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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Mungho View Post
    It really irritates me how deferential to Anduin Genn is here. You're still a king, Genn, albeit of a destroyed kingdom.
    It certainly is out of character. Genn treats the armistice as nothing. "We don't know if the Zanadari are involved, so lets just go ahead and violate the armistice because they might be". But that is in character for Genn. But then Anduin is suppose to consider it important but he is all "OK, that's a reasonable point of view".

  2. #102
    I am Murloc! Varodoc's Avatar
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    "Tyrande is trying to frame the Horde" is the new "Greymane burned Teldrassil and framed Sylvanas". New expansion, same old arguments
    How could I ever have loved someone so weak? Let us hope Arator did not inherit your cowardice.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    I think misdirection is the main implication, yes. But more likely it's down to Sylvanas and her loyal Dark Rangers (apparently) trying to drive a wedge between the Horde and the Zandalari, probably dovetailing with Sylvanas' goal of eliminating Bwonsamdi - if the Zandalari lose the support of the Horde they become isolated once more, thus making Bwonsamdi and Talanji much softer targets.
    Sounds like a sound assumption.

    This also would make sense with the statement: "As Zekhan and Talanji work to save Bwonsamdi, their journey will be a key turning point in bolstering the Horde against the coming darkness and finding themselves and they may rediscover what makes the Horde strong."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    "Tyrande is trying to frame the Horde" is the new "Greymane burned Teldrassil and framed Sylvanas". New expansion, same old arguments
    Most likely, is not that the idea of Tyrande framing the Horde is bad, is just that, it would be a twist, and we know that Blizzard will go with the most obvious reason as it was shown with the burning of Teldrassil fiasco

  4. #104
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    - Anduin is the leader of the Alliance. He's delegating, it's pretty obvious having a 1000 year veteren as the commander of your forces is a good idea.
    - The Alleria Windrunner thing is just nitpicky, it's a formal order - and we know Anduin is a formal person - is it really that strange to you that he addresses her with her full name?
    - There is nothing to suggest Zandalar isn't a continent
    - Again, there is nothing to suggest Dark Rangers aren't the most skilled group of archers in Warcraft, and even then - Genn could just be being hyperbolic as he often is
    what exactly make u not think they can shit on lore like they always do and change dark rangers lore?
    and no according to last book dark rangers should be worse as @Combatbutler said, after all it was their shit idea to make undead from scourge to weakling pathetic creatures
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall
    http://youtu.be/x3ejO7Nssj8 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  5. #105
    Titan Maxilian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    If the Vision of N'Zoth show anything, she's as unstable as literally anyone living in either Stormwind or Orgrimmar, Thrall included.
    The visions are N'zoth ideal world, so i wouldn't take it as anything, and is silly to not say that she's "dangerous" to a point, but she's going with the other side of the coin (Turalyon), so one another can keep them in check if needed (so IMHO a good idea to send the 2 together, also they have been working together for quite a long time, so they should have good teamwork)

  6. #106
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    "Tyrande is trying to frame the Horde" is the new "Greymane burned Teldrassil and framed Sylvanas". New expansion, same old arguments
    i don't blame any twist expectation, if anyone fucked us in it it was blizz
    after insisting that 'it isn't what it looks like' and 'its not what appears to be' and made everyone think of even most ridiculous twist, it ends up what it actually looks like.. they flat out lied probably to misdirect us
    so claiming greymane burned teldrassil blame it on blizz themselves, they are the ones who insisted it wasn't sylvanas.. then event came out and it was...
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall
    http://youtu.be/x3ejO7Nssj8 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  7. #107
    Titan Maxilian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    and no according to last book dark rangers should be worse as @Combatbutler said, after all it was their shit idea to make undead from scourge to weakling pathetic creatures
    I wouldn't say that the Dark Rangers are the best Rangers in the world (Sylvanas may be, but that does not mean every Dark Ranger is), but the part that Combatbutler mentioned is supposed to be contrarested with the use of Shadow Magic (That's the whole idea of it).

    Again, not saying that they are the best rangers in the world, though IMHO i think they would be better "assasins" than most rangers.

