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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    is there anyone apart from guilds trying to compete for world first like Method or Limit actualy wiling to spend some 80-120euro to buy single item?
    if so, i pity the fool
    Have you not been paying attention to the gaming industry at all?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Nah nah, see... I live by one simple creed: You might catch more flies with honey, but to catch honeys you gotta be fly.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Destinas View Post
    It would take a ton of real life money to deck yourself out in great gear through the AH, especially if these pieces are 2-3 million gold each. The token has been floating around 150-180k gold for most of the expansion, meaning that you'd have to buy 10-12 tokens to get one piece. At $20 USD for a token, that would be $200-$240 USD - for a single piece.

    It would be easier to kill rares, finish assaults, and do visions than spend thousands of dollars to fully deck yourself out. That is not "pay to win" at all, so calm down with that narrative.
    So because it takes a ton of money it isn't pay to win?

    You guys have some weird ass definitions of pay to win.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Belloc View Post
    Guilds have been selling full clears through max-difficulty content for years now, both for money and for gold. BOEs are nothing compared to that.

    No, it's not P2W. It can only be called P2W if Blizzard is directly offering BiS-quality gear for money, which they will never do. WoW will never be P2W.
    Except that gear gotten through raids couldn't increase your dps by 30% for a single piece.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Or just play the game and end up with better than you could buy.
    You can buy virtually any corruption off the Auction house, it doesn't matter on which slot you have them as long as it's Mythic Ilvl.
    So, if you don't want to wait, you just buy them, it's not like it's a save bet that you get those corruptions.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    I did say not a single point of corruption damage, these people are all like "you have to spend millions on inf stars!"
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    and a lot of them corruptions weren't even a factor, a few didn't appear to have any corruption damage AT ALL.
    Why are you lying? This is what I asked for and then you shifted goalposts.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    Except that gear gotten through raids couldn't increase your dps by 30% for a single piece.
    No single piece increases your damage by 30%

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    BOE have never been this powerfull that it adds 20% of your total dps or more. Like 1 boe. Could add that. Tell me when? it havent ALWAYS been like that anyway. 100% sure.
    That's a balancing issue, now a P2W issue. You are literally saying "but it wasn't an issue before because the items weren't so strong". If these effects were 10-20% as strong as they are now, you would be complaining. Like I said before, you also wouldn't be complaining if you could buy the item for 10k. What is happening, is blizz released horribly balanced corruptions, and people who can't afford these BoE variants are upset that other people can.

    Furthermore, Blizzard isn't selling you the item. Blizzard isn't facilitating the sale. Blizz isn't controlling prices. The price could quadruple tomorrow, or it drop to a quarter of the current price. Blizzard is, at best indirectly related to the sale.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Ah yes, that whopping like 300 more mastery from his corruptions totally made him win and not his skill
    You seem to not know what mastery does for fire mages. I guarantee you his parse would not be number 1, likely not even top 100, if he had 300 less mastery for that fight.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    Why are you lying? This is what I asked for and then you shifted goalposts.
    I was ALWAYS talking about TD/EV/IS, forgot about the stat ones honestly, but that 300 mastery he's getting from his corruptions isn't going to add up to "30% of his dps"

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by themaster24 View Post
    Say you decide you want a sweet perfectly corrupted mythic BoE. You don't have enough gold though, so you decide to go buy tokens so you do. Your tokens sell instantly and you finally have enough gold. You whisper the guy in trade, but he sold it. You go to the AH to buy one, but there's not one there anymore either. There's no item to fill your needs currently available. Now you have to wait. You don't see one for 2-4 weeks. You're now sitting on your hands waiting for that power you were supposed to have paid for. One finally shows up, but it gets bought before you can make a run for it.

    Can you see the other side of the argument? If WoW was TRUE P2W, then you would be buying stuff from blizz that either A.) Gave you power from the point your CC was processed, or B.) Gave you a special currency that was used exclusively in a store, ran by Blizz, that sold those direct power gains. Instead, any attempt to P2W is realistically at the whims of other players, and the player driven/controlled market.
    Those are some incredible mental gymnastics dude.

