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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Reinhart11 View Post
    Because outside from faction conflict expansions the Horde is utterly irrelevant for the story and Blizzard can't even be bothered to use or create proper factions for them.

    That is why i have to constantly follow fucking Brann Bronzebeard from the Explorers League around with my Horde characters, instead of following Highwatcher Tae'thelan Bloodwatcher from the Reliquary. Or why i have to follow Khadgar through WoD as a Horde character, instead of some Horde mage/warlock/shaman whatever doing his job. As, again, Blizzard can't even be arsed to build up a proper Horde mage like Rommath for example.
    They feel you won't be able to relate to more appropriate characters because they are far less known, therefore less impactful.

    But it's a double edged sword. how owuld people get to know new characters if you don't use them? And new characters can be very impactful if you build them well. Look at how amazing Prince Farondis and Thalyssra wree in 7.0 , now they're using Thalyssra everywhere, shame about Prince Farondis though. hopefull if they do the highborne right, we'll see him get some great luck and be a part of the Darnassian night elves.

    It is clear they can, sometimes i think they don't care enough, it is ludicrous when i see the horde toon following Brann, would much rather Tae'thelan

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    The Ren'dorei too technically. They are an Alliance faction that accepts Horde members (see the Blood Elf scholars in Telogrus Rift).
    As traitors to their own nation, those 'scholars' have no such affiliation

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Moonrage View Post
    So what's the deal with making factions that were originally Alliance affiliated neutral? It's honestly insulting to Alliance players that iconic alliance factions are now open to the Horde. Examples of these factions include:
    I guess it is counterbalance for Horde factions being exterminated.

    - The Kirin Tor. I know that they've always had strong ties with Silvermoon but it was originally a human kingdom.
    Separate from Stormwind, which happens to be on the opposite side of the continent. They likely spent more of their history with high elves.
    And we all know how the Horde betrayed them back in MoP.
    When Kirin Tor actively sided with Alliance.
    - Argent Dawn (now Argent Crusade).
    Their founder was banished from Lordaeron(and apparently Alliance too, as Antonidas and Daelin approved that) for working with orcs long before forming Argent Dawn.
    - Knights of the Silver Hand. Originally a human organisation of Paladins, now Paladins of every race are allowed in (including Blood Elves and Tauren).
    Religious organisation independent from any kingdom. While some members used to fight for specific countries, they were also knights of their kingdoms and they did that outside of Silver Hand, which remained neutral. They allowed tauren just like they did with high elves and dwarves. After all, killing demons is the priority.

    - Cenarion Circle and Cenarion Expedition. I know this is technically a Night Elf organisation, but anyway. This one makes the least sense of them all. Not even Night Elf women were allowed in when it was first founded. Now every idiot that can grow a pumpkin gets a membership. It makes even less sense after the War of Thorns. Malfurion is the leader of the CC, why hasn't he kicked out all the Tauren and Trolls yet?
    These druids were busy healing Azeroth is Silithus for entire war.
    - The Wardens. Led by quite possible the most xenophobic Night Elf out there, yet they have no trouble working together with the Horde. Eventually bites them in the ass when Nathanos kills Sira and raises her as a forsaken.
    Wardens just paid Horde for assassinating some targets. I guess they didn't care which mercenary they will hire.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    snipped and shipped
    That was incredibly in-depth and we might as well shut down the thread here because you really hit the nail on the head
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  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by ravenmoon View Post
    They feel you won't be able to relate to more appropriate characters because they are far less known, therefore less impactful.

    But it's a double edged sword. how owuld people get to know new characters if you don't use them? And new characters can be very impactful if you build them well. Look at how amazing Prince Farondis and Thalyssra wree in 7.0 , now they're using Thalyssra everywhere, shame about Prince Farondis though.
    Yes but I think they should try. It is better to use old questgiver than to make Zekhan out of nowhere.
    hopefull if they do the highborne right, we'll see him get some great luck and be a part of the Darnassian night elves.
    Shadowlands in an opportunity to resurrect him but I doubt the will care about him when they have Kael'thas to take care of first.
    It is clear they can, sometimes i think they don't care enough, it is ludicrous when i see the horde toon following Brann, would much rather Tae'thelan
    Brann kind of fits with Magni being here but Tae'thelan should appear aswell.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  6. #46
    When they want to have a story where those factions are heavily involved it's kind of hard to not either have them allow the Horde to help them or create a separate reputation for them.

    Still, on a few of them:

    cenarion circle - we see members of them at the giant sword and the accepted explanation seems to be that they were here helping while the War of Thorns was happening. Not really fair to blame them for not knowing due to Sylvanas intentionally manipulating them to be somewhere else.

    the wardens - not anymore, that's for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Daevelian View Post
    So this is how far the Lore forum has fallen? Eesh.
    I take it back, BfA is not the lowest the games lore could have gone, this thread proves that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    And just like the thread before it, let's back away from sexualizing Azshara and return to the original topic at hand.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Moonrage View Post
    The Horde betrayed Dalaran back in MoP, remember the whole Purge of Dalaran scenario? The Horde also raided and destroyed the homeland of the leader of the Cenarion Circle.
    Dalaran sent military help to Alliance before, which means that, in fact, Sunreavers were the betrayed ones and they just had to defend their Horde.

