Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst
1
2
3
4
5
LastLast
  1. #41
    It's time for all hoax medicine to go. Driving species like rhinos towards extinction because con artists have convinced idiots that the powder will make their privates bigger is inexcusable.

    Tradition is not an excuse for stupidity. People gutted birds, dipped another bird in its blood, and waved it on people to cure leprosy for centuries. We don't do that now.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    he non-vaxxers didn't CAUSE that person's immunocompromization. That is a personal weakness and shortcoming of that person. That's just a fact..
    Freaking what? Blaming people for being immuno-compromised? Until we're living in Gattaca where perfect genetic engineering eliminates human weakness from birth, no.
    Quote Originally Posted by Daevelian View Post
    So this is how far the Lore forum has fallen? Eesh.
    I take it back, BfA is not the lowest the games lore could have gone, this thread proves that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    And just like the thread before it, let's back away from sexualizing Azshara and return to the original topic at hand.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Nelinrah View Post
    The parts that need to go are the parts that cause the spread of diseases and the parts that encourage the poaching of endangered animals. Whatever remains after removing those parts can stay.
    So you're okay with torturing non-endangered animals by scalding them alive with boiling water?

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Fargus View Post
    So you're okay with torturing non-endangered animals by scalding them alive with boiling water?
    We do that in the west too. Just look at how lobsters are cooked.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Nelinrah View Post
    We do that in the west too. Just look at how lobsters are cooked.
    That got banned in my country, now they have to kill them beforehand.
    "Learn to overcome the crass demands of flesh and bone, for they warp the matrix through which we perceive the world. Extend your awareness outwards, beyond the self of body, to embrace the self of group and the self of humanity. The goals of the group and the greater race are transcendent, and to embrace them is to achieve enlightenment."

    ~ Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang on Essays on Mind and Matter

  5. #45
    Well all nonsense need to go.
    Now muslims and jews have one thing in common, they both think God will save them so they can still meet in big groups without worry. Fanatic people all around the world is the same...

  6. #46
    Is it the time? Well I think it's not the time...right now our priority is trying to swimming out of this pool of shit we all are.

    Once this is over we have a pending discussion not just with China...with the whole world about some food practices and let's not be naive, there's not a slight chance we got to complete erradicate those practices because some of them are poverty related: it's way easier to preserve food if food is alive and can preserve itself.

    But we must try and try with force and every-single-one of those practices that are culture related must be , not banned, crushed. I don't mean:"Here's your fine"...no ,no. I mean:"Here's your 5 years in jail penalty". We must treat it the way we treat drug trafficking because i have zero problems with some retard somewhere thinking the root of estratifella buaca ( plant) mixed with cinammon would cure his erectile disfunction but i DO have a problem with someone thinking eating pangolin dick would cure the same erectile disfunction.

    The result of the former is a flacid penis and the result of the latter is a flacid penis and millions dying.

    No,really let's be serious here:

    1997 H1N5 lesson learned: none
    2003 SARS lesson learned: none
    2009 H1N1 lesson learned: none
    2012 MERS lesson learned: none
    2019 CO19 lesson learned: ?

    We have been warned several times. This is not something that Science haven't been warning for decades so there's two options ( some think there's more....but there isn't).

    Option A. Complete and absolute banning of those practices. There will be outbreaks even if we do this but it's a complete different situation dealing with a wildfire caused by a lightning than dealing with a legion of kids playing with lighters in the forest.

    Option B. Do nothing. Consequence?

    20XX H1N450 Way higher mortality than SARS and MERS. Higher incubation time and more contagious that Covid-19. 30% of the world population is dead.

    Is this an sci-fi scenario? NO, IT ISN'T. We thought Covid-19 was an sci-fi scenario and now we are living in that. This is not a matter of IF it's a matter of WHEN if we do nothing ( just listen to epidemiologists) and I really would like everyone undestand that we ,as a civilization are gonna survive covid-19 ( well those who do...) there's gonna be nightmarish health and economic consequences but this won't be Mad Max.

    Play with fire,do nothing until we get ourselves a beautiful H1N450 and then we have a real Mad Max. With those parameters presented (30% of mortality rate) civilization is just overthrown and we find ourselves fighting over the proverbial last tuna can and everything we have buit is turn into smithereens.

    If you travel back in time to Summer 2019 and tell me 1/3rd of the world population would be on lockdown now I would have laughed too...but we don't laugh anymore,do we?

