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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    Not a good logic our constitution guarantees rights to every person and liabilities as well. If you are going by that logic then Americans cannot get compensation from foreign governments or persons for any wrong doing.
    I'm not saying it's okay but I don't think suing the government should be a choice when it's an international affair.

  2. #42
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by i9erek View Post
    I'm not saying it's okay but I don't think suing the government should be a choice when it's an international affair.
    Being able to sue a government is really something that can be done because said government allows it as a show of good faith and being willing to take responsibility for the actions of those under it's employ. It's one of the ways that we can say "No, we do not condone such actions". It's not the only way, punishing the responsible party ourselves would be another, but if we do nothing at all then it says that we DO condone such things.

    Which is bad for many ethical reasons, but also on a practical note because it impacts the safety of US citizens abroad. If we condone the murder of foreign citizens, then we can't expect foreign countries to go out of their way to protect us in return.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by i9erek View Post
    I'm not saying it's okay but I don't think suing the government should be a choice when it's an international affair.
    That should be for the courts to decide, and everyone, including non-citizens have that right. Otherwise we would basically be the same as Russia or North Korea.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by i9erek View Post
    I'm not saying it's okay but I don't think suing the government should be a choice when it's an international affair.
    It's a bad precedent because now the opposite is true as well, we have extradition treaties and other deals with allied countries for a reason. A trial should decide matters like this, the impact of this decision will be felt by American families in foreign tragedies for decades to come.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Daelak View Post
    Stop trying to believe that conservatives, both politicians, voters, policymakers, and judges are acting on good faith. They aren't, they never will. For conservative voters, it's about hero worship and subjugating themselves to their ideology and their supreme leader; for conservative in government, it's only about the consolidation of power and the elimination of the separation of powers. It's been their overriding cause since the expulsion of King George's grip on the colonies.
    Isn't Authoritarianism the Leftist wet dream?

    The Leftists are known for having issues with the Constitution, such as the 1A because "free speech is hatespeech" and the 2A because only the government authorities should have guns, and also for wanting healthcare to be provided by the state, as well as tuition being paid by the state. So basically putting a massive government in charge of everything, while at the same time calling Trump a dictator and accusing the SCOTUS of authoritarianism.

    It's mind boggling!
    Last edited by Buttwitch; 2020-02-27 at 12:35 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asrialol View Post
    Just quit already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Shut the hell up. You mindless consumers are why these companies get away with doing scummy shit with their products.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Isn't Authoritarianism the Leftist wet dream?

    The Leftists are known for having issues with the Constitution, such as the 1A because "free speech is hatespeech" and the 2A because only the government authorities should have guns, and also for wanting healthcare to be provided by the state. So basically putting a massive government in charge of everything, while at the same time calling Trump a dictator and accusing the SCOTUS of authoritarianism.

    It's mind boggling!
    Nope. That is Trump's M. O. right now.

    Literally everything you just said can be applied to Trump. He is trying to sue the New York Times for libel on an opinion article, guarantee it gets thrown out. He has also said that people should have their guns taken away, and then he banned bump stocks.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    He has also said that people should have their guns taken away, and then he banned bump stocks.
    Source? And not Vox, CNN or MSNBC.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asrialol View Post
    Just quit already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Shut the hell up. You mindless consumers are why these companies get away with doing scummy shit with their products.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Source? And not Vox, CNN or MSNBC.
    So, you don't want any truthful source? Ok.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...process-second

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/u...n-control.html

    The New York Times link, which you will probably ignore, shows a video of him saying bump stocks are banned in his bill, and the video shows him saying exactly when he said on LIVE TV when he was seizing the guns, then going through due process. I mean, it is like you weren't awake when he said this shit. Not surprising you are a Trump supporter, you ignore him when he says something wrong against your beliefs, but cheer when he fucking lies out his ass about things that are known lies.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Source? And not Vox, CNN or MSNBC.
    That's not how it works. If you ask for a source, they are under no obligation to limit it to the choices you want.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...n-gun-violence

    https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/...ess-sot-nr.cnn

    Edit:

    Oops, forgot the one from MSNBC...

    http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...an-bump-stocks
    Last edited by Machismo; 2020-02-27 at 01:01 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    That's not how it works. If you ask for a source, they are under no obligation to limit it to the choices you want.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...n-gun-violence

    https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/...ess-sot-nr.cnn

    Edit:

    Oops, forgot the one from MSNBC...

    http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...an-bump-stocks
    Lol. Whenever I cite Breitbart or Tim Pool, I get ridiculed for citing right-wing sources, but when people cite left-wing sources, it's alright.
    LMAO.

    RULES FOR THEE, BUT NOT FOR ME.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asrialol View Post
    Just quit already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Shut the hell up. You mindless consumers are why these companies get away with doing scummy shit with their products.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Lol. Whenever I cite Breitbart or Tim Pool, I get ridiculed for citing right-wing sources, but when people cite left-wing sources, it's alright.
    LMAO.

    RULES FOR THEE, BUT NOT FOR ME.
    Well, I hope you enjoyed the evidence that showed the other poster to be completely correct.

    As for Breitbart and Tim Pool. You are free to post sources from white supremacists and nazi-adjacent folk all you like.

    Enjoy the evidence!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    So, you don't want any truthful source? Ok.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...process-second

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/u...n-control.html

    The New York Times link, which you will probably ignore, shows a video of him saying bump stocks are banned in his bill, and the video shows him saying exactly when he said on LIVE TV when he was seizing the guns, then going through due process. I mean, it is like you weren't awake when he said this shit. Not surprising you are a Trump supporter, you ignore him when he says something wrong against your beliefs, but cheer when he fucking lies out his ass about things that are known lies.
    I watched the video. He refers to people suspected of crimes. Do you understand the difference between a person suspected of a crime, and just taking guns away from everybody who isn't even a suspect, as the Democrats are proposing and as they tried in Virginia?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Well, I hope you enjoyed the evidence that showed the other poster to be completely correct.

    As for Breitbart and Tim Pool. You are free to post sources from white supremacists and nazi-adjacent folk all you like.

    Enjoy the evidence!!!
    No, his "evidence" is bullshit. Trump is referring to suspects, not to regular people, and he's entirely correct. People who are suspected of taking part in a crime SHOULD have their guns removed until the court of law says they're innocent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asrialol View Post
    Just quit already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Shut the hell up. You mindless consumers are why these companies get away with doing scummy shit with their products.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    I watched the video. He refers to people suspected of crimes. Do you understand the difference between a person suspected of a crime, and just taking guns away from everybody who isn't even a suspect, as the Democrats are proposing and as they tried in Virginia?

    - - - Updated - - -



    No, his "evidence" is bullshit. Trump is referring to suspects, not to regular people, and he's entirely correct. People who are suspected of taking part in a crime SHOULD have their guns removed until the court of law says they're innocent.
    His evidence backs up his claim perfectly. It's odd that you feel anyone can accuse you of a crime, and you should automatically have your firearms taken away. Very well, you are hereby accused of assault. The police will be by shortly.

    It's a shame Trump banned bump stocks, and called for gun confiscation... don't you think?

    Your hatred of the United States Constitution is noted, thanks.
    Last edited by Machismo; 2020-02-27 at 01:19 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    I watched the video. He refers to people suspected of crimes. Do you understand the difference between a person suspected of a crime, and just taking guns away from everybody who isn't even a suspect, as the Democrats are proposing and as they tried in Virginia?
    No, he isn't, he is referring to people that may be suspected of mental health issues. At least with Democrats' plan you have to get a court order to get the guns seized.

    And I just read your entire post, in Virginia, you still have due process and need a court order before your guns are seized, Trump is saying ANYONE should have their guns seized and then they get due process. Not surprising you are doing the Trump method of "what he really meant was" bullshit.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    His evidence backs up his claim perfectly.

    It's a shame Trump banned bump stocks, and called for gun confiscation... don't you think?

    Your hatred of the United States Constitution is noted, thanks.
    Ok, bro. I guess we can agree that we will never agree.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asrialol View Post
    Just quit already.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Shut the hell up. You mindless consumers are why these companies get away with doing scummy shit with their products.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Ok, bro. I guess we can agree that we will never agree.
    I can agree that the video evidence is damning.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Lol. Whenever I cite Breitbart or Tim Pool, I get ridiculed for citing right-wing sources, but when people cite left-wing sources, it's alright.
    LMAO.

    RULES FOR THEE, BUT NOT FOR ME.
    Breitbart are known liars, fail multiple fact checks, and Tim Pool is a known grifter shilling for right wing White Nationalists. Best friends with the likes of Baked Alaska, Brittany Pettibone, James Allsup, Vincent James, and White Nationalist Barbie Lauren Southern who keeps pushing the "Great Replacement" conspiracy theory.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    No, he isn't, he is referring to people that may be suspected of mental health issues. At least with Democrats' plan you have to get a court order to get the guns seized.

    And I just read your entire post, in Virginia, you still have due process and need a court order before your guns are seized, Trump is saying ANYONE should have their guns seized and then they get due process. Not surprising you are doing the Trump method of "what he really meant was" bullshit.
    It's funny that he's upset with the Democrats in Virginia, when Trump called for far more authoritarian measures.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    It's funny that he's upset with the Democrats in Virginia, when Trump called for far more authoritarian measures.
    Yep, it is in their bill that they have to get a court order, and essentially due process, before guns can be seized, but Trump said the exact opposite. Take the guns first then do due process. And he says it is meant for people that are suspected of crimes, and even then, if people are merely suspected of crimes, then Trump, if he has guns, could have all of them seized because he is suspected of PLENTY of crimes, even being an unindicted co-conspirator in the Michael Cohen case.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    Yep, it is in their bill that they have to get a court order, and essentially due process, before guns can be seized, but Trump said the exact opposite. Take the guns first then do due process. And he says it is meant for people that are suspected of crimes, and even then, if people are merely suspected of crimes, then Trump, if he has guns, could have all of them seized because he is suspected of PLENTY of crimes, even being an unindicted co-conspirator in the Michael Cohen case.
    Trumpsters:

    Gun confiscation without due process... good.

    Gun confiscation with due process... bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

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