WOW- Now pay to win?

[froschhure]

completly correct. They added a phase in wow, where the stock market is actively selling their items, through wow in game mechanics. Such as the Bind on Equip system.
Not only that they destroy their own game enviroment and market, they bloat their own cash bubble by this. Their target audience is the wealthiest 5% of wow gamers. So they designed the long boi and "gold sink". But as you can see, they never needed a longboi, Because they were going to squish stats again and since gold value scales with i lvl - this is a perfect recycle system and the most professional money washing factory i have ever seen and warcraft in the current state is the most pointless game ever created. Layer over layer, no fresh content and mostly delusional system, borrowed power for marketing purposes. Everyone with a beating heart knows what im thinking of here.

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and for everyone that thought classic would be a rebirth somehow - they hopes got shattered, they added the classic token... something that would have never existed in an orginal vanilla classic server.

[Super Kami Dende]

Just look at the pricing differences between these two almost identical mounts. One from MoP one from BFA.

There is no reason to put mounts behind these insane prices other than pushing people to buy the wow-token.

Actually its to counteract the insane gold inflation from WoD and Legion.

But nice conspiracy theories.

[Viikkis]

and for everyone that thought classic would be a rebirth somehow - they hopes got shattered, they added the classic token... something that would have never existed in an orginal vanilla classic server.

Classic token? You mean when chinese WoW classic got WoW token? Or do you mean that players are able to pay for their classic subscription with retail gold? There is no way to (legally) buy gold in classic.

[Baneto]

Actually its to counteract the insane gold inflation from WoD and Legion.

But nice conspiracy theories.

Its called different opinion/idea, a real conspiracy theory is claiming that covid-19 came from a dude eating a bat.

[froschhure]

Classic token? You mean when chinese WoW classic got WoW token? Or do you mean that players are able to pay for their classic subscription with retail gold? There is no way to (legally) buy gold in classic.

yes, sorry i also count the chinese market in this. Because they can use the same system. But however, afaik it is also coming to eu

[Viikkis]

yes, sorry i also count the chinese market in this. Because they can use the same system. But however, afaik it is also coming to eu

No official news for it yet whatsoever. Only speculation and fear because of the chinese token. Chinese WoW has always been different than EU/NA so personally I'm not too worried about it.

[taishar68]

Everything is made towards you buying tokens as a casual (majority).
It is on the edge on pay2win.

Really? I have never felt a lick of pressure to buy a token for anything. What do you feel is designed to make you buy tokens that makes you feel that "everything" is bent to that end?

[Paula Deen]

In one week of casual play (Classic Dungeons) I have amassed 432k. Up from 122k.

Its inflation.

[Azerox]

Really? I have never felt a lick of pressure to buy a token for anything. What do you feel is designed to make you buy tokens that makes you feel that "everything" is bent to that end?

Me neighter because i have 15y xp, do all content and play few hours a day.
The casual (you are not the casual i mean, they don't know about this forum) will buy to increase e-peen.
It's the same with fortnite skins and such micotransactions.

[Raelbo]

I mean Limit got WF and did pay in gold where world second Method did do rmt

As far as I know neither did any rmt:

https://www.dexerto.com/world-of-war...e-for-1321520/

This misperception possibly stems from the somewhat misleading headlines that quoted "Race to World First World of Warcraft raids cost $40,000 to prepare for", but if you actually read the article they state that (regarding buying tokens):

"that’s not how Method makes its money. Months have past since the fourth raid, Azshara’s Eternal Palace, was released, giving the guild ample time to replay Mythic runs and sell their spoils on the auction house. Rather than spend money on gold, Method spent it on hosting their RWF event and raising money for the Save The Children foundation"

In other words, that $40,000 price tag is the $$ value of the gold they spent, not actual $$.

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Everything is made towards you buying tokens as a casual (majority).
It is on the edge on pay2win.

Given the way in which tokens work, it's patently impossible for the majority to buy tokens. Therefore your assertion here is patently nonsensical.

[Ielenia]

If I reach a personal goal I define it as a win for me, you can argue semantics all you like but thats my view on it.

Right. Should I call the Guiness Book of Records because I just managed to win Super Mario Bros in less than a minute?

After all, all I had to do was to set my "personal goal" to "kill the first goomba", and I win! Super Mario Bros win in less than a minute! Woo! I'll be famous! I'll be rich! All talk-shows will call me for an interview!

Did you just learn people have different opinions on things?

You can have the opinion that sticking your bare hand into a vat of molten metal won't burn your hand, but that doesn't mean sticking your bare hand into molten metal won't actually burn your hand.

Please stop trying to redefine "pay to win" to "pay to win my own personal goals regardless of what the actual goals of the game are".

[Raelbo]

You're arguing semantics now, it granted them the win so its a means to an end that was winning.

Except it didn't. The people who won the WF race, as well the runners up, did so by spending gold, none of which was obtained via tokens.

In some aspects, the game absolutely is pay to win, I dont know why people wont accept this its like theyre trying to defend the game or something.

I don't accept it because it's patently nonsense.

Pay-to-win means you either pay or you don't win. The implications of that are that competitive players are essentially forced to play. This is in no way true of WoW and it never has been.

[Lolites]

Just look at my picture, a mount that sold for 3k gold is now in BFA sold for 500k. Is that the best direction for the game to take?

do you understand meaning of gold sink?
the mount is there so if you haveheaps of gold you can buy mount, which is not unique model so its not only obtainable for a crapload of gold, if you dont have the gold or dont want to spend it just dont buy it...
i didnt, even though i have milions, bcs its ugly reskin of another 5+ mounts i have...

[Raelbo]

If I reach a personal goal I define it as a win for me, you can argue semantics all you like but thats my view on it.

Except you're the one arguing semantics here. The definition of pay-to-win is not really about how you define the term win. It's about whether you are required to pay in order to do so.

And honestly, there's no real debate here because regardless of what you want to argue qualifies as winning, tokens don't achieve those outcomes for you. They give you a small to moderate amount of gold. And gold is a commodity that is easily obtained in-game for a minimal amount of effort. Buying tokens in order to acquire gold is not something that anyone does because they have no other feasible options. It's done because they simply can't be arsed to put in the minimal amount of time and effort to obtain it via the regular means.

[Alatie]

As far as I know neither did any rmt:



This misperception possibly stems from the somewhat misleading headlines that quoted "Race to World First World of Warcraft raids cost $40,000 to prepare for", but if you actually read the article they state that (regarding buying tokens):

"that’s not how Method makes its money. Months have past since the fourth raid, Azshara’s Eternal Palace, was released, giving the guild ample time to replay Mythic runs and sell their spoils on the auction house. Rather than spend money on gold, Method spent it on hosting their RWF event and raising money for the Save The Children foundation"

In other words, that $40,000 price tag is the $$ value of the gold they spent, not actual $$.

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Given the way in which tokens work, it's patently impossible for the majority to buy tokens. Therefore your assertion here is patently nonsensical.

I can't post a link due to not really posting but if you google scribe admits rmt ny'alotha you get a Icy-veins link where you see the story and also a link to the tweet of Scripe where he said it.
Scripe did admit to it after Gallywix went up in flames and a Gallywix council member went on a leaking spree shit came to light the rate was 50 euro to 1mil they did pay 128,473,245 gold so 128x50=6400$ + ofc the advertisment they get from Method saying they got it from them.

[Baneto]

Right. Should I call the Guiness Book of Records because I just managed to win Super Mario Bros in less than a minute?

After all, all I had to do was to set my "personal goal" to "kill the first goomba", and I win! Super Mario Bros win in less than a minute! Woo! I'll be famous! I'll be rich! All talk-shows will call me for an interview!


You can have the opinion that sticking your bare hand into a vat of molten metal won't burn your hand, but that doesn't mean sticking your bare hand into molten metal won't actually burn your hand.

Please stop trying to redefine "pay to win" to "pay to win my own personal goals regardless of what the actual goals of the game are".

Sorry but you dont get to dictate definitions any more than anybody else, its completely subjective.

Except it didn't. The people who won the WF race, as well the runners up, did so by spending gold, none of which was obtained via tokens.



I don't accept it because it's patently nonsense.

Pay-to-win means you either pay or you don't win. The implications of that are that competitive players are essentially forced to play. This is in no way true of WoW and it never has been.

And winning means whatever you want it to be, different people different goals.

do you understand meaning of gold sink?

I do, and they are getting more stupid by the expansions.

What is Shadowlands goldsinks going to cost, baseline 5 million gold?

Except you're the one arguing semantics here. The definition of pay-to-win is not really about how you define the term win. It's about whether you are required to pay in order to do so.

And honestly, there's no real debate here because regardless of what you want to argue qualifies as winning, tokens don't achieve those outcomes for you. They give you a small to moderate amount of gold. And gold is a commodity that is easily obtained in-game for a minimal amount of effort. Buying tokens in order to acquire gold is not something that anyone does because they have no other feasible options. It's done because they simply can't be arsed to put in the minimal amount of time and effort to obtain it via the regular means.

Its an echo-chamber by now, just agree to disagree with the whole pay 2 win since nobody is "right".

[Ielenia]

Sorry but you dont get to dictate definitions any more than anybody else, its completely subjective.

Except I'm using the actual definition of the term, while you are redefining it to suit your narrative. "Pay to win" does not mean "pay to win my own personal, arbitrary goals regardless of what the actual goals established by the game I'm playing are".

And winning means whatever you want it to be, different people different goals.

No. "Pay to Win" specifically refers to "winning" the goals established by the game.

[Baneto]

Except I'm using the actual definition of the term, while you are redefining it to suit your narrative. "Pay to win" does not mean "pay to win my own personal, arbitrary goals regardless of what the actual goals established by the game I'm playing are".


No. "Pay to Win" specifically refers to "winning" the goals established by the game.

Your own definition means that, I understand as much.

As I said, agree to disagree.

[ymirsson]

Your own definition means that, I understand as much.

As I said, agree to disagree.

No, that's the common definition. The one you might find in a dictionary, if you know what that is.

Just because you like to redefine reality to suit your delusions does not mean that everybody does that.

[razorpax]

gold sink to counteract inflation

Shhhh you’re supposed to say “greedy blizz sucks”

Stop using logic