    These animal relaed practices are one of the bigger existencial threats humanity faces ( for the last time not doomsaying: just listening to the experts) so the ones who don't adhere to a firm policy should be sanctioned a way that makes the ones at Cuba and Iran looks like a joke and every commerce with those nations should be outlawed asap. If you think in the economic repercussions just wait a moment to see the economic repercussions we have now....let's compare to see what's worth.

    No really , the part of the traditional chinese "medicine" (at the lack of a better term) that is dangerous need to be erradicated ( and as I said,not fines..the way we treat someone with 1 pound of heroine).

    A meteorite does not allow us to choose.A supervolcano does not allow us to choose. A fast gamma burst localized at this planet does not allow us to choose.

    We have the luxury of being able to choose: we have option A.

    Let's see if we deserve to survive.

  7. #47
    Indeed people buying that shit is fucking dumb, animals should not suffer because of some made up garbage products.
    Do you hear the voices too?

  8. #48
    Scarab Lord Thekri's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    4,730
    Quote Originally Posted by PrimiOne View Post
    Once this is over we have a pending discussion not just with China...with the whole world about some food practices and let's not be naive, there's not a slight chance we got to complete erradicate those practices because some of them are poverty related: it's way easier to preserve food if food is alive and can preserve itself.
    Totally true. I was thinking about mentioning that China is just phase 1, because it isn't poverty or food related, it is a backwards medical practice pushed by the state. It isn't the only offender, it is just the biggest one, and the easiest to deal with.

    The second biggest offender is African Bush Meat markets, and those will be nightmarish to deal with. They also have huge ecological impacts, and have brought us such delightful diseases as Ebola, and probably AIDS. However they are fundamentally different then Chinese Medicine markets, in that they exist at a very grassroots level, with a lot of impoverished people relying on them for food. They are tied to the chinese medicinal market economically, as Chinese buyers often visit them to acquire exotic animal parts, but they would also survive without that financial support, just as a subsistence market.

    I really don't have a ready solution to the Bush Meat problem though. That would require an extremely complex program of enforcement and economic development in sub-Saharan Africa, which could have many other benefits, but is a truly massive effort. The Chinese issue can, and should, be solved by massive international sanctions and pressure on the Chinese government to end the practice, as it is almost exclusively the governments fault this exists.
    "We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine." DJT- Jan 22, 2020
    "And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done." DJT- Feb 26, 2020
    “It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” DJT- Feb 27, 2020

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Thekri View Post
    Sort of. Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) all capitalized, is an invention of the CCP, who created and named it. The source material for that project was traditional medicinal practices that included some of the same elements, but was far less standardized, and differed wildly based on locale and culture.
    fair enough.
    I don't really have a problem with all the traditional healing techniques from China. I think they are mostly quackery, but harmless enough. I have a problem with the industrialized, cohesive, state-sponsored version of quackery.
    Depends. Things like cupping has a solid enough basis, and even acupuncture has a minimal scientific background.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post

    The non-vaxxers didn't CAUSE that person's immunocompromization. That is a personal weakness and shortcoming of that person. That's just a fact. Anyone that relies on other people for anything is at the behest of those other people, no exceptions, because you aren't owed a damn thing by other people. Yes, even in a society.
    .
    Allow me to point out the problem with that logic.

    Hardened career criminal shows up to your house, proceeds to murder you and your entire family then lays claim to all your assets.

    He didn't cause your lack of sufficient preparation to prevent that. Your inability to defend yourself and your family is not his fault.

    You shouldn't rely on other things such as... Laws to protect you.

    Or you are driving home from work and a drunk driver rams you and puts you in a wheelchair. He didn't cause you to have to get in that car that day and drive on the same road as him, you shouldn't have relied on him not being a drunk shit head. Etc etc.

    You might think these examples are somehow different, but they really aren't. It's just you are drawing an arbitrary line between where you personally define personal responsibility ends and begins.

    It has been said endlessly, but remains as valid as ever.

    If you think the above are good model for society, find yourself a failed state and move there. Make sure you let us know how it went.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    fair enough.

    Depends. Things like cupping has a solid enough basis, and even acupuncture has a minimal scientific background.
    Hmmmmm. No.

    Cupping is a particularly dangerous and utterly pointless form of quackery with absolutely no scientifically proven utility.