  8. #108
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by formerShandalay View Post
    At least she hasn't effed things up more than anyone else yet. I mean, she might not be the best pick at first glance, but Turalyon/Alleria is a much better pick than Genn/Rogers.
    i'd send a cow bell over Alleria, Alleria is a walking ticking bomb that will fuck everyone, and it doesn't fit alliance image at all either
    I can understand horde work with shady shit (and backfire in their faces) since they do that since classic, but alliance ? It was a very painful throat shoving process that need to be fixed asap
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall
    http://youtu.be/x3ejO7Nssj8 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  9. #109
    I am Murloc! Varodoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    The visions are N'zoth ideal world, so i wouldn't take it as anything, and is silly to not say that she's "dangerous" to a point, but she's going with the other side of the coin (Turalyon), so one another can keep them in check if needed (so IMHO a good idea to send the 2 together, also they have been working together for quite a long time, so they should have good teamwork)
    She is dangerous, but she's not more likely to fall prey to the whispers than others. While it's true that she is closer to the whispers, she also has knowledge to resist them, knowledge that other mortals don't possess. Plus everyone can be corrupted by the Void, even Titans can succumb to it. Everyone is a walking ticking bomb. Benedictus was the most pious man in the world, but even he succumbed to the whispers due to a series of unfortunate circumstances.
    How could I ever have loved someone so weak? Let us hope Arator did not inherit your cowardice.

  10. #110
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    I wouldn't say that the Dark Rangers are the best Rangers in the world (Sylvanas may be, but that does not mean every Dark Ranger is), but the part that Combatbutler mentioned is supposed to be contrarested with the use of Shadow Magic (That's the whole idea of it).

    Again, not saying that they are the best rangers in the world, though IMHO i think they would be better "assasins" than most rangers.
    yes shadow magic should improve them, but Before The Storm came along and showed us a twisted version of forsaken that never existed in wow before, a weak near death crumbling forsaken who can't improve in anything in fact they just exist to suffer a very painful long death
    so yes lore is f8cked up (surprise) and dark rangers can both be some of best rangers (old lore) or total shit rangers since they are undead (BFA lore), they can use whatever serve them in that book

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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    and why in the ass someone woul write "his stoically handsome face pinched" in this book, Jesus, thats was awful and cringe
    blizz love to hire shit writers, even great writers like Christie who wrote rise of the horde, now gave us before the storm, a book so emotional that it feels like a teen drama more than a warcraft movie
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall
    http://youtu.be/x3ejO7Nssj8 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    She is dangerous, but she's not more likely to fall prey to the whispers than others. While it's true that she is closer to the whispers, she also has knowledge to resist them, knowledge that other mortals don't possess. Plus everyone can be corrupted by the Void, even Titans can succumb to it. Everyone is a walking ticking bomb. Benedictus was the most pious man in the world, but even he succumbed to the whispers due to a series of unfortunate circumstances.
    Not sure if i totally agree with that idea, i do think that everyone is able to be corrupted, but i wouldn't call them a ticking bomb, though, to be fair, i don't think she's a ticking bomb in the sense that she will fall into corruption, is mostly that she would "spread" corruption, like with the Sunwell or the creation of more Void Elves (Those are ticking bomb, they don't have her expertise, some may, but not all)

  12. #112
    Titan Daemos daemonium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    yes shadow magic should improve them, but Before The Storm came along and showed us a twisted version of forsaken that never existed in wow before, a weak near death crumbling forsaken who can't improve in anything in fact they just exist to suffer a very painful long death
    so yes lore is f8cked up (surprise) and dark rangers can both be some of best rangers (old lore) or total shit rangers since they are undead (BFA lore), they can use whatever serve them in that book
    I could be wrong but I’m pretty sure BTS only laid out that being a normal undead is like that. I don’t think it comments on the higher levels of undead like DK’s, those who went though the dark mirror process or stronger undead like sylvanas.

    It could very well be that most dark rangers loyal to sylvanas are those of the none decaying kind.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    yes shadow magic should improve them, but Before The Storm came along and showed us a twisted version of forsaken that never existed in wow before, a weak near death crumbling forsaken who can't improve in anything in fact they just exist to suffer a very painful long death
    so yes lore is f8cked up (surprise) and dark rangers can both be some of best rangers (old lore) or total shit rangers since they are undead (BFA lore), they can use whatever serve them in that book
    It seems i have to reread that book, cause i mostly remember it being like that for those that have... "resigned" themselves to their state -being those many that appear in the interchange in Arathi-, cause many forsaken just would "replace" what they needed as time passes.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    i'd send a cow bell over Alleria, Alleria is a walking ticking bomb that will fuck everyone, and it doesn't fit alliance image at all either
    I can understand horde work with shady shit (and backfire in their faces) since they do that since classic, but alliance ? It was a very painful throat shoving process that need to be fixed asap
    I don't think she's that bad. I mean, we've had so many people in the Alliance taken over by shadowy stuff, and none of them ever seem to have put on any kind of resistance to it. Not even the Light-aligned ones. Two archbishops of the church of the Light have fallen to the Shadow with apparently no means of stopping it or anyone else realizing it before it was too late. At lest now someone can actually teach how to resist the Shadow and in Legion she even made a potion to actually bring back the minds of Broken that had already been consumed by the void. Which.... somehow got fogotten and Wrathion had to create a new one and now gets to sell it all as his very own unique invention, but still.
    I think she is as much a danger as everyone else. A little closer to the void, because she has it in her, but a little more resistant because she knows how to deal with it, so it's even. And she may be able to teach a thing or two about it, before she falls (if she does).
    What makes her a sub-optimal pick against Sylvanas in my opinion is their relationship. Her emotional baggage may become a liability in several ways, which is why usually no one gets sent on crucial missions where they have any kind of personal axe to grind or that concerns an actual close relative.

