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  1. #21
    Loved the SWTOR story, hated the quests. Too many boring filler ones with a lot of walking. Worse than other MMOs on average. So unless they fixed that...

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Martymark View Post
    Loved the SWTOR story, hated the quests. Too many boring filler ones with a lot of walking. Worse than other MMOs on average. So unless they fixed that...
    They 'fixed' it by allowing to level to cap with nothing but main storyline.
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  3. #23
    Bloodsail Admiral Snowflakesz's Avatar
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    Loved it back in the day, the main story campaign's we're nothing short of amazing.
    End game on release was pretty bad though.

    But the problem with the game, was always the sluggish gameplay. Not sure how to best describe it, but it was slow, unresponsive and clunky...
    It's really the same reason why the Elder Scrolls MMO is hot garbage, playing the game feels awful, when you're used to WoW.
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  4. #24
    The Lightbringer The-Shan's Avatar
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    No, the appeal of SWTOR is its legacy content. Its engine sucks, it's like the only game that uses the hero engine.
    thinly veiled high elf thread

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflakesz View Post
    Loved it back in the day, the main story campaign's we're nothing short of amazing.
    End game on release was pretty bad though.

    But the problem with the game, was always the sluggish gameplay. Not sure how to best describe it, but it was slow, unresponsive and clunky...
    It's really the same reason why the Elder Scrolls MMO is hot garbage, playing the game feels awful, when you're used to WoW.
    I agree 100%. Great voice-acting performances, I think they tell some really good stories, but I think the visuals are pretty bad, and the core gameplay is just a mess, imo.

    I'd almost prefer if they just took the stories, and applied them to a completely different game altogether. Hell, I'd be happy even just using them as part of a Star Wars Battlefield game, maybe just nixing the "filler" quests.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    My biggest reason for doubt is the MMO fad seems to have ran it's course. New ones are a lot less common these days than 10 years ago when every 4 to 6 months you had the next "Wow killer" releasing.
    I'm not sure that's true.

    With the power of hindsight, you can kinda a see "why" a lot of those "WoW Killer" MMO's failed.
    Age of conan: Released 2008
    Aion: Released 2008 / 9
    FFXIV 1.0: Released in 2010
    Rift: Released 2011
    SWTOR: Released 2011

    2008-2011 was pretty much the age of the "WoW Killers", yet when you look up how WoW went, you can pretty much say that this era was part of WoW's prime, yet exactly there you had a bunch of companies their MMO competitor.
    I don't want to go into detail where the issues of each game did lie, but challenging the topdog during its prime most certainly contributed to their downfall.

    When we look further, we have two MMO's released later on:
    Wildstar: released 2014
    FFXIV 2.0: released 2015

    While Wildstar was a game that had its own set of specific issues, FFXIV most certainly scooped up some of the WoW audience, while not as big as WoW, it managed to establish itself.

    Another issue is that video games tend to cannibalize each other, you don't have that many games floating around in a given genre, with MMO's you have the additional layer of social mechanics, when one guy within your group flat out refuses to play another MMO - that may force the hand of other people to stick with WoW rather than make a switch.

    I think the "WoW Killer" boom also was caused by overly ambitious investors wanting to get a share of the pie from WoW and then threw money at anyone willing to create an MMO, yet that game type is very difficult to develop because you not only need to create a decent game but also recognize that the social mechanics of the game add another layer of complexity to its design.
    When someone in a single player does their own thing, that's one thing, but in MMO's it usually also affects other people.

    I think the failure of those WoW killers was to some extent that they were released at the wrong time, possibly due to pressure by those investors who were getting anxious when they saw the 10M+ sub reports from WoW during that time.

    Of course, those failures scared away a lot of other investors, especially because MMO have a huge development time, require massive resources and people that know their shit in the right positions.

    Now however, the landscape is different, WoW no longer is in that unquestionable position, i don't think it's unfair to say that the last 6-7 years have been pretty rough for WoW.
    I think it's no coincidence that Riot has sniped some Blizzard devs and now want to develop their own MMO - they smell blood in the water.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    I'm not sure that's true.

    With the power of hindsight, you can kinda a see "why" a lot of those "WoW Killer" MMO's failed.
    Age of conan: Released 2008
    Aion: Released 2008 / 9
    FFXIV 1.0: Released in 2010
    Rift: Released 2011
    SWTOR: Released 2011

    2008-2011 was pretty much the age of the "WoW Killers", yet when you look up how WoW went, you can pretty much say that this era was part of WoW's prime, yet exactly there you had a bunch of companies their MMO competitor.
    I don't want to go into detail where the issues of each game did lie, but challenging the topdog during its prime most certainly contributed to their downfall.

    When we look further, we have two MMO's released later on:
    Wildstar: released 2014
    FFXIV 2.0: released 2015

    While Wildstar was a game that had its own set of specific issues, FFXIV most certainly scooped up some of the WoW audience, while not as big as WoW, it managed to establish itself.

    Another issue is that video games tend to cannibalize each other, you don't have that many games floating around in a given genre, with MMO's you have the additional layer of social mechanics, when one guy within your group flat out refuses to play another MMO - that may force the hand of other people to stick with WoW rather than make a switch.

    I think the "WoW Killer" boom also was caused by overly ambitious investors wanting to get a share of the pie from WoW and then threw money at anyone willing to create an MMO, yet that game type is very difficult to develop because you not only need to create a decent game but also recognize that the social mechanics of the game add another layer of complexity to its design.
    When someone in a single player does their own thing, that's one thing, but in MMO's it usually also affects other people.

    I think the failure of those WoW killers was to some extent that they were released at the wrong time, possibly due to pressure by those investors who were getting anxious when they saw the 10M+ sub reports from WoW during that time.

    Of course, those failures scared away a lot of other investors, especially because MMO have a huge development time, require massive resources and people that know their shit in the right positions.

    Now however, the landscape is different, WoW no longer is in that unquestionable position, i don't think it's unfair to say that the last 6-7 years have been pretty rough for WoW.
    I think it's no coincidence that Riot has sniped some Blizzard devs and now want to develop their own MMO - they smell blood in the water.
    Good news then. I never said WoW was a king or anything. I mean if you think spending a ton of money on an MMO and the continuous support it takes with money and development is less risky then dropping a lame mobile game once a year for pennis on thd dollar of an MMO and it racking in tons of money, well, to each thier own. Also take into account tbat I don't want it this way. I just see it as the way it is.

    Don't get to defensive about it. Its nothing personal. I view being right about this as equal as being wrong about it. I don't get paid for it, i don't get fame or clot, the games that will release will release or not no matter what I post here. It's just an opinion without much need of a novel.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    Sadly, not a chance at this point.

    The game is too old. The engine used has been an issue since launch and I can't see any company putting in the effort with the current product given the original 8 class stories is the best this game has to offer still to this day.
    I really enjoyed the Fallen Empire and Eternal Throne. I think the biggest problem with all of the SWTOR expansions is that there is not enough story content unique to each class. That class identity was one of the best and most unique things about SWTOR. I understand why they moved away from it - creating 8 different stories of roughly equal value and fun is difficult, especially when many/most players will only experience 1 or 2 of the storylines.
    Last edited by Lightforged; 2021-04-16 at 04:42 PM.

  9. #29
    I played original SWTOR as well and really like it but the experience was ruined by the technical issues (low fps) on my PC of the time.

    If they make Jawas playable this time i would join immediately. What i did not like when i played (at the start of SWTOR) was the lack races. And i am a hardcore Jawa fanboy ^^

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    My biggest reason for doubt is the MMO fad seems to have ran it's course. New ones are a lot less common these days than 10 years ago when every 4 to 6 months you had the next "Wow killer" releasing.

    But yeah, those two companies and the IP COULD do it for sure. The better question is should. Hell they probably poop out mobile games for pennies on the dollar of an MMO and post record profits on it. Sucks for people like me that would love a deep Star Wars MMO. But it is just how I see it. They just don't want to spend the money to do it, to maintain it, and to continuously add new content. You can even see it in the expansions of SWTOR. It goes from craziest MMO story telling ever in the original game to mission hubs and dailies really fast in expansions.

    My bet, not want but bet, is they just keep to the norm here. Drop an expansion or mission update once in a while. Maybe make some seasonal stuff and do whatever it takes to keep the shop going strong and let it ride.
    Any large, very profit oriented company probably agrees with this. Realistically MMOs seem to be less of a profitable business venture and more of a passion project thing. That's why most of the new stuff seems to pop up on kickstarter, startups and indies.

    Amazon really seems to be the only company that still wants to get into this stuff. Probably because the old EQ lead is heading up AGS.

    Anyway I fully expect any MMO games from future companies to instead be closer to the MMO-lite model Destiny uses. Shared city hub, maybe a few free-roam zones, queue for PVP bgs and PVE dungeons. Everything relatively broken up and instanced. etc

  11. #31
    The problem with Star Wars games is that while they are a bit prohibitive to people who aren't hardcore fans of the franchise, they don't attract as many hardcore fans as mmorpg games need to be successful. So basically on one hand someone who isn't already a star wars fan of some sort is unlikely to play the game at all, and on the other many SW fans won't pick up the game because the franchise is not primarily gaming based, but movie based. FF and WoW do not have those issues as they are both franchises with decades old tradition in gaming and that's their main medium of choice.

  12. #32
    Nop. There will never be a new big succesfull MMORPG again until wow will be let go by Blizz.

    No matter what you think about current wow. Millions of players come back to it every new expansion. Maybe they leave again. But they still payed Blizz around 100 €$ whatever each. People who play wow will nearly always come back to wow if they want to play MMOs (which is a shrinking base of players for years).

    Some of them look into other MMOs from time to time but most of them just float by like FF14, ESO and Swtor. Succesfull? Sure. SUccesfull enough for another big investor? Nop. Noone wants to compete with wow on that scale anymore.

    Kickstarter manages to spew out a project here and there but none of them ever get finished or keep what they promised.

    There won't be another Star Wars MMO. There will be however tons of games like battlefront where they can suck you dry via microtransactions. Because THOSE are the most profitable games ever. Not even wow can compete with that. Look at fortnite, candy crush, lol and stuff like that. Companies want to invest into that.

    Why amazon decided to test this market still eludes me. New world will be quite succesfull at the start given the exposure it got. But as every other MMO it will die quickly.

  13. #33
    Scarab Lord Triggered Fridgekin's Avatar
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    You really have to look at the reason as to why FF14 got to where it is. We're talking a game which had so many critical core flaws that the only way to address it was an end-of-the-world event in order to rebuild from scratch which is where ARR starts off from. As a show of good faith they decided to do this in order to regain player trust rather than bury it and move on. Redemption through destruction.

    EA likely just sees it as a question on how long they can get a return on investment. If they even did consider a new Star Wars MMO, I suspect they'd just start a new one from scratch and learn what they can from TOR on how to cut costs.
    Last edited by Triggered Fridgekin; 2021-04-16 at 05:27 PM.
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  14. #34
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
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    No offense but even if they could, I don't want an MMO set in the era of "This is a vessel called vessel, piloted by a dude who can't be distinguished from a bigass rock unless you are also a member of this rock species"

    Let's keep the era of creative bankruptcy away from the video games.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Shibito View Post
    SWTOR is great ff14 is just not good i get people wanting it to be a good mmorpg to fight wow but it really isnt a good mmo SWTOR is way better.
    I second this. What the FUCK are those tutorial/beginning zone quests lmao

    The world was just ugly. Like, F2P mobile game MMO ugly.

  16. #36
    It definitely could not, and they won`t even try it. SWTOR is pretty healthy, and i love it. I totally disagree about quest. Questing should not just be go there kill 5 of this or bring 5 of this, and thats it. In SWTOR every quest has some story to tell and there is 100% sense in doing it. And if you feel when you doing it. And i don`t think that quests should be 1-2 minutes long, as some suggests or to be super fast/close as position.
    I don`t see a problem with exploring a bit. This is the purpose of big games like this, and with the Open World games(SWTOR is not kinda open world, but there is tons of worlds).
    Not everyone is there to just hit the end game and repat the same s**** 24/7. Just because some bots think that this is the way the game should be played, that doesn`t mean it is.
    I`m playing MMORPG and story games like Witcher, Assassin`s Creed, SW related games, to take my time and enjoy it. The game offer so much to do, unless again if you are playing 24/7, then any game out there will become stale and boring for quite fast.

    As far as combat, for the year SWTOR comes out, its one of the best gameplay that could be made. Rotation is actually rotation, not just mindlessly spam 2-3 skills, like some other MMORPG out there. Is it perfect tho ? No definitely. But so far there isn`t a MMORPG with even close to perfect combat/gameplay.
    But the problem most of the time is the scrubs players that need to feel powerful, even they s****** at gaming. MMORPG should focus way more on Skill-Wise combat based gameplay. I know there will be so many whiners that x and y thing will be to hard for them and they don`t feel powerful enough, but there is also a ton of people who wants to play a skill-based game, where they improve over period of time, and their mechanical skills actually matter for something, unlike current MMORPG.
    Player skill should matter, like in FPS and Moba games for example. This is what gaming is evolving atm and why so many people are playing FPS and Moba games.
    But again a lot of scrubs, who think they are "great", but are actually quite sh... will start complaining really fast, but they should be straight away muted.

  17. #37
    Pit Lord Roxinius's Avatar
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    not a chance sadly they would be better off just launching a whole new game to ditch the horrid engine
    Well then get your shit together.
    Get it all together. And put it in a backpack. All your shit. So it’s together. And if you gotta take it somewhere, take it somewhere, you know, take it to the shit store and sell it, or put it in a shit museum, I don’t care what you do, you just gotta get it together.
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  18. #38
    I used to play this game when it first launched and didn't realize the engine was such an issue. Why exactly is the engine so bad? Just curious.
    Why am I back here, I don't even play these games anymore

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  19. #39
    The engine is nowhere near the top problem with the game. The problem is that EA stripped the studio almost bare and they have a miniscule dev team so there's barely any new content.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyris Flare View Post
    The problem is that EA stripped the studio almost bare and they have a miniscule dev team so there's barely any new content.
    Kinda. It's likely not bringing in much money, and really hasn't for quite some time. It had a great bump around KotFE but that didn't seem to last long. It's scoped out to support the current playerbase/revenue stream, which means it likely doesn't have a "full" team working on it. If it was bringing in more money it'd have more devs devoted to it, but sadly while it did recover a bit with the F2P launch and the KotFE arc (other expansions didn't seem to do as much for the game) it's never quite hit the kind of numbers to devote a very big team to : /

    The studio isn't "bare" though, the staff are just working on other projects. They were doing that modern fantasy game for a hot-second until it got canned, they were doing a ton of the lifting with Anthem for a while, they're supporting other multiplayer elements within games etc., just not sticking solely or even primarily to SWTOR anymore.

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