    Same applies to acupuncture with the distinction that as long as basic hygiene standards are applied it is mostly harmless, still utterly pointless with absolutely no scientifically proven utility of any kind.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    It doesnt destroy the land to bury styrofoam 25 feet below the ground
    Today Obama once again kneeled at the altar of environmental naziism and hurt this once great country. He has now banned all drilling in the Atlantic Ocean

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihalik View Post
    Hmmmmm. No.

    Cupping is a particularly dangerous and utterly pointless form of quackery with absolutely no scientifically proven utility.

    Same applies to acupuncture with the distinction that as long as basic hygiene standards are applied it is mostly harmless, still utterly pointless with absolutely no scientifically proven utility of any kind.
    Cupping is a form of soft tissue mobilization. Moving soft tissue around to help with circulation is scientifically proven.

    The points in acupuncture releases endorphins when stimulated, and certain electronic equipments can pick up increased electric activity from it. These principles have been picked up and taught as acupressure by accredited physical therapy schools.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    Cupping is a form of soft tissue mobilization. Moving soft tissue around to help with circulation is scientifically proven.

    The points in acupuncture releases endorphins when stimulated, and certain electronic equipments can pick up increased electric activity from it. These principles have been picked up and taught as acupressure by accredited physical therapy schools.
    When it comes to cupping...you literally just described a massage, which doesn't require any equipment, bleeding, bruising, fire, skin damage, and will not cause infections, burns or bruising. If your "soft tissue mobilization" requires any of the before mentioned things...you are either into some kinky shit or you came upon a new legal defense for battery.

    No, seriously. There's absolutely no, and I mean no scientific evidence on the actual benefits of cupping, and from a medical stand point it's just too unsafe for whatever you are trying to do.

    And regarding acupuncture.

    "Certain electronic equipment" and "increased electric activity" is utterly meaningless bullshit. Also, what exactly does the "release of endorphins" mean in this context? What amounts? Why? What is it supposed to treat? What are its supposed effects?

    Link to me, peer reviewed studies that recommend either cupping or acupuncture as a form of therapy to treat any condition.

    "Accredited physical therapy school" is about is meaningful as "accredited elf spotting school".

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_Elf_School

    At least the latter doesn't pray on people's medical conditions.
    Last edited by Mihalik; 2020-03-25 at 05:11 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    It doesnt destroy the land to bury styrofoam 25 feet below the ground
    Today Obama once again kneeled at the altar of environmental naziism and hurt this once great country. He has now banned all drilling in the Atlantic Ocean

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihalik View Post
    When it comes to cupping...you literally just described a massage, which doesn't require any equipment, bleeding, bruising, fire, skin damage, and will not cause infections, burns or bruising. If your "soft tissue mobilization" requires any of the before mentioned things...you are either into some kinky shit or you came upon a new legal defense for battery.

    No, seriously. There's absolutely no, and I mean no scientific evidence on the actual benefits of cupping, and from a medical stand point it's just too unsafe for whatever you are trying to do.

    And regarding acupuncture.

    "Certain electronic equipment" and "increased electric activity" is utterly meaningless bullshit. Also, what exactly does the "release of endorphins" mean in this context? What amounts? Why? What is it supposed to treat? What are its supposed effects?

    Link to me, peer reviewed studies that recommend either cupping or acupuncture as a form of therapy to treat any condition.

    "Accredited physical therapy school" is about is meaningful as "accredited elf spotting school".

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_Elf_School

    At least the latter doesn't pray on people's medical conditions.
    Cupping doesn’t require any of those things you listed.

    As for acupressure, I can go dig through my old notes once I get home from work.

    Physical therapy is a valid western medicine practice that can be found in pretty much all hospitals and medical facilities. So yeah, it’s very different from your fucking elf school. So next time you break a bone or some shit, please don’t visit a physical therapist for your rehab. Or better yet, go to one and tell them physical therapy is like elf watching.

  14. #54
    Scarab Lord Thekri's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    4,730
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihalik View Post
    When it comes to cupping...you literally just described a massage, which doesn't require any equipment, bleeding, bruising, fire, skin damage, and will not cause infections, burns or bruising. If your "soft tissue mobilization" requires any of the before mentioned things...you are either into some kinky shit or you came upon a new legal defense for battery.

    No, seriously. There's absolutely no, and I mean no scientific evidence on the actual benefits of cupping, and from a medical stand point it's just too unsafe for whatever you are trying to do.

    And regarding acupuncture.