  15. #115
    I am Murloc! Varodoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    Not sure if i totally agree with that idea, i do think that everyone is able to be corrupted, but i wouldn't call them a ticking bomb, though, to be fair, i don't think she's a ticking bomb in the sense that she will fall into corruption, is mostly that she would "spread" corruption, like with the Sunwell or the creation of more Void Elves (Those are ticking bomb, they don't have her expertise, some may, but not all)
    To be honest, I don't think that's likely to happen... because at the end of the day we already see what would happen thanks to the Visions of N'Zoth. So it's unlikely they'd literally do a carbon copy of that in the main timeline. If she does succumb to the whispers eventually, the consequences will not be so devastating and she might snap out of it.

    So at this point I don't want to say that Alleria and Umbric have plot armor... but since we already see them going mad in the Visions of N'Zoth, I doubt Blizzard will play with that idea again.
    How could I ever have loved someone so weak? Let us hope Arator did not inherit your cowardice.

  16. #116
    Herald of the Titans Maljinwo's Avatar
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    Im still waiting for the Lightforged vs Void Elves short story that should've happened as soon as they joined the Alliance

    Im not even asking for full blown civil war.
    But are you telling me that the Lightforged who even captured Alleria because she was dabbling with the void aren't going to react to a whole race of Void crazies alongside them?
    This world don't give us nothing. It be our lot to suffer... and our duty to fight back.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Maljinwo View Post
    Im still waiting for the Lightforged vs Void Elves short story that should've happened as soon as they joined the Alliance

    Im not even asking for full blown civil war.
    But are you telling me that the Lightforged who even captured Alleria because she was dabbling with the void aren't going to react to a whole race of Void crazies alongside them?
    The Lightforged had no problem with her being there in Legion, not even after she 'ate' the naaru. Why would they suddenly have a problem with Alleria now? I mean, the other voidelves may be more of a problem, because they were not actually in control at the time they got turned and only snapped out of it when Alleria came along (but that is true for the void-consumed Broken as well and no one had a problem with them in Legion either), but that is none of the Lightforgeds' concern, is it? They don't actually interact much with them.
    I also don't think that the voidelves are suddenly being liked by everyone and there is no mistrust or something towards them. I mean, it's made obvious to you if you roll one, that you may not be greeted with open arms by everyone and you get politely asked to leave the cathedral, should you go there ^^. But that's also more of a Stormwind thing, not a Lightforged thing.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minikin View Post
    Man does Genn not ever learn lol. How many times must this dude be humbled (justified and not justified) to get his temper in control. Honestly next time he throws a hissy fit he should be reminded that last time he went on his anger crusade, he lost a FLYING AIRCRAFT CARRIER, to a bunch of SHIPS, while having the moment of surprising and firing the first shot. If i had a loss like that on my book, id talk a bit more slow.
    I think it's more fitting for his temper to flare. I just don't like how he's being babysat by "new son", or they can't explore his surly personality in different ways.
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  19. #119
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    I could be wrong but I’m pretty sure BTS only laid out that being a normal undead is like that. I don’t think it comments on the higher levels of undead like DK’s, those who went though the dark mirror process or stronger undead like sylvanas.

    It could very well be that most dark rangers loyal to sylvanas are those of the none decaying kind.
    an undead body decay and dies with time, the dark mirror process is only done to Danuser i mean Nathanos, and DKs are totally different story since they were risen personally by LK himself
    Of course in BFA we get a joke of LK rise rest so - as i said - the state of lore isn't clear at all, but the most recent, they should be mediocre at best for ranged attacks
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall
    http://youtu.be/x3ejO7Nssj8 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Maljinwo View Post
    Im still waiting for the Lightforged vs Void Elves short story that should've happened as soon as they joined the Alliance

    Im not even asking for full blown civil war.
    But are you telling me that the Lightforged who even captured Alleria because she was dabbling with the void aren't going to react to a whole race of Void crazies alongside them?
    The Lightforged stood there doing nothing when some half-demon elf blew up the very incarnation of the Light they worship with Fel magic after he refused her blessing. Being this passive about their faith is par for the course.

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