If you had to pick one. Nationalism, Socialism?

[NED funded]

Must be nice to be so privileged.

Sorry dude I dont want to love your violent fetish

[Jotaux]

Its hilarious to see people so ignorant of the world around them that they screech about socialism while currently enjoying its benefits.

[JohnBrown1917]

Sorry dude I dont want to love your violent fetish

Yeah, I get it, violence is only okay against the poor and minorities.

[PC2]

Whichever one is less coercive at any given point in time.

[Doctor Amadeus]

So essentially you made this thread to tell people who support nationalism that they are wrong.

No that is my opinion based on the facts. If I was going to tell people what to believe I would have said in the OP hey you should do this. However like always you made a fucking post to bitch about whatever bullshit you made up.

[Aurgjelme]

Civic nationalism all the way baby! There simply is no other ideology that comes close.
Living in a Scandinavian country I am already blessed!

[PC2]

Its hilarious to see people so ignorant of the world around them that they screech about socialism while currently enjoying its benefits.

That's not a strong argument though because the same argument is equally true in reverse form. For example;

"It's hilarious to see people screech about nationalism and the nation of Canada while currently enjoying the welfare hand-out their nation gives to him."

[Endus]

That's not a strong argument though because the same argument is equally true in reverse form. For example;

"It's hilarious to see people screech about nationalism and the nation of Canada while currently enjoying the welfare hand-out their nation gives to him."

"Nationalism" doesn't mean "a nation exists", dude. Stop misusing words.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/nationalism

Nationalism, ideology based on the premise that the individual’s loyalty and devotion to the nation-state surpass other individual or group interests.

It isn't "supporting your country's existence". There's no contradiction in the two factors you described. The "nation of Canada" is not an iteration of nationalist sentiments, and the provision of welfare is not against those national interests.

Edit: I'll also link SMBC's rundown of the distinction between "patriotism" and "nationalism", since the two words are not synonyms; https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/an...nt-distinction

[Low Hanging Fruit]

what? churchill is contemporaneous of stalin, and differently than stalin he hadnt to pick up an highly isolated nation that just ended a civil war. damn, stalin was an orrible person, but at least he won the war and made urss a superpower after all the famines.
churchill sacrificed with scorched earth 3 millions of indians and laughted at them asking himself how gandhi was still alive


actually yes, using the same measures that allow to inflate urss up to 20M, british' india suffer something like 100M.

Fair enough. Now incriminate them all. Then link it's reasoning to socialism instead of say.. colonialism.

[Teleros]

That's the part you guys dont get, nationalism is socialism.

Someone's too short for this ride...

[Machismo]

Someone's too short for this ride...

Nationalism... it always end up being an attempt to restrict the movement of labor and capital, a direct attack on capitalism.

Nationalism is socialism.

[Cockus Maximus]

If you had to pick one ideology in a elected official Nationalism, Socialism?

Between the two I’m going with socialism.

Stupid poll is stupid.

You're attempting to compare economic policy (Socialism) with social policy (Nationalism).

As someone already mentioned, I'd like your opinion on whether you prefer apples or tennis rackets?

[kail]

Nationalism... it always end up being an attempt to restrict the movement of labor and capital, a direct attack on capitalism.

Nationalism is socialism.

Nationalists can be against socialism as well. The two are as related as fruits and smartphones. Socialism is an economic ideology while nationalism is more on perception and loyalty.

[JohnBrown1917]

Stupid poll is stupid.

You're attempting to compare economic policy (Socialism) with social policy (Nationalism).

As someone already mentioned, I'd like your opinion on whether you prefer apples or tennis rackets?

Socialist idealogy is more than just an economic view.

[Machismo]

Nationalists can be against socialism as well. The two are as related as fruits and smartphones. Socialism is an economic ideology while nationalism is more on perception and loyalty.

They can be against complete socialism. They can say they don't want to be like Venezuela, while still pushing their own form of socialism. But, the second you get the government involved to control the means of production, then you are sliding down that scale of socialism. We've come to accept that socialism is more of a sliding scale, and not the absolute last stop before communism. Otherwise, the word is rather meaningless in its current usage... because so very few people would be actual socialists.

[Teleros]

Nationalism... it always end up being an attempt to restrict the movement of labor and capital, a direct attack on capitalism.

Restricting the movement of labour & capital =/= socialism. You'd have to redefine "socialism" to mean, near as damnit, "any kind of government whatsoever*", which is a retarded definition.

*Lest you think I'm exaggerating, prison & taxes are both restrictions on the mobility of labour & capital respectively. Compulsory schooling, even if the only one doing the compelling is the parent, is a restriction on labour mobility too, come to think of it.

Nationalists can be against socialism as well. The two are as related as fruits and smartphones. Socialism is an economic ideology while nationalism is more on perception and loyalty.

Nice to see that some other people get it.

[Endus]

Restricting the movement of labour & capital =/= socialism. You'd have to redefine "socialism" to mean, near as damnit, "any kind of government whatsoever*", which is a retarded definition.

*Lest you think I'm exaggerating, prison & taxes are both restrictions on the mobility of labour & capital respectively. Compulsory schooling, even if the only one doing the compelling is the parent, is a restriction on labour mobility too, come to think of it.


Nice to see that some other people get it.

It's particularly silly when even Adam Smith recognized that you'd need to restrict the movement of capital and the actions of producers, in protecting the rights of consumers. That literally is capitalist theory, right from the start; the anarcho-capitalism nonsense is nationalist mercantilism, without even the structure of nationalism. It celebrates and fosters everything capitalism was meant to fix.

[Teleros]

It's particularly silly when even Adam Smith recognized that you'd need to restrict the movement of capital and the actions of producers, in protecting the rights of consumers. That literally is capitalist theory, right from the start; the anarcho-capitalism nonsense is nationalist mercantilism, without even the structure of nationalism. It celebrates and fosters everything capitalism was meant to fix.

It's not even that - mercantilism is basically a form of protectionism, anarcho-capitalism is... just a mess. Had to give a talk on David Friedman's work on it for university - suffice it to say it starts in Sir Thomas More's Utopia and gets more fanciful from there.

[kail]

They can be against complete socialism. They can say they don't want to be like Venezuela, while still pushing their own form of socialism. But, the second you get the government involved to control the means of production, then you are sliding down that scale of socialism. We've come to accept that socialism is more of a sliding scale, and not the absolute last stop before communism. Otherwise, the word is rather meaningless in its current usage... because so very few people would be actual socialists.

Ok that's true but still has zero to do with nationalism. Nationalism is more personal than economical. Do you hold your country above all else and ignore its flaws? Congrats you fit in with nationalism.

[Cizr]

These two are not related but answer is simple - nationalism.

When Germans tried to genocide us it was nationalism that helped us survive.

On the other hand german national socialism and then soviet socialism ruined our country.