    "Certain electronic equipment" and "increased electric activity" is utterly meaningless bullshit. Also, what exactly does the "release of endorphins" mean in this context? What amounts? Why? What is it supposed to treat? What are its supposed effects?

    Link to me, peer reviewed studies that recommend either cupping or acupuncture as a form of therapy to treat any condition.

    "Accredited physical therapy school" is about is meaningful as "accredited elf spotting school".

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_Elf_School

    At least the latter doesn't pray on people's medical conditions.
    Totally agreed with all, but it really isn't the point of what needs to get stopped here. As far as I know, the practice of cupping or acupuncture does not lead to massive global epidemics that kill thousands or millions of people.

    Dismantling the concepts of TCM that lead to use of animal parts as medicine may also end the practices of cupping and acupuncture, in which case nothing of great value will be lost, but if they survive, I frankly don't care. The focus of the international effort on China has to be squarely centered on removing the "Medical" belief that ingesting animal parts is a valid medical practice. If a lot of other pseudo-scientific mumbo-jumbo gets dragged down with it, so much the better.

    I honestly don't have the medical background to have a rooted opinion on cupping, acupuncture, meditation, etc. I am highly skeptical of them, but as long as they don't threaten anything, I am willing to leave them alone.
    "We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine." DJT- Jan 22, 2020
    "And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done." DJT- Feb 26, 2020
    “It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” DJT- Feb 27, 2020

  15. #55
    Bloodsail Admiral Magical Mudcrab's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    All across Nirn.
    Posts
    1,232
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    As for chinese medicine, somethings related to herbal medicine has been present in testing a cure for this coronavirus.
    This sounds like BS propaganda to make it seem as though traditional medicine has some form of legitimacy. I've not seen any real consideration of traditional medicine in fighting COVID, though I'm open to being wrong; I've only snake oil peddlers attempting to peddle a very dangerous snake oil.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    So yeah, it’s very different from your fucking elf school.
    You're right, they are different. Unlike the effects of traditional medicine, elves are real.
    Last edited by Magical Mudcrab; 2020-03-25 at 05:40 PM.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    As for chinese medicine, somethings related to herbal medicine has been present in testing a cure for this coronavirus.
    There are plenty of herbs that have proven efficacious for a variety of ailments. You know what they're called? Medicine. And usually what we do once we know it works is isolate the active chemical and synthesize it for manufacture.

    There's no such thing as "western medicine" and "eastern medicine" and "herbal medicine" and "traditional medicine." There's "medicine," and there's "shit that has not been proven to work."

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    This sounds like BS propaganda to make it seem as though traditional medicine has some form of legitimacy. I've not seen any real consideration of traditional medicine in fighting COVID, though I'm open to being wrong; I've only snake oil peddlers attempting to peddle a very dangerous snake oil.
    Can Chinese Medicine Be Used for Prevention of Corona Virus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)? A Review of Historical Classics, Research Evidence and Current Prevention Programs.

    RESULTS:
    The use of CM to prevent epidemics of infectious diseases was traced back to ancient Chinese practice cited in Huangdi's Internal Classic (Huang Di Nei Jing) where preventive effects were recorded. There were 3 studies using CM for prevention of SARS and 4 studies for H1N1 influenza. None of the participants who took CM contracted SARS in the 3 studies. The infection rate of H1N1 influenza in the CM group was significantly lower than the non-CM group (relative risk 0.36, 95% confidence interval 0.24-0.52; n=4). For prevention of COVID-19, 23 provinces in China issued CM programs. The main principles of CM use were to tonify qi to protect from external pathogens, disperse wind and discharge heat, and resolve dampness. The most frequently used herbs included Radix astragali (Huangqi), Radix glycyrrhizae (Gancao), Radix saposhnikoviae (Fangfeng), Rhizoma Atractylodis Macrocephalae (Baizhu), Lonicerae Japonicae Flos (Jinyinhua), and Fructus forsythia (Lianqiao).

    CONCLUSIONS:
    Based on historical records and human evidence of SARS and H1N1 influenza prevention, Chinese herbal formula could be an alternative approach for prevention of COVID-19 in high-risk population. Prospective, rigorous population studies are warranted to confirm the potential preventive effect of CM.


    --------------

    Lets not throw away any thing that has the potential to be lifesaving medicines because of bias... just yet...