    As for attacking the leader of the Cenarion Circle, it is the fact.

    By the way, Alliance kidnapped leader of Earthern Ring during Cataclysm, which makes it evensided problem.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  8. #48
    Legendary! Nnyco's Avatar
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    Almost like they teamed up with em during extremly dire times.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
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  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by baskev View Post
    - wardens. I think they made them a bit more cross faction to piss us of. Same reason why we do not get high elves ( or even excist according to blizz, even though they are named high elves ingame). But horde gets night elf dark rangers....
    These dark rangers are now Alliance.
    So to some it up in a bit less text: If they do not horde will cry. And we can not have horde be sad.
    Except the Horde is not content with following humans and night elves. It is Alliance crying about lack of night elf focus.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  10. #50
    Brewmaster Evaddon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moonrage View Post
    Yet the Horde has proven time and time again to be untrustworthy.
    So? No one is completely trustworthy, everyone has an agenda and something they want to achieve and besides individual actions does not make up for the whole of any people or should we all be classified by our militaries and leaders then?

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by matrix123mko View Post
    Dalaran sent military help to Alliance before, which means that, in fact, Sunreavers were the betrayed ones and they just had to defend their Horde.
    Horde attacked the Kirin Tor, both in Classic and Cataclysm - see Ambermill and the Dalaran Crater.

    Quote Originally Posted by matrix123mko View Post
    These dark rangers are now Alliance.
    They are not, per Danuser on twitter few days ago.
    Last edited by Lieutenant Commander; 2020-03-14 at 05:02 PM.

  12. #52
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    The enemy of my enemy is my friend...
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  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Not all of them were "Alliance affiliated".


    Because the current leader (Khadgar) sympathizes with the Horde.


    Just because it was founded by humans, it doesn't mean it's an Alliance faction. The Argent Dawn/Crusade's goal is to protect Azeroth, not to serve the Alliance.


    The Cenarion Circle was never an Alliance faction. Female night elves and taurens as druid was more of a gameplay concession. The 'female' thing was because, from a gameplay standpoint, made no sense to restrict players from making male NE warriors and female NE druids. The 'tauren' thing was so the Alliance did not end up with two exclusive classes, together with paladin.


    I think it was already pretty well-established, back in Legion, that that the Wardens will work with anyone, as long as it aligns with their goal. They even released the Demon Hunters, their "sworn enemy".
    I think it would have add flavor to the NE races (or any others races) if some classes were restricted by gender if it is supported by the lore.

  14. #54
    I just hope no neutral garbage Azeroth organizations follow us into Shadowlands. If they do, let me call out their bullshit and tell them that if they stopped Sylvanas in Cataclysm, none of this would be happening.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Lieutenant Commander View Post
    Horde attacked the Kirin Tor, both in Classic and Cataclysm - see Ambermill and the Dalaran Crater.


    They are not, per Danuser on twitter few days ago.
    Don't bother. Talking to horde players is like being a kettle with a small soot smudge and being called black by the charred and soot covered pot that is the horde

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Moonrage View Post
    An.
    - The Cenarion Circle was founded by the Night Elves 10 000 years ago.
    Is there actually a canon source for that? Cause im pretty sure when i read war of the ancients it was implied that Cenarius had been teaching non-night elf races like furbolgs and tauren before.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    Is there actually a canon source for that? Cause im pretty sure when i read war of the ancients it was implied that Cenarius had been teaching non-night elf races like furbolgs and tauren before.
    It was founded during the War of the Satyr, which is roughly 9300 years ago.

    And just because Cenarius had been teaching other races, doesn't change the fact that it was a Night Elf organisation from the beginning. Other races like Tauren were only allowed in after the Third War.

  18. #58
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    I always got a good laugh out of how Horde and Alliance races apparently hate each other and can't even communicate - unless they decide to join...say...the Twilight Hammer or so

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttwitch View Post
    Yes, if 99% of my Chinese employees obeyed the Chinese government when it told them to burn down the factory.
    But your employees were not with those that caused the fire. What the poster I replied to said that all Horde races should have been kicked out, regardless of affiliation.
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  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    That'd be like saying my company should fire all (for example) Chinese people from their employee list, because the Chinese government did something bad, regardless if the chinese employees agree or not with their country's government's decisions.
    Race and Nationality are WHOLLY different, and don't try to confuse *true* race from something like WoW with our social constructed race in the real world. As well, in WoW these are realistically more akin to species, not races, in the first place.

    Point being, it's not at *all* like your example of the Chinese workers.
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