    You can buy the most powerful items in the game through the use of real money. That's pay to win.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    Nah nah, see... I live by one simple creed: You might catch more flies with honey, but to catch honeys you gotta be fly.

  10. #110
    I would say yes, considering the best possible item can be purchased through USD. Maybe for entry level raiding, but never to this extent.

    That's why they took the RMAH down on D3. The most exciting way to improve your character was through the auction house, not playing the game.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    You seem to not know what mastery does for fire mages. I guarantee you his parse would not be number 1, likely not even top 100, if he had 300 less mastery for that fight.
    I know exactly what mastery does for fire mages, 300 isn't going to be "30% of his dmg" he's getting far more from other procs and buffs.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by XDurionX View Post
    You could always buy BOEs for money, so either wow has always been p2w or never.
    typical blizzard-in-disguise forum post

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowsgrace View Post
    This has been the case since Vanilla, so if it wasn't "Pay to Win" then, it's not now.
    It wasn't the case since Vanilla. No single item could increase your dps by 20%+

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    No single piece increases your damage by 30%
    Infinite Stars wants a word with you.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    You can buy virtually any corruption off the Auction house, it doesn't matter on which slot you have them as long as it's Mythic Ilvl.
    So, if you don't want to wait, you just buy them, it's not like it's a save bet that you get those corruptions.
    It's still not pay to win in the slightest lol, you can also get those 2 slots you could have bought by, you know, playing the game. but hey, if you want to bitch about someone dropping all their gold on a few pieces that will be obsolete in a few months time, go for it. Maybe just quit and save yourself the hassle, I for one hope they figure out a way to have a similar system in SL.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Xauro View Post
    I see 475ilvl items with socket and good corruption for like 2-3 million on the AH. So now ppl buy wow tokens for real life money and then buy this items...

    Is this good gameplay or not? Pay to win?

    Blizzard probly happy about it as they earn more $$$
    If players being able to sell gear equals P2W then yes, all decent MMOs are P2W. Seems it is time to remove the auction house and trading from gaming.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    BoEs typically weren't 15%+ damage increases though.

    I wouldn't exactly call it "P2W", but it's certainly closer to that than it's ever been before. Preach/Bay had an entire discussion on this after the world first race, with multiple guilds spending 100m+ gold on corruption BoEs.
    A lot of the Dark Moon Faire Cards were flat 15% damage boosts in past expansions. Heck even this expansion, I'm pretty sure Darkmoon Deck Fathoms was a huge portion of people's DPS.
    Curoar, Arms Warrior of 15 years.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    It wasn't the case since Vanilla. No single item could increase your dps by 20%+

    - - - Updated - - -



    Infinite Stars wants a word with you.
    That's stacking it, and after nerfs most of it is not 30%, the majority of what you see in IS is 14%

    IS is shitty damage to corruption ratio.

  18. #118
    It's been like this since Vanilla. It's probably more expensive now because if you want to buy a 2m gold ring with infinite stars on it, you're going to need a shitload of tokens

    And the influx of tokens drives the price down, so you'll get less and less for every other token you list

  19. #119
    1. Win implies there is an end. With Shadowlands coming out, for now at least, there is no end.

    2. World first has already been "won", so now people buying those BoE are just PtM (pay to mimic).

    3. A bought token just moves money from someone that already had it in game to someone with a token to sell meaning someone also paid to lose, net effect is one "wins" one loses cancelling each other out.

    4. My game and playing has seen no real impact from the guy selling a token and buying a BoE.

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    I know exactly what mastery does for fire mages, 300 isn't going to be "30% of his dmg" he's getting far more from other procs and buffs.
    Those other procs and buffs cause and exponential increase with the extra mastery. I guarantee you it's close to 30% more dps over the same items without the corruption.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    That's stacking it, and after nerfs most of it is not 30%, the majority of what you see in IS is 14%

    IS is shitty damage to corruption ratio.
    Wrong.

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=14

    He only had 1 rank 3 infinite stars piece.

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