  18. #58
    Bloodsail Admiral Magical Mudcrab's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    All across Nirn.
    Posts
    1,232
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Can Chinese Medicine Be Used for Prevention of Corona Virus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)? A Review of Historical Classics, Research Evidence and Current Prevention Programs.

    RESULTS:
    The use of CM to prevent epidemics of infectious diseases was traced back to ancient Chinese practice cited in Huangdi's Internal Classic (Huang Di Nei Jing) where preventive effects were recorded. There were 3 studies using CM for prevention of SARS and 4 studies for H1N1 influenza. None of the participants who took CM contracted SARS in the 3 studies. The infection rate of H1N1 influenza in the CM group was significantly lower than the non-CM group (relative risk 0.36, 95% confidence interval 0.24-0.52; n=4). For prevention of COVID-19, 23 provinces in China issued CM programs. The main principles of CM use were to tonify qi to protect from external pathogens, disperse wind and discharge heat, and resolve dampness. The most frequently used herbs included Radix astragali (Huangqi), Radix glycyrrhizae (Gancao), Radix saposhnikoviae (Fangfeng), Rhizoma Atractylodis Macrocephalae (Baizhu), Lonicerae Japonicae Flos (Jinyinhua), and Fructus forsythia (Lianqiao).

    CONCLUSIONS:
    Based on historical records and human evidence of SARS and H1N1 influenza prevention, Chinese herbal formula could be an alternative approach for prevention of COVID-19 in high-risk population. Prospective, rigorous population studies are warranted to confirm the potential preventive effect of CM.


    --------------

    Lets not throw away any thing that has the potential to be lifesaving medicines because of bias... just yet...
    These researchers are from the Beijing University of Chinese Medicine -- it's literally a university that specializes in teaching traditional Chinese medicine. It's like going to a naturopath and asking if naturopathy works. It's not a reliable source.

    I had a long blurb about the methodology, reliability of sources, and what the authors - these pseudointellectual research LARPers - should do to themselves for intentionally spreading misinformation that could lead to people dying, but redacted it to spare getting banned. So I will restrict it to this: people are free to believe who they want to believe, but are you going to believe people that fucking mention the replenishment of qi (tonify qi) as a valid method of protecting yourself from COVID.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  19. #59
    As I said, I'm not going to toss anything that has a chance...Further testing obviously needed.
    As such...just as everything else.
    I found it annoyingly amusing that it was finally said that they're getting blood samples from people that have recovered to see if they can derive a serum from their anti-bodies. This was recently mentioned...why did that take so long? Likely because it's "old school" medicine.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Nelinrah View Post
    We do that in the west too. Just look at how lobsters are cooked.
    We don't know if lobsters actually feel pain tho

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Can Chinese Medicine Be Used for Prevention of Corona Virus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)? A Review of Historical Classics, Research Evidence and Current Prevention Programs.

    RESULTS:
    The use of CM to prevent epidemics of infectious diseases was traced back to ancient Chinese practice cited in Huangdi's Internal Classic (Huang Di Nei Jing) where preventive effects were recorded. There were 3 studies using CM for prevention of SARS and 4 studies for H1N1 influenza. None of the participants who took CM contracted SARS in the 3 studies. The infection rate of H1N1 influenza in the CM group was significantly lower than the non-CM group (relative risk 0.36, 95% confidence interval 0.24-0.52; n=4). For prevention of COVID-19, 23 provinces in China issued CM programs. The main principles of CM use were to tonify qi to protect from external pathogens, disperse wind and discharge heat, and resolve dampness. The most frequently used herbs included Radix astragali (Huangqi), Radix glycyrrhizae (Gancao), Radix saposhnikoviae (Fangfeng), Rhizoma Atractylodis Macrocephalae (Baizhu), Lonicerae Japonicae Flos (Jinyinhua), and Fructus forsythia (Lianqiao).

    CONCLUSIONS:
    Based on historical records and human evidence of SARS and H1N1 influenza prevention, Chinese herbal formula could be an alternative approach for prevention of COVID-19 in high-risk population. Prospective, rigorous population studies are warranted to confirm the potential preventive effect of CM.


    --------------

    Lets not throw away any thing that has the potential to be lifesaving medicines because of bias... just yet...
    I'll admit that I am by no means a medic or anything like that but this sees super sus to me

    For prevention of COVID-19, 23 provinces in China issued CM programs. The main principles of CM use were to tonify qi to protect from external pathogens, disperse wind and discharge heat, and resolve dampness

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •