Saying "agree to disagree" here feels more like a cop-out here because you have been put against the wall for attempting to redefine what the term "pay to win" means to suit your narrative.
    Last edited by Ielenia; 2020-10-12 at 07:54 PM.
    I did a Necromancer thing. Check it out! All feedback welcome!
    I also did a Bard thing! Questions, comments and ideas, all welcome!

  20. #1100
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I'm sorry, but you're acting very obtuse here. You are attempting to redefine "pay to win" to mean "winning" your own arbitrary goals, rather than "winning" the goals the game have established. That's like saying you can "win" at Super Mario Bros because you decided that to "win" the game, all you have to do is kill the first goomba that shows up. Or saying you can "win" a marathon by establishing your own arbitrary goal that to "win" you just need to be the first to break 50 meters so you go for a full sprint instead of jogging to be the first to reach the 50 meters mark.
    mario and marathons have very clearly defined win conditions though. something that's nowhere near as clear in wow. some people considering clearing heroic win, some clearing half the mythic raid, some the whole mythic raid, some the mythic raid before anyone else. some wins in wow, like bis gear, are unobtainable so anyone who considers they have won that has set some personal goal. and ofc, the game technically doesn't have a win condition at all. (well i guess you can make a similar argument for mario and marthons actually.)

    though, w/e you set as your win in wow, you can definitely legally pay for 99% of them.
    Last edited by Hellobolis; 2020-10-12 at 08